How good is bought traffic?

[Paul Markham]

And good for what?

Common sense tells us no one sells you a $10 bill for $9.

And the ease it takes to put up a site, TGP, Tube, Paysite must make people woder why would a traffic man send perfectly good traffic before he's extracted everything of value from it.

Obviously traffic that's been put through the mill by one person, can be sold to another for them to put through the mill. But how much is left?

If a person with traffic has any sense he will of put it through his system, filtering and monetizing it to the maximum he can. Then is he better off sending this traffic to sponsors he affiliated to or selling it off at 1,000s of clicks for a $1.

Have you had success with bought traffic and what did you use it for?

[Paul Markham]

So far 3 no's and one yes. What was the yes doing with it?

[DamianJ]

Paul cannot convert brokered traffic. Shocker.

[Evil Chris]

Paul, where have you been the past 2 weeks?

This thread covers the topic in great detail including comments from major traffic brokers.

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=1017470

[CaptainHowdy]

[DamianJ]

Originally Posted by Evil Chris

Paul, where have you been the past 2 weeks?

He's really busy pretending to write a pdf. Poor thing.

[HardlinkSells]

Originally Posted by DamianJ

He's really busy pretending to write a pdf. Poor thing.

I wrote a pdf and made a website in two days www.flipsniper.com

[seeandsee]

i buy directly form niche domains and i check do they have "hot thumbs (exact thumbs sending traffic from their pages)" If they have, i make custom landing page with content same or similar as thumb represent, that burst $$$ ROI

[C H R I S]

I personally make money from bought traffic as an affiliate and my cliients do quite well with traffic they buy from me.

One caveat, not all segments will make money with bought traffic - Cams, Dating, Herbal, etc can do very well and make a great ROI. Paysites not so much unless your very experienced converting this type of traffic.

[C H R I S]

Originally Posted by Evil Chris

Paul, where have you been the past 2 weeks?

This thread covers the topic in great detail including comments from major traffic brokers.

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=1017470

Good point Chris.

[u-Bob]

*sigh* not again.... *sigh*

Obviously designers have no clue what they are doing otherwise they wouldn't sell their designs, but use them to launch their own sites instead.

Obviously coders have no clue what they are doing otherwise they would only work on their own scripts.

Obviously content producers have no clue what they are doing or how to shoot content that sells, otherwise they would only use their content to start their own paysites.

Obviously hosting companies have no clue what they are doing otherwise they would use their servers to host their own network of sites.

Obviously writers have no clue what they are doing or they wouldn't be selling blogposts but posting to their own blogs instead.

Obviously bakers have no clue what they are doing and their bread must taste like shit otherwise they wouldn't be selling it and eat it all themselves instead.

Why do designers do what they do? Why do coders do what they do? Why do writers do what they do? why do content producers do what they do?.... because they've found something they are good at and/or like doing and because they've decided to specialize in that.

In economics there such a thing as the devision of labor and the law of the comparative advantage.

Generating traffic = a specific skill.
Converting traffic = another skill.

Somehow certain people in this industry seem to have come to think that converting traffic, selling a product is easy. That it doesn't require any work. They seem to think that the only thing you need is traffic... once you've got some traffic, you throw it at some paysite and *BANG* instant profit.

What they fail to realize is that converting traffic requires hard work. Of course you can throw some *cold* traffic at a paysite link and hope for a signup. But understanding and analyzing your traffic, creating the right kind of landing pages, preselling, finding the right sponsor for the right kind of traffic,... all requires work and time.

So it makes perfect sense for people (with larger networks of sites) to sell (part of) their traffic at a price that is lower than what they would have been able to make from it if they sent it to *the right* sponsor because that way they have more time to focus on what they are good at/prefer doing.

[Evil Chris]

u-Bob, thanks for the novella but you fail to mention that the majority of the traffic for sale/being re-sold is mainly the shit that could not be converted at the front door. So it's shipped off and re-packaged with a nice big red bow and pricetag.

No offence, but your comparisons to coders and designers and even bakers is weak.

[2intense]

100% noooooooooooooooo

[C H R I S]

Originally Posted by u-Bob

*sigh* not again.... *sigh*

Obviously designers have no clue what they are doing otherwise they wouldn't sell their designs, but use them to launch their own sites instead.

Obviously coders have no clue what they are doing otherwise they would only work on their own scripts.

Obviously content producers have no clue what they are doing or how to shoot content that sells, otherwise they would only use their content to start their own paysites.

Obviously hosting companies have no clue what they are doing otherwise they would use their servers to host their own network of sites.

Obviously writers have no clue what they are doing or they wouldn't be selling blogposts but posting to their own blogs instead.

