The Real Truth About the Palestinian/Israeli Conflict - Mark Twain

[Mutt]

Never saw this before, but it's the truth, there never was a Palestinian homeland, what is now Israel was a desolate wasteland NOBODY wanted until the Jews returned, these people called Palestinians were an invention of Arabs, sacrificial lambs condemned to live in poverty and war by their Arab brothers who expelled them from their own lands.

Be that as it may, Israel and the Palestinians who by now really are Palestinians need to make peace and would do so if not for Arab influence and their hatred of the Jews.



"There is not a solitary village throughout its whole extent (valley of Jezreel, Galilea); not for thirty miles in either direction... One may ride ten miles hereabouts and not see ten human beings. For the sort of solitude to make one dreary, come to Galilee... Nazareth is forlorn... Jericho lies a mouldering ruin... Bethlehem and Bethany, in their poverty and humiliation... untenanted by any living creature... A desolate country whose soil is rich enough, but is given over wholly to weeds... a silent, mournful expanse... a desolation... We never saw a human being on the whole route... Hardly a tree or shrub anywhere. Even the olive tree and the cactus, those fast friends of a worthless soil had almost deserted the country... Palestine sits in sackcloth and ashes... desolate and unlovely...".

- Mark Twain, "The Innocents Abroad", 1867 -

[ilnjscb]

Originally Posted by Mutt

Never saw this before, but it's the truth, there never was a Palestinian homeland, what is now Israel was a desolate wasteland NOBODY wanted until the Jews returned, these people called Palestinians were an invention of Arabs, sacrificial lambs condemned to live in poverty and war by their Arab brothers who expelled them from their own lands.

Be that as it may, Israel and the Palestinians who by now really are Palestinians need to make peace and would do so if not for Arab influence and their hatred of the Jews.



"There is not a solitary village throughout its whole extent (valley of Jezreel, Galilea); not for thirty miles in either direction... One may ride ten miles hereabouts and not see ten human beings. For the sort of solitude to make one dreary, come to Galilee... Nazareth is forlorn... Jericho lies a mouldering ruin... Bethlehem and Bethany, in their poverty and humiliation... untenanted by any living creature... A desolate country whose soil is rich enough, but is given over wholly to weeds... a silent, mournful expanse... a desolation... We never saw a human being on the whole route... Hardly a tree or shrub anywhere. Even the olive tree and the cactus, those fast friends of a worthless soil had almost deserted the country... Palestine sits in sackcloth and ashes... desolate and unlovely...".

- Mark Twain, "The Innocents Abroad", 1867 -

It seems to be true that the arab states hate the jews, but you'd have to be an idiot not to recognize the damage that the treatment palestenian people, who as you correctly state, are sort of a construct, has done to Israel's image.

Construct or not, children are being harmed, and as you say there needs to be peace. In effect the people are being punished for the belligerence of arab states safe in their own borders.

Many many jews agree with you.

[Barry-xlovecam]

That is a quaint historical "misconception."

The people called the Palestinian People are not a homogeneous people.

Some are indigenous people like the Samaritans, with whom I personally, with a group, met and listened as well as spoke with the High Priest of the Samaritans in 1982 near Mount Gerizarim (הַר גְּרִיזִּים or جبل جرزيم). The Samaritans are a small minority of Palestinian People, neither Arab nor Jew, that live in the Nablus area. see:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Gerizim

There are also Christian populations within the Palestinian People many dating back to the times following Christ.

Most Palestinian Christians nowadays see themselves as culturally and linguistically Arab Christians with ancestors dating back to the first followers of Christ. They claim descent from a mixture of Jews and Gentiles who converted to Christianity in the first few centuries AD,[16] Romans, Ghassanids, Byzantines, and Crusaders. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palest...arly_histor y

Certain irony in that ...

When the Orient Express was built c.1880 there was a mass migration of Arab labors to Palestine (the north coastal area of Israel now) and Lebanon for the purpose of logging the forests for railroad ties. Many of the non-indigenous Palestinian people descend from that immigration.

I have been in the Jezreel valley and Megiddo it is surrounded by a mountainous area with mainly shrub.

"The Jezreel Valley is a large fertile plain and inland valley south of the Lower Galilee region in Israel and West Bank in the Palestinian territories. Wikipedia"

The Jezreel valley, near Megiddo, is prophesied to be the site of the place of Armageddon. The final war "the armies Gog and Magog" Ezekiel 25-48, Book of Revelation, and even the Qur'an: In Surat Al-Kahf ("The Cave", 18:83–98) and Surat Al-Anbiya ("The Prophets", 21:96–100). Maybe you can begin to understand the basis of the religious claims each people; Arab, Christian and Jew attach to these lands.

