Does the rest of the world understand what a Mormon is?

[Mutt]

I have a feeling most of the world outside the US and many Americans think 'Mormon' aka The Church of Jesus Christ of Later Day Saints is some flavor of Christianity like 'Anglican', 'Baptist', 'Roman Catholic'

um ..........

Read below:

The Mormon movement began with "the prophet" Joseph Smith, Jr. in the year 1820. Joe (as he was known) was born to some rather strange parents in 1805. His mother, Lucy, was involved in occult practices and visions, while his father, Joseph, Sr., consumed much time with imaginary treasure digging (including the booty of Captain Kidd).

According to Mormon writings (Pearl of Great Price, Joseph Smith - History 1:1-25), on a day in 1820, Joe was praying in the woods when he received a vision from God the Father and Jesus. It was revealed to Joe that the church was in apostasy and he was the chosen one to launch a new dispensation.

Being unwilling to drop his current occupation of money-digging with his father (while using "peep stones" and "divining rods"), Joe put his "calling" on hold for three years. Then, according to his own account (Pearl of Great Price, Joseph Smith - History 1:29-54), he was paid a bedside visit by the angel Moroni in 1823. Moroni, who professed to be the glorified son of a man named Mormon (who had been dead 1400 years), told Joe about a book of golden plates which contained "the fulness of the everlasting Gospel." This book was said to have been buried at Cumorah Hill, near Palmyra, New York, some 1400 years earlier by the man named Mormon. Four years later (1827), Joe supposedly dug up the golden plates along with a gigantic pair of spectacles which he called "the Urim and Thummim." The spectacles were for translating the hieroglyphics on the plates. With the help of his only legal wife and a friend named Oliver Cowdery, Joe translated the plates and published the Book of Mormon in 1830. Later that same year, Joe, his wife, his brothers (Hyrum and Samuel), and Cowdery established the "Church of Jesus Christ," which is known today as the "Church of Jesus Christ of Later Day Saints."

The Book of Mormon contains many plagiarisms of the King James English (at least 25,000 words). This is strange since the plates were supposed to have been in the ground many centuries before the King James Bible was completed in 1611! The Book of Mormon also contains many errors such as claims of elephants in the Western Hemisphere and advanced metal producing capabilities in America before 400 A.D. (See Walter Martin's Kingdom of the Cults for a fine study in the errors of the Mormon Bible)

The Mormons, under Smith's command, turned out to be a rough bunch. Joe was a polygamist with at least twenty- seven wives (some say over 60 wives). The whole gang left New York for Ohio, and then moved to Missouri. The Missouri governor ran them out of the state, so they settled in Nauvoo, Illinois, and built the state's largest city. In 1844, Joe and Hyrum were thrown in jail. Then an angry mob stormed the jail and murdered them both. Naturally, this "martyrdom" insured the perpetual reverence of the great "prophet" Joseph Smith.

The "church" then split. The Smith family headed for Independence, Missouri and started what is now the "Recognized Church of Jesus Christ of Later Day Saints." However, the majority of Smith's followers chose Brigham Young as their new captain.

To escape U.S. laws, Young led the Mormons from Nauvoo to Salt Lake City in 1847 (which then belonged to Mexico). For the next thirty years, Young and his "saints" laid the foundation stones of the Mormon cult.

Little known to most Mormons, Young was a rather rough and ruthless character. In 1857, he commanded Bishop John D. Lee to murder a wagon train of over one hundred helpless non-Mormon immigrants. Twenty years later Lee was convicted and executed by the U.S. Government. Young escaped punishment, and his role in the Mountain Meadows Massacre has escaped the Mormon history books.

Young spent most of his "ministry" dodging the law to continue the immoral practice of polygamy. At the time of his death in 1877, Young had seventeen wives and fifty-six children.

Today the Mormon church is administrated by its "General Authorities." These authorities consist of the "First Presidency," the "Counsel of Twelve Apostles," the "First Quorum of the Seventy" and its presidency, the "Presiding Bishoprick," and the "Patriarch of the Church."

Male Mormons over twelve years of age are divided into priesthoods. The Aaronic order is the lesser priesthood, and the Melchizedek order is the higher.