Obviously bakers have no clue what they are doing and their bread must taste like shit otherwise they wouldn't be selling it and eat it all themselves instead.

Why do designers do what they do? Why do coders do what they do? Why do writers do what they do? why do content producers do what they do?.... because they've found something they are good at and/or like doing and because they've decided to specialize in that.

In economics there such a thing as the devision of labor and the law of the comparative advantage.

Generating traffic = a specific skill.
Converting traffic = another skill.

Somehow certain people in this industry seem to have come to think that converting traffic, selling a product is easy. That it doesn't require any work. They seem to think that the only thing you need is traffic... once you've got some traffic, you throw it at some paysite and *BANG* instant profit.

What they fail to realize is that converting traffic requires hard work. Of course you can throw some *cold* traffic at a paysite link and hope for a signup. But understanding and analyzing your traffic, creating the right kind of landing pages, preselling, finding the right sponsor for the right kind of traffic,... all requires work and time.

So it makes perfect sense for people (with larger networks of sites) to sell (part of) their traffic at a price that is lower than what they would have been able to make from it if they sent it to *the right* sponsor because that way they have more time to focus on what they are good at/prefer doing.

One of the better posts on this subject.

Some people think if they throw traffic at any site it will magically turn into piles of gold- these people are usually sadly dissapointed. Occasionally people will get lucky on the first try but usually not.


When it comes down to it it can take alot of time and effort to optimize landing pages and choose the right type of traffic.

[sadiedazzle]

I don't think bought traffic works well.

Sadie

[GTS Mark]

Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy

LOL! Spot on!

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by C H R I S 2.0

One of the better posts on this subject.

Some people think if they throw traffic at any site it will magically turn into piles of gold- these people are usually sadly dissapointed. Occasionally people will get lucky on the first try but usually not.


When it comes down to it it can take alot of time and effort to optimize landing pages and choose the right type of traffic.

What's to stop the traffic sellers doing that?

I can see how it works, just wondering if the traffic seller hasn't put it through his optimized landing pages after choosing the right traffic.

[Klen]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

What's to stop the traffic sellers doing that?

I can see how it works, just wondering if the traffic seller hasn't put it through his optimized landing pages after choosing the right traffic.

There are people who doing that,but for that most of lazy people like me it's easier just to sell traffic and dont bother with it at all.

[Agent 488]

Originally Posted by Evil Chris

u-Bob, thanks for the novella but you fail to mention that the majority of the traffic for sale/being re-sold is mainly the shit that could not be converted at the front door. So it's shipped off and re-packaged with a nice big red bow and pricetag.

No offence, but your comparisons to coders and designers and even bakers is weak.

not always true. some people just have boatloads of traffic and prefer to sell it and make money off sure sure thing instead of testing sponsors, banner, lps etc.

what u-bob said was right. traffic generation and conversion are two different things. some people do either or both.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Agent 488

not always true. some people just have boatloads of traffic and prefer to sell it and make money off sure sure thing instead of testing sponsors, banner, lps etc.

what u-bob said was right. traffic generation and conversion are two different things. some people do either or both.

Originally Posted by KlenTelaris

There are people who doing that,but for that most of lazy people like me it's easier just to sell traffic and dont bother with it at all.

No wonder this business is in the crapper.

People too lazy or not able to do something elementary. Must be as 1,000s of affiliates seem to manage it.

I learnt very early on to squeeze the most out of my work. Sell it to every possible format as possible. God lesson to learn.

[thommy]

well, let´s resume what happens to trafficprices in the last 10 years:

there was a time, when traffic was expensive and convertable.
but like often in this biz, webmasters where hungry to get more from less.

they clicked banners them self
they asked all there familiy to click
they have created software that clicks automaticly
they found ways to lead ONE user to 100 sites and let him make a click on everyone
they gave for free what other people like to sell, just to get traffic and got feeded by the same people, who spend money for ADVERTISE on sites, where their own product is given for free.

look around how many billions and trillions of clicks are sold every day in the net and bring that in relation with the sum of surfers in the net. if you just take a 5 dollar calculator, you will find out, that every single one of these surfers might have clicked at about 5.000 banners per day.

and here we are at the top of the bullshitlist.

when somebody talks about "good" porntraffic he will not find it at the big tubesites, because the audience there is there because they don´t WANT TO PAY.

if you search for traffic in any smaller ressources, you end up at the trafficbrokers. and NONE of them sells own traffic. they have thousands and thousands of small webmasters what easily can fake up 100 clicks per month to 1000 clicks. even without clever techniques.

if there would be one doing it - no problem at all.
but 99% of them are working this way and here is the point where this traffic is worth less than a kick in the ass.

that game will continue, what means prices are dropping, webmasters will need more fake clicks to keep the revenew and they will produce it and prices will drop.......

we are at the moment in a new traffic solution what will be available in 2 or 3 month.
there we have eliminated all those components what I have explained here and I am quite shure, that we will be successful with it.


greetings

thommy

[Agent 488]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

No wonder this business is in the crapper.