In 1852 the American writer Bayard Taylor traveled across the Jezreel Valley, which he described in his 1854 book 'The Lands of the Saracen; or, Pictures of Palestine, Asia Minor, Sicily and Spain' as: "one of the richest districts in the world."[10] Laurence Oliphant, who visited the 'Akko Sanjak' valley area in 1887, then a subprovince of the 'Beirut Wilayah',[11] wrote that the Valley of Esdraelon (Jezreel) was "a huge green lake of waving wheat, with its village-crowned mounds rising from it like islands; and it presents one of the most striking pictures of luxuriant fertility which it is possible to conceive."[12]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jezreel_Valley

With all due respect, Mr. Twain was maybe telling the story he saw but it's his truth ...

85%+ of the people inhabiting the area of Israel and Palestine are immigrants of recent history, each with its own claims to the lands which BTW, contain most of arable land and fresh water in the region. The Jordan River and the Litani River (Lebanon) are the only large sources of water in the area.

The people of Gaza are mainly displaced Muslim Arabs from the UN partition and creation of the State of Israel and the resulting war in 1948. There are probably a few descendants of, or those who claim to be descended from, the Philistines of the Bible

"According to the Bible, they ruled the five city-states (the "Philistine Pentapolis") of Gaza, Ashkelon, Ashdod, Ekron and Gath, from Wadi Gaza in the south to the Yarqon River in the north, but with no fixed border to the east ..." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philistines.

But don't let the historical facts get in the way of emotions and drama... Carry On ...

The wikipedia quotes were not the basis of what I said, merely references -- I spent 3 years in Israel and speak from the expedience of what both Israelis, some Palestinians (of all faiths), Druze, and Samaritans have told me personally. I sat and listened to a Mullah speak and make his case of his peoples' claims to their lands and some were legitimate. I have listened to Rabbis make their claims, mostly I might add just like the Mullah -- most based in old even ancient theology.

The Important Part:
The best experience I had on my stay in Israel in retrospect was the day we had a serious injury on the dairy farm I was working on.

We, Myself, the Russian Jew farmer and one of the Arab Butchers from Gaza who was buying the cows for slaughter, were loading two burnt-out dairy cows up a trailer's ramp. We were lifting the ramp to close the trailer and all of a sudden one cow decided to step backwards. We could not hold the ramp up. The farmer was not able to jump back fast enough like the butcher an I were able to. The ramp came down smashing the farmers foot.

Somehow, with the help of a cattle prod the Arab butcher and I got the trailer ramp back up and off Ephraim's foot TOGETHER. I ran to the house to get help and call an ambulance. The Arab butcher from Gaza knew bones, while I was gone he reset the Jewish farmer's broken foot bones (the metacarpals top 5 in the foot).

The Doctor at the hospital told the farmer's wife that when Ephraim got there that his foot was saved by the work of that Gazan Butcher resetting the Jewish farmer Ephraim's foot bones. I will never forget that day -- it taught me that people who work together can climb mountains and not to judge a man by his religion or race but by his deeds. That day together we put those religious people and their inner hate to shame.

[Grapesoda]

from Hebrew har məgiddô (הר מגידו), meaning "Mountain of Megiddo". "Mount" Megiddo is not actually a mountain, but a tell (a hill created by many generations of people living and rebuilding on the same spot)[4]

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[Mutt]

I said there should be peace and if not for the Arabs hatred of Israel there would be peace. The Palestinians have been used as pawns by their Arab brethren who treat them like total shit. There is no such thing as a 'Palestinian', read below, there wasn't an Israeli/Palestinian War in 1948, it was the Arab/Israeli War. This Palestinian homeland/state is an invention created by the Arabs who still don't recognize Israel's right to exist and would destroy it in a heartbeat if they could.

"There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity... yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel".

Zuhair Muhsin, military commander of the PLO and member of the PLO Executive Council

King Hussein, the sole Arab leader that directed integration of the Arabs, in 1960 stated:

"Since 1948 Arab leaders have approached the Palestine problem in an irresponsible manner.... They have used the Palestine people for selfish political purposes. This is ridiculous and, I could say, even criminal."

[The Porn Nerd]

I like She-brews. They're hot ladies.

(I hope I contributed well to this political discussion. :D)

[ilnjscb]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

The Doctor at the hospital told the farmer's wife that when Ephraim got there that his foot was saved by the work of that Gazan Butcher resetting the Jewish farmer Ephraim's foot bones.[B] I will never forget that day -- it taught me that people who work together can climb mountains and not to judge a man by his religion or race but by his deeds. That day together we put those religious people and their inner hate to shame

I wish life were like this. 85, maybe 90 percent of people are basically good, IMHO. 5% deceptives and 5% socios ruin it for everyone.

The Bad Apple: Group Poison

Ruining It for the Rest of Us

[Barry-xlovecam]

King Hussein is a Hashimite:

Hashemite, also Hashimite, is the Latinate version of the Arabic: هاشمي‎, transliteration: Hā?imī, and traditionally refers to those belonging to the Banu Hashim, or "clan of Hashim", a clan within the larger Quraish tribe. It also refers to an