lawyer refuses to tell court how profitable bit torrent settlements are

[gideongallery]

http://torrentfreak.com/lawyer-refus...ts-are-110905/

another scumbag lawyer getting hauled over the coals for the pay up or else extortion scheme.

hopefully he will get the same ultimate punishment as his UK counter part.

[Babaganoosh]

Maybe someday you will create something worth stealing and all of this will finally make sense to you.

[Gambrinus]

better yet he gets ass cancer.

[L-Pink]

Talking about scumbags ...

.

[garce]

Originally Posted by Babaganoosh

Maybe someday you will create something worth stealing and all of this will finally make sense to you.

Boom shaka laka!

[NetHorse]

Originally Posted by Babaganoosh

Maybe someday you will create something worth stealing and all of this will finally make sense to you.

Thread backfire.

[halfpint]

Sorry had to throw this in lololol




COPIED from http://fightcopyrighttrolls.com/

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by Babaganoosh

Maybe someday you will create something worth stealing and all of this will finally make sense to you.

1. my stuff is impossible to steal because i understand the principles of the new marketplace

2. are you actually trying to claim that the value of your content, justifies commit extortion.

How unethical do you have to be to claim that deserve the right to commit extortion simply because your content has value (because you have been granted a monopoly by the government BTW).

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

1. my stuff is impossible to steal because i understand the principles of the new marketplace

2. are you actually trying to claim that the value of your content, justifies commit extortion.

How unethical do you have to be to claim that deserve the right to commit extortion simply because your content has value (because you have been granted a monopoly by the government BTW).

Get the fuck out of here.

.

[V_RocKs]

who gives a shit?

[My Pimp]

It must be very proftiable .

[SmokeyTheBear]

in gideons world asking a thief to pay for what he stole is extortion lol

[harvey]

[Due]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

1. my stuff is impossible to steal because i understand the principles of the new marketplace

2. are you actually trying to claim that the value of your content, justifies commit extortion.

How unethical do you have to be to claim that deserve the right to commit extortion simply because your content has value (because you have been granted a monopoly by the government BTW).

It's called fair usage of billable hours.

The courts should have no insight in how much profit or loss a lawyer have, it's unrelated to the law

P.S. it's not extortion if its legal & the law got no ethics :-)

[Captain Kawaii]

Originally Posted by Babaganoosh

Maybe someday you will create something worth stealing and all of this will finally make sense to you.

Don't hold your breath. People like him understand only the concept of parasite.

[Biggy2]

It's dumb to get one-sided in any way on this. Piracy isn't cool. Mass suing people isn't really cool either.

1. Piracy is inherently wrong, it's theft.
2. Suing people outside of their home jurisdiction isn't right, especially if they have no real contacts there. You aren't giving them a fair chance to defend themselves.

Solution:
3. Sue less people, in their home jurisdiction, with local lawyers. Then jurisdiction issues and issues like these go out the window. Some people in adult are already doing it and establishing a network of attorneys to handle the cases all around the country (http://www.xbiz.com/news/138200). Tough to make that argument when someone goes into a district, shows the court all the IPs are from within that district, you just obviously can't sue as many people.

If you end up on the wrong side of that suit, it's actually way more scarier for the end user. If you could choose to be a defendant, would you rather be one defendant of 5000 defendants, or one defendant of 30 defendants, in a specialty lawsuit just for you and a few others. You get way more attn when there's less defendants, and your price of settlement probably shoots up. You bet your ass these lawyers will go thru the process, win the judgements, and start seizing assets. And you bet they are going to look at who you are, and dedicate a whole lot more attention just to you.

While TorrentFreak will look at it and boast, what they don't realize is because piracy is inherently wrong, the solutions will be come more solid and concrete on how to properly do it, and to those who support piracy, that's a bad thing long-term for piracy users.

[kane]

Originally Posted by Biggy2

It's dumb to get one-sided in any way on this. Piracy isn't cool. Mass suing people isn't really cool either.

1. Piracy is inherently wrong, it's theft.
2. Suing people outside of their home jurisdiction isn't right, especially if they have no real contacts there. You aren't giving them a fair chance to defend themselves.

Solution:
3. Sue less people, in their home jurisdiction, with local lawyers. Then jurisdiction issues and issues like these go out the window. Some people in adult are already doing it and establishing a network of attorneys to handle the cases all around the country (http://www.xbiz.com/news/138200). Tough to make that argument when someone goes into a district, shows the court all the IPs are from within that district, you just obviously can't sue as many people.