People too lazy or not able to do something elementary. Must be as 1,000s of affiliates seem to manage it.

I learnt very early on to squeeze the most out of my work. Sell it to every possible format as possible. God lesson to learn.

as usual the point goes right over your head.

[czarina]

I've tried it in the past, way back, and it was OK but only made a couple of sales from it

[Evil Chris]

Originally Posted by thommy

well, let´s resume what happens to trafficprices in the last 10 years:

there was a time, when traffic was expensive and convertable.
but like often in this biz, webmasters where hungry to get more from less.

they clicked banners them self
they asked all there familiy to click
they have created software that clicks automaticly
they found ways to lead ONE user to 100 sites and let him make a click on everyone
they gave for free what other people like to sell, just to get traffic and got feeded by the same people, who spend money for ADVERTISE on sites, where their own product is given for free.

look around how many billions and trillions of clicks are sold every day in the net and bring that in relation with the sum of surfers in the net. if you just take a 5 dollar calculator, you will find out, that every single one of these surfers might have clicked at about 5.000 banners per day.

and here we are at the top of the bullshitlist.

when somebody talks about "good" porntraffic he will not find it at the big tubesites, because the audience there is there because they don´t WANT TO PAY.

if you search for traffic in any smaller ressources, you end up at the trafficbrokers. and NONE of them sells own traffic. they have thousands and thousands of small webmasters what easily can fake up 100 clicks per month to 1000 clicks. even without clever techniques.

if there would be one doing it - no problem at all.
but 99% of them are working this way and here is the point where this traffic is worth less than a kick in the ass.

that game will continue, what means prices are dropping, webmasters will need more fake clicks to keep the revenew and they will produce it and prices will drop.......

we are at the moment in a new traffic solution what will be available in 2 or 3 month.
there we have eliminated all those components what I have explained here and I am quite shure, that we will be successful with it.


greetings

thommy

Thank you Thommy!

[JustDaveXxx]

Originally Posted by thommy

well, let´s resume what happens to trafficprices in the last 10 years:

there was a time, when traffic was expensive and convertable.
but like often in this biz, webmasters where hungry to get more from less.

they clicked banners them self
they asked all there familiy to click
they have created software that clicks automaticly
they found ways to lead ONE user to 100 sites and let him make a click on everyone
they gave for free what other people like to sell, just to get traffic and got feeded by the same people, who spend money for ADVERTISE on sites, where their own product is given for free.

look around how many billions and trillions of clicks are sold every day in the net and bring that in relation with the sum of surfers in the net. if you just take a 5 dollar calculator, you will find out, that every single one of these surfers might have clicked at about 5.000 banners per day.

and here we are at the top of the bullshitlist.

when somebody talks about "good" porntraffic he will not find it at the big tubesites, because the audience there is there because they don´t WANT TO PAY.

if you search for traffic in any smaller ressources, you end up at the trafficbrokers. and NONE of them sells own traffic. they have thousands and thousands of small webmasters what easily can fake up 100 clicks per month to 1000 clicks. even without clever techniques.

if there would be one doing it - no problem at all.
but 99% of them are working this way and here is the point where this traffic is worth less than a kick in the ass.

that game will continue, what means prices are dropping, webmasters will need more fake clicks to keep the revenew and they will produce it and prices will drop.......

we are at the moment in a new traffic solution what will be available in 2 or 3 month.
there we have eliminated all those components what I have explained here and I am quite shure, that we will be successful with it.


greetings

thommy

WOW! Great info.

Thanx

[Chosen]

[Klen]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

No wonder this business is in the crapper.

People too lazy or not able to do something elementary. Must be as 1,000s of affiliates seem to manage it.

I learnt very early on to squeeze the most out of my work. Sell it to every possible format as possible. God lesson to learn.

I am not getting that impression from you,since you still dont have your own program on aff program based like nats or mpa3 which is best way to squeeze more money out of your traffic.

[alias]

Program owners can make it work, affiliates not so much unless the offer is unique.

Paul, a lot of programs don't pay foreigners and/or everyone. What is elementary about working for that?