The church is divided into thousands of "wards" and "stakes," with over 2000 branches and 180 missions, and over 5,000,000 members.

Mormons are very missionary-minded people, with over 26,000 active missionaries. However, much of this missionary army consists of young men and women in their early twenties who must serve two years in missionary work while supporting themselves.

The Mormon people of today are highly respected in our society, but there is nothing respectable about their doctrines.

[wehateporn]

Plenty of porn sales come from Utah (according to my stats)

Met a few of them at the front door, they're rather well brainwashed.

[DVTimes]

In the uk its a popular religion.

I have relatives in it.

At Leeds uni you often find some good looking mormons from the usa trying to convert people as they pass by.

[javinder_mn]

I owe my education on world religion to trey park and matt stone. the OP seems to be pretty much word for word the 'all about mormons' episode

[spazlabz]

interesting read but I knew much of it previously (thank you discovery channel) but I kind of take issue with the author for this line

Young spent most of his "ministry" dodging the law to continue the immoral practice of polygamy.

thats a pretty harsh judgment of polygamy and an opinion, not a fact. Has no place in a factual article.

[BladeZ]

Use google translate,it is a newspaper article in Dutch


http://www.trouw.nl/tr/nl/5091/Relig...-burgers.dhtml

[ottopottomouse]

[2012]

[Paul Markham]

In Czech we know what they are.

They are people who have come to bring Christianity to this old Communist State where the church has been ignored for too long. They want to bring us back the Jesus and ask us to pay to be rescued.

They don't do very well here as the young see through them and the old are devout Christians.

But they still tell us we have forgotten God. bunch of conmen. Romney fits in well.

[BlackCrayon]

the real history of the mormon church is pretty fucked up but most mormons have no clue about it. they are christian, however. they do believe jesus was the son of god and died for sins blah blah. i should also mention their history is by farrrr less fucked up and bizarre than whats in the bible. its just that its been around much longer and is much more widely accepted so its not 'crazy' but its much more violent and fucked up.

[Phoenix]

i dont know if this is true...but someone told me if you get visited by mormons and you ask them to help you say...paint your house....they will...as long as you discuss their church the whole time..lol

i dont know...but im just saying someone could try it out

[Relentless]

Mormon views are no more ridiculous than any other organized religion. The problem is people who think they have a magical invisible friend... Not which magical friend they think they have.

[xNetworx]

Originally Posted by Relentless

Mormon views are no more ridiculous than any other organized religion. The problem is people who think they have a magical invisible friend... Not which magical friend they think they have.

Pretty much

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by Mutt

Joe supposedly dug up the golden plates along with a gigantic pair of spectacles which he called "the Urim and Thummim." The spectacles were for translating the hieroglyphics on the plates.

[Forest]

Originally Posted by javinder_mn

I owe my education on world religion to trey park and matt stone. the OP seems to be pretty much word for word the 'all about mormons' episode

one of my favorite south park episodes

[HelmutKohl]

How Christians can support a Mormon candidate if the part of the Mormon Cult is a belief in John Smith's heresy like:

- There are many Gods
- God the Father has a wife, through whom he procreates spirit children.
- God the Father is an exalted man with a body of flesh and bones.
- Rejected - Father, Son and Holy Spirit
Just to mention a few... Welcome to the world of Romney, a true gift of GOP to USA 2012

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by Relentless

Mormon views are no more ridiculous than any other organized religion. The problem is people who think they have a magical invisible friend... Not which magical friend they think they have.

I agree with you to a point but the ancient religions we're most familiar with - Christianity, Islam, Judaism - are understandable, they were created at a time when people had little understanding of the physical world/universe and they were broadly supported by the most intelligent of them - of course there was no more proof/evidence for what was written in their holy scriptures than what this Joe Smith wrote in his but being that he wrote his fairy tale in the 19th century not the 1st century, plagiarized from the King James Bible, makes him a kook.

Mormons are the equivalent of Scientologists.

[CyberHustler]

Religion has nothing to do with anything... all religions are as credible as Mormonism.