If you end up on the wrong side of that suit, it's actually way more scarier for the end user. If you could choose to be a defendant, would you rather be one defendant of 5000 defendants, or one defendant of 30 defendants, in a specialty lawsuit just for you and a few others. You get way more attn when there's less defendants, and your price of settlement probably shoots up. You bet your ass these lawyers will go thru the process, win the judgements, and start seizing assets. And you bet they are going to look at who you are, and dedicate a whole lot more attention just to you.

While TorrentFreak will look at it and boast, what they don't realize is because piracy is inherently wrong, the solutions will be come more solid and concrete on how to properly do it, and to those who support piracy, that's a bad thing long-term for piracy users.

The jurisdictional issue is interesting. In the article is says: "The jurisdiction issue was another sticking point. Judge Zimmerman had trouble with Siegel?s claims that being in a BitTorrent swarm subjects people to nationwide jurisdiction. "

I have a feeling we will eventually get a ruling as to whether or not this is something that can occur. A variation of it happens in adult for obscenity crimes. They choose a district that is conservative and gives them the best chance of success then they order the products or access the websites from that location so that the trial can be held there regardless of where the original server is or where the company in question's office is.

If you are illegally downloading material and you are connecting to computers/networks all over the nation it would seem reasonable that you might be held accountable in any one of those different areas.

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

in gideons world asking a thief to pay for what he stole is extortion lol

no asking someone to pay you money BEFORE you prove they are a thief is EXTORTION

ask the lawyer if he was willing to pay $1000 for every dollar they asked for if the download was not an infringement (either because it was fair use, or because it was authorized or none of their content was downloaded -- see honeypotting which this scumbag lawyer is doing BTW) and see how many of them would agree.

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by kane

The jurisdictional issue is interesting. In the article is says: "The jurisdiction issue was another sticking point. Judge Zimmerman had trouble with Siegel?s claims that being in a BitTorrent swarm subjects people to nationwide jurisdiction. "

I have a feeling we will eventually get a ruling as to whether or not this is something that can occur. A variation of it happens in adult for obscenity crimes. They choose a district that is conservative and gives them the best chance of success then they order the products or access the websites from that location so that the trial can be held there regardless of where the original server is or where the company in question's office is.

If you are illegally downloading material and you are connecting to computers/networks all over the nation it would seem reasonable that you might be held accountable in any one of those different areas.

there is a huge difference between the two

in the case of obscenity charges the transaction does happen between those two points
the only transaction you are being prosecuted for is the one that falls within that jurisdiction

in the copyright case, they are arguing you deserve more then just actual lost sale damage, because your DISTRIBUTING to all the other states

it would only be equal if they took all your sales world wide, and charged you with 1 count of obscenity for every single sale, because you made 1 sale in a conservative jurisdiction.

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

no asking someone to pay you money BEFORE you prove they are a thief is EXTORTION

No it's not. A demand letter is the FIRST step in any lawsuit for damages.

Your knowledge of the legal steps in a lawsuit is pathetic.

.

[kane]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

there is a huge difference between the two

in the case of obscenity charges the transaction does happen between those two points
the only transaction you are being prosecuted for is the one that falls within that jurisdiction

in the copyright case, they are arguing you deserve more then just actual lost sale damage, because your DISTRIBUTING to all the other states

it would only be equal if they took all your sales world wide, and charged you with 1 count of obscenity for every single sale, because you made 1 sale in a conservative jurisdiction.

I didn't read it that way, but I guess it is open to interpretation. The way I read it the lawyer wants to say, "if the guy connected to the swarm and there is a seeder in Pittsburgh we can charge him in Pittsburgh." Whereas the normal idea is that you have to charge the guy where he lives.

If the lawyers wins his point he would be able to file suits that would be even more difficult to defend yourself against. If the choice was to pay $500 to settle or be forced to appear in some city on the other side of the country to defend yourself you would likely just settle because it would be cheaper than traveling there.

With obscenity it has been said that technically your site is distributing to every place that can access it. So in theory they could prosecute you in Florida and then in Utah and then in Texas etc. Typically these cases are either brought on by local authorities who prosecute in their jurisdiction or by the feds who choose the jurisdiction that will best suit them.

[kane]

Originally Posted by L-Pink

No it's not. A demand letter is the FIRST step in any lawsuit for damages.

Your knowledge of the legal steps in a lawsuit is pathetic.

.

Very true. It is just like a collection letter. They send you a demand for payment and tell you if you don't owe this money or you feel there is an error of some sort you can contest it.

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by L-Pink

No it's not. A demand letter is the FIRST step in any lawsuit for damages.

Your knowledge of the legal steps in a lawsuit is pathetic.

.

really and how do they KNOW who to send the letter to if it the FIRST step

idiot collect evidence is the first step, they just jump to the second step to early

[kane]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

really and how do they KNOW who to send the letter to if it the FIRST step

idiot collect evidence is the first step, they just jump to the second step to early

Semantics. They collect enough evidence to believe you are guilty of the crime and send you a letter. They don't just draw your name out of a hat at random. They have some kind of evidence that leads them to believe that you did this.

Whether this is the first or second step doesn't matter. They are suing you. Now you get to respond to that suit by either settling, defending yourself or contacting them and coming to some kind of an agreement with them.

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by kane

Very true. It is just like a collection letter. They send you a demand for payment and tell you if you don't owe this money or you feel there is an error of some sort you can contest it.

really try send a collection letter to someone who doesn't have a business relationship to you

you might want to ask the guys who sent copies of dry cleaning bills to 1000s of restaurants claiming that the waiter spill something on them.

their in jail for the crime of mail fraud.

[L-Pink]

gideon, you are a parasite and an idiot.

.

[gideongallery]

Originally Posted by kane

Semantics. They collect enough evidence to believe you are guilty of the crime and send you a letter. They don't just draw your name out of a hat at random. They have some kind of evidence that leads them to believe that you did this.

really name one lawyer who will agree to pay 1,000 for every dollar they asked for if the person isn't actually guilty (fair use, authorized, or not really an infringement-- see honeypotting)

none of these lawyers believe they have enough proof yet, if they did they would have no problem agreeing to this

Whether this is the first or second step doesn't matter. They are suing you. Now you get to respond to that suit by either settling, defending yourself or contacting them and coming to some kind of an agreement with them.

it make a huge difference if you never collected enough evidence to establish guilt in YOUR ACTUAL FIRST STEP.

[kane]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

really name one lawyer who will agree to pay 1,000 for every dollar they asked for if the person isn't actually guilty (fair use, authorized, or not really an infringement-- see honeypotting)

none of these lawyers believe they have enough proof yet, if they did they would have no problem agreeing to this

Is this another of your dream scenarios like wanting people to put all of their content in the public domain in order to get you to prove that you sent an email?

Here is how many lawyers works. It is really very simple. IF they think they have enough evidence that they have a good shot at winning the case they will pursue it. Many cases don't really get going until they get into court and get into the discovery phases. Many cases don't have enough evidence that they can prove guilt before they step into a court room. They believe they have a good case and they use the system to help build that case.

it make a huge difference if you never collected enough evidence to establish guilt in YOUR ACTUAL FIRST STEP.

Again, semantics. As I state above most lawyers don't have a slam dunk case when they walk into the first hearing on case. They use the discovery phases to further develop their cases.

They clearly have done some research because, as I said above, they don't just pull your name out of a hat and randomly send you a letter. Somehow you ended up on their radar.

[kane]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

really try send a collection letter to someone who doesn't have a business relationship to you

you might want to ask the guys who sent copies of dry cleaning bills to 1000s of restaurants claiming that the waiter spill something on them.

their in jail for the crime of mail fraud.

Exactly. So you think these lawyers are going to risk their freedom in order to make a few dollars? Look, I'm not saying that there are not dirty, scumbag lawyers. All I am saying is that these guys did some kind of research and have some kind of evidence that makes them believe that the person they are sending the letter to is guilty.

Here is how it relates to a collection agency. Several years ago I went to the doctor. The doctor sent me a bill and I forgot to pay it. Eventually they sent me a letter telling me if I didn't pay they would send me to a collection agency. I then paid the bill, but my check crossed in the mail with their contacting a collection agency. A few weeks later I get a letter from a collection agency demanding payment. I contact them and explain it has been paid. They put me on hold, checked to see that it was taken care of and everything is fine.

The collection agency had enough evidence to believe I owed that money so they contacted me demanding payment. When I explained that I didn't they fixed the problem and everything was fine.

[L-Pink]

Just another idiot sheep in the cult of free-tards.

.

[TheSquealer]

Shocking news. Settlements usually have confidentiality clauses, preventing either party from discussing the terms of the settlement.

Dumbass.



Nice quote from the article: “freedom from the tyranny of having to pay for content.”

[DamianJ]

Originally Posted by kane

Exactly. So you think these lawyers are going to risk their freedom in order to make a few dollars? Look, I'm not saying that there are not dirty, scumbag lawyers. All I am saying is that these guys did some kind of research and have some kind of evidence that makes them believe that the person they are sending the letter to is guilty.