[u-Bob]

Go through any thread started on GFY by a noob asking for the best way to get started in this business. In every one of those threads there will be a couple of people suggesting the noob start with a niche he personally likes. Why? because you need to understand your target audience and what it likes.

There are a couple of niches that I personally understand pretty well. I know what converts, which sites convert, which sites retain, which sites convert US traffic, which sites convert EU traffic, which sites don't convert EU traffic, which sites update,... I know and recognize old content that has been circulating in those niches for a long time, I recognize fresh content. I recognize sites with nonexclusive filler content and I recognize new content. I recognize tours that will work with certain types of traffic and I recognize tours that probably won't work... Because I know all these things, I'm able to convert traffic in these niches. I have my own sites to generate this traffic and I also buy traffic in these niches. Yes even the so called worthless tube traffic.

Now, I also have sites in lots of other niches. All my sites make money, but these sites have ratios that are way worse than those of my sites in my main niches. Why? because i don't take the time to constantly monitor, adjust and improve my campaigns. Some of those sites will have banners linking to a paysite that hasn't been updated in 2 years, so retention will be lower. Some of those sites will not have the latest/newest/freshest FHGs with the latest *must see content in that niche* on them. Could I improve those ratios? Yes, but there's only 24hrs in a day so that isn't really an option. I doubt any one can know and understand every (micro)niche out there.

I focus on the things I'm good at and the things I enjoy doing. I generate traffic, I rape Google, I focus on the few niches I personally like and I do pretty good in those niches. My sites in those other niches still make money, but to increase their earnings I simply sell part of their traffic instead of investing more time into them. Time I use to do what I'm good at.

So yes I sell traffic. and yes, i buy traffic. I buy about 5 times the amount of traffic I sell. Why? because it's good business...

hmmm, looks like I just explained the basic economic principle of opportunity cost

[Django]

Originally Posted by CaptainHowdy

[BAKO]

Buying traffic is so 90's lol

[Choker]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

And good for what?

Common sense tells us no one sells you a $10 bill for $9.

And the ease it takes to put up a site, TGP, Tube, Paysite must make people woder why would a traffic man send perfectly good traffic before he's extracted everything of value from it.

Obviously traffic that's been put through the mill by one person, can be sold to another for them to put through the mill. But how much is left?

If a person with traffic has any sense he will of put it through his system, filtering and monetizing it to the maximum he can. Then is he better off sending this traffic to sponsors he affiliated to or selling it off at 1,000s of clicks for a $1.

Have you had success with bought traffic and what did you use it for?

If your content is so great why have you sold it to other people all these years? Why not make your own paysite, your own print magazines etc. The fact that you even made this poll shows what a out of touch person you really are. Here I'll throw you a bone. My grandaughter loves afghan blankets. How much to knit me a few? Serious offer here.

[tigermtb]

We buy traffic from our network. It converts.
My only wish is that I had more time to do this instead of selling it to others.

I see a lot of people come in with a hundred bucks or so, don't optimize, and they quickly give up. Those who have a good product/offer and spend a little time on it, usually make out well. Its just like TGP spots a few years back .. some were making a killing and others, well, not.

[GARY LEE]

I have bought traffic before and had an extremely shitty ROI. I contribute it to a couple of facts like first my sites are paysites and I think the traffic thing would work better if I had a tube where these people didn't have to break out their credit card. The second thing is something I hate to admit but I probably fall into the chris 2.0 category. I am self taught in that I live in a small rural area with no porn and a mentality of if it doesn't eat hay nobody knows how to fix it. I would love to sit down with someone and take a class in traffic. I have tried to get to a bigger studio in L.A. and pick their brains and ask some stupid questions. Traffic being one thing and I've never used an affiliate ever. I know that sounds dumb for someone whose done it my way and survived just fine but I think we could all use more traffic.

[r0bman]

I've posted my stats from Rudester to several traffic threads showing our success with brokered traffic from TrafficShop.com and FpcTraffic.com.
When i first started, i used to spend small amounts and every time got different results, sometimes winning, sometimes losing... not enough to justify spending a big chunk of my hard earned cash on it.
Then i added all my little spends together, along with the results and realized i was ahead... doesn't matter if your only ahead by a little, it's all about quantity from then on.... and that's where brokers come into their own!
If you have a site that is unique and offers something rather that the wall of a paysite... you can make it work!

The question you should really be asking is "How good is your site?"

[BAKO]

I have a magic join page and sales just come in like its 1999

[Exo-Geoffrey]

Buying traffic isn't a hobby, it's a real job. Once advertisers understand that and set up a strategy they are profitable.
Affiliates and programs using good marketing, good products and the right billing are usually very successful. At least with our traffic.