[Dirty F]

Originally Posted by DVTimes

In the uk its a popular religion.

I have relatives in it.

At Leeds uni you often find some good looking mormons from the usa trying to convert people as they pass by.

You make the average mormon look like a perfectly sane person.

[Relentless]

Originally Posted by Mutt

I agree with you to a point but the ancient religions we're most familiar with - Christianity, Islam, Judaism - are understandable, they were created at a time when people had little understanding of the physical world/universe and they were broadly supported by the most intelligent of them - of course there was no more proof/evidence for what was written in their holy scriptures than what this Joe Smith wrote in his but being that he wrote his fairy tale in the 19th century not the 1st century, plagiarized from the King James Bible, makes him a kook.Mormons are the equivalent of Scientologists.

So, very old magical invisible friends are more real than newer magical invisible friends? Just making sure I understand your point.

I have a problem with the magical invisible part, not the friend or the old/new part.

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by Mutt

I agree with you to a point but the ancient religions we're most familiar with - Christianity, Islam, Judaism - are understandable, they were created at a time when people had little understanding of the physical world/universe and they were broadly supported by the most intelligent of them - of course there was no more proof/evidence for what was written in their holy scriptures than what this Joe Smith wrote in his but being that he wrote his fairy tale in the 19th century not the 1st century, plagiarized from the King James Bible, makes him a kook.

Mormons are the equivalent of Scientologists.

what does it matter though? all religions are either based on bs stories passed down or ones totally made up. anyone who buys whats in the bible book or mormon or whatever religious doctrine might as well be labeled a kook too.

[Just Alex]

Evangelical Christians & baptists are very much anti-Mormon and consider it cult.

[sperbonzo]

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

what does it matter though? all religions are either based on bs stories passed down or ones totally made up. anyone who buys whats in the bible book or mormon or whatever religious doctrine might as well be labeled a kook too.

The fact that Roman Catholics practice ritual cannibalism every Sunday has always been an interesting thing to me. (that and keeping priceless artifacts stolen from all over the planet hidden in the vatican is an interesting one also, but I digress)


I agree with you blackcrayon, even though I'm a practicing (more or less), Jew. I recognize that anyone outside of my religion has legitimate reason to find it kooky and wacky.

Anyone that thinks that just because a certain religion is LESS WACKY just because it is older is just being silly.

When Judaism came along, Hinduism had been around for 4 thousand years.
When Christianity came along, Judaism had been around for 1 to 2 thousand years.
When Islam came along Christianity had been around for 600 years.



Compared to Hinduism, all of the other religions, (according to the logic of the OP), are just cults and their prophets are kooks.....

the whole concept that this is somehow less legitimate than other religions seems like just plain old prejudice and arrogance to me. I personally hate that in religion.



(p.s. when christianity first came along, it was considered a fringe group and a cult by the "establishment")

.

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

I agree with you blackcrayon, even though I'm a practicing (more or less), Jew.

why are you a practicing Jew? you either believe the Hebrew Bible, which makes you a kook by your own admission or you observe/obey Jewish religious laws disregarding that you don't really believe those laws were given to Moses by God - which is also kooky.

do you go to a synagogue on Yom Kippur? do you believe God is listening?

i'm fine with the argument that Judaism, Christianity, Hinduism are no better/worse than Mormonism and Scientology - which is Relentless' position.

my point was that the ancient religions gained hold at a time when the world was ignorant to science - much easier to believe in fantastical stories when you have no idea that you're on a round rock travelling around the sun over and over and over in a vast universe of stars. once a religion takes hold, and survives generation by generation, a mystique builds, tradition builds, and people don't even ask why anymore.

and i will bet that's why Sperbonzo is a practicing Jew - tradition and family.

[dillonaire]

the only thing I know about Mormons is they wear magic underpants. other than that I dont know and dont care.

[TisMe]

Originally Posted by gamelinkjeff

the only thing I know about Mormons is they wear magic underpants. other than that I dont know and dont care.

Did Mormons steal that from Paul's Magic Join Links?