In the UK, where we pioneered this whole extortion scam, they lawyers are facing being barred and have gone bankrupt.

They have no evidence. They have an IP address. This has already been ruled in the US as not evidence.

They don't want to go to trial.

They just want to get as much money as possible. Lightspeed even called it his retirement fund.

I wish it had something to do with trying to curb piracy, but I don't believe it has. Certainly the cases in the UK, after the companies emails were made public, it was VERY CLEAR they were just cunts trying to scam people.

It's a revenue generator.

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by TheSquealer

Nice quote from the article: ?freedom from the tyranny of having to pay for content.?

.

[seeandsee]

how did they made numbers they ask for, based on what...

[iamtam]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

http://torrentfreak.com/lawyer-refus...ts-are-110905/

another scumbag lawyer getting hauled over the coals for the pay up or else extortion scheme.

hopefully he will get the same ultimate punishment as his UK counter part.

foad.

apologist for thieves. theo, it is ban hammer time for this obvious idiot, flamer, and certainly not someone in the porn business.

does your mommy know you are on the computer you little toad?

[12clicks]

I think someone in this thread is squealing like a stuck thief

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

1. my stuff is impossible to steal because i understand the principles of the new marketplace

2. are you actually trying to claim that the value of your content, justifies commit extortion.

How unethical do you have to be to claim that deserve the right to commit extortion simply because your content has value (because you have been granted a monopoly by the government BTW).

Impossible to steal because you don't do anything.

Everything can be stolen or copied and used again by someone other than the original customer.

I remember you saying you write programs. Programs can be opened up and changed so anyone can use them. Then copied and distributed for free. That's why you refuse to show us what you do. You know if you do someone here will hand you your ass on a plate.

However if you believe you have the ultimate un breakable code, then it shows your attitude towards stealing others work. You sit safe in your box, while stealing other peoples work.

[bronco67]

Originally Posted by Babaganoosh

Maybe someday you will create something worth stealing and all of this will finally make sense to you.

Exactly.

[bronco67]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

1. my stuff is impossible to steal because i understand the principles of the new marketplace

My stuff...what does that mean? Stuff that you took from others and claim as yours? Show us something you've created and can truly claim as yours.

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by bronco67

My stuff...what does that mean? Stuff that you took from others and claim as yours? Show us something you've created and can truly claim as yours.

Yea gideon lets see what your "stuff" is and the measures you've taken to make it "impossible" to steal!

.

[barcodes]

Originally Posted by bronco67

My stuff...what does that mean? Stuff that you took from others and claim as yours? Show us something you've created and can truly claim as yours.

https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=826136
Describes what he does and how he makes a living from it.

[PornoMonster]

Do you think someone settles that isn't guilty?

[will76]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

http://torrentfreak.com/lawyer-refus...ts-are-110905/

another scumbag lawyer getting hauled over the coals for the pay up or else extortion scheme.

hopefully he will get the same ultimate punishment as his UK counter part.

[MaDalton]

and i thought everyone had learned not to discuss with gideon

[bronco67]

Originally Posted by barcodes

https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=826136
Describes what he does and how he makes a living from it.

Ok, so then he's just a leech that doesn't really produce anything.

[L-Pink]

Originally Posted by bronco67

Ok, so then he's just a leech that doesn't really produce anything.

He "borrows" things

.

[TheSquealer]

Originally Posted by L-Pink

He "borrows" things

.

He "timeshifts" things.

[SmokeyTheBear]

Originally Posted by gideongallery

no asking someone to pay you money BEFORE you prove they are a thief is EXTORTION

no it isn't. It happens in court cases across the world everyday.. It also happens preemptively everyday..

Shoplifting is a prime example. If you walk out of a store without paying , they will ask you to either pay for what you took or call the cops and have you arrested. No court case , no proof.. this is basically the same thing..

[TheSquealer]

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

no it isn't. It happens in court cases across the world everyday.. It also happens preemptively everyday..

Shoplifting is a prime example. If you walk out of a store without paying , they will ask you to either pay for what you took or call the cops and have you arrested. No court case , no proof.. this is basically the same thing..

Gideon is an idiot. But you are not even close with your analogy. To be more accurate, its not different than any other civil suit. You claim damages, demand compensation, propose a settlement meeting/mediation etc or you file the lawsuit. That's not extortion, that is the legal process.

[harvey]

fiddy facepalms