He's old enough for this to have happened

[ilnjscb]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

i dont know if this is true...but someone told me if you get visited by mormons and you ask them to help you say...paint your house....they will...as long as you discuss their church the whole time..lol

i dont know...but im just saying someone could try it out

Ok, that sounds like a pretty good idea I'll give it a

discuss their church the whole time

discuss their church the whole time

discuss their church the whole time

.... nah, I think I'll paint my own house

[Rob]

From the best religious movie, ever!

[MaDalton]

Buddhism is the only "religion" (even though its not really a religion) i can accept - mostly because it's more a concept of life and doesnt rely on imaginary gods

the rest is just nonsense to me

[Just Alex]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

The fact that Roman Catholics practice ritual cannibalism every Sunday has always been an interesting thing to me. (that and keeping priceless artifacts stolen from all over the planet hidden in the vatican is an interesting one also, but I digress)

.

What are you talking about? Cannibalism?

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by Just Alex

What are you talking about? Cannibalism?

communion

[Just Alex]

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

communion

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_of_Christ

Shit, does practicing Jew want to talk about symbolism in Torrah?
Or perhaps about stealing from others? Like the Palestinian land and their settlements?

[baddog]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

The fact that Roman Catholics practice ritual cannibalism every Sunday has always been an interesting thing to me.

Oh man . . . .

[sarettah]

Originally Posted by Mutt

when you have no idea that you're on a round rock travelling around the sun over and over and over in a vast universe of stars.

Wha, wha, what????



.

[HelmutKohl]

How do all Evangelical Christians feel about such revelations Romney believes in:

According to Mormon theology, Jesus is the literal son of god and his goddess wife. He was born through physical sexual relations with Mary and Jesus was not born with any involvement of the Holy Spirit
According to Mormon theology, Jesus was married and had wives
According to Mormon theology, Jesus was a polygamist
In Mormon theology, Jesus' church ceased to exist and Joseph Smith came to restore it.

What can I tell- Hallelujah- brothers and sisters Christians ?? Go Romney Go, save America!!

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by sarettah

Wha, wha, what????



.

i'm no Carl Sagan i admit but isn't that the gist of it - we're on a tiny rock orbiting around a star/sun in a universe of trillions of stars?

[RebelR]

Originally Posted by Rob

From the best religious movie, ever!

Heresy I say.. this is the only true religion.. you shoe'ists are all alike. Follow the Gourd!

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by Just Alex

What are you talking about? Cannibalism?

Christian symbolism jeez

[helterskelter808]

Originally Posted by Mutt

of course there was no more proof/evidence for what was written in their holy scriptures than what this Joe Smith wrote in his but being that he wrote his fairy tale in the 19th century not the 1st century, plagiarized from the King James Bible

You might have a point if everyone else had stopped believing in the Bible/God by the 19th century.

Originally Posted by Just Alex

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_of_Christ

Shit, does practicing Jew want to talk about symbolism in Torrah?
Or perhaps about stealing from others? Like the Palestinian land and their settlements?

How about the Talmud?

Sanhedrin 54b. A Jew may have sex with a child as long as the child is less than nine years old.
Sanhedrin 55b. A Jew may marry a three year old girl (specifically, three years "and a day" old).
Menahoth 43b-44a. A Jewish man is obligated to say the following prayer every day: Thank you God for not making me a gentile, a woman or a slave.
Gittin 57b. Claims that four billion Jews were killed by the Romans in the city of Bethar. Gittin 58a claims that 16 million Jewish children were wrapped in scrolls and burned alive by the Romans.

O.K. to Cheat Non-Jews
Jews Have Superior Legal Status
Jews May Steal from Non-Jews
Jews May Rob and Kill Non-Jews
Jews May Lie to Non-Jews
Non-Jews are not Human

Israelis annually take part in a national pilgrimage to the grave of Simon ben Yohai, to honor this rabbi who advocated the extermination of non-Jews.

And more: http://www.revisionisthistory.org/talmudtruth.html

[DWB]

Originally Posted by 2012

Sounds legit.

[sarettah]

Originally Posted by Mutt

i'm no Carl Sagan i admit but isn't that the gist of it - we're on a tiny rock orbiting around a star/sun in a universe of trillions of stars?

Heresay.

I am the center of my universe. It all revolves around me. Dammit.

There are no stars, there are just little holes in my head where the light and sometimes shows through. If it is a starless night then I must be wearing a hat.







.

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by 2012

thanks - enjoyable and informative, reminded me of the cheapo bad cartoons like Hercules i watched as a kid.

let's put it this way, it would be far less disconcerting if Mitt Romney was a shape shifting alien reptile than a Mormon.

[sarettah]

Originally Posted by Mutt

Mitt Romney was a shape shifting alien reptile than a Mormon.

Johnny Clips in 5,4,3,2,1....


;p

[georgeyw]

Originally Posted by RebelR

Heresy

[sarettah]

Originally Posted by pornopete

Can somebody please explain the whole magic underwear thing????

A temple garment (also referred to as garments, or Mormon underwear)[2] is a type of underwear worn by a vast majority of adherents of the Latter Day Saint movement, after they have taken part in the Endowment ceremony. Garments are worn both day and night and are required for any previously endowed adult to enter a temple.[3] The undergarments are viewed as a symbolic reminder of the covenants made in temple ceremonies and are seen as either a symbolic or literal source of protection from the evils of the world.[4]

The garment is given as part of the washing and anointing portion of the endowment. Today, the temple garment is worn primarily by members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) and by members of some Mormon fundamentalist churches. Adherents consider them to be sacred and not suitable for public display. Anti-Mormon activists have occasionally publicly displayed or defaced temple garments to advance their opposition to the LDS Church.[5]

Temple garments are sometimes derided as "magic underwear" by non-Mormons, but Mormons view this terminology to be misleading and derogatory

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temple_garment


Google is your friend

.

[Just Alex]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

Christian symbolism jeez

No shit. You think Tyrone?

[sperbonzo]

Originally Posted by helterskelter808

How about the Talmud?


And more: http://www.revisionisthistory.org/talmudtruth.html

Sorry but that is typical crap from people that don't know anything about Judaism. Why don't you ask a Rabbi? The Talmud is basically a written history of the arguments of Rabbi's over a millennia. It is the equivalent of the written record of the all of the opinions of all of the supreme court justices on all of the cases over the last 200 years, (except the Talmud is covering a far longer period of time and more issues). Think about the Supreme court opinions that supported slavery, etc..... over time, now think about the crazy opinions that can be written over almost a thousand years. You can find in it almost every side of every argument about how to interpret the Torah, and some of those Rabbi's were even more wacky than some of the supreme court judges have been.... It is simply all of these discussions about what the torah means written down, and you can find opinions that contradict every other one within it.




Just in case you were interested in the actual "truth".



I'm not saying that Judaism isn't wacky, from an outside perspective, but your tack about the Talmud is not correct.



.

[Imortyl Pussycat]

i wanted to post asking if that "getting their own planet when they die" thing is true but thought i should at least google it first so i didn't say something totally ignorant. here is what i found: http://www.mormondna.org/mormon-beli...lanet-die.html

the part about "we believe we can become Gods"......disturbing

[Just Alex]

Originally Posted by sperbonzo

Sorry but that is typical crap from people that don't know anything about Judaism. Why don't you ask a Rabbi? The Talmud is basically a written history of the arguments of Rabbi's over a millennia. It is the equivalent of the written record of the all of the opinions of all of the supreme court justices on all of the cases over the last 200 years, (except the Talmud is covering a far longer period of time and more issues). Think about the Supreme court opinions that supported slavery, etc..... over time, now think about the crazy opinions that can be written over almost a thousand years. You can find in it almost every side of every argument about how to interpret the Torah, and some of those Rabbi's were even more wacky than some of the supreme court judges have been.... It is simply all of these discussions about what the torah means written down, and you can find opinions that contradict every other one within it.




Just in case you were interested in the actual "truth".



I'm not saying that Judaism isn't wacky, from an outside perspective, but your tack about the Talmud is not correct.



.

And your reference of cannibalism and Catholics comes from very well educated jew, right? Grow the fuck up!

[Dirty Dane]

It are an moron with a extra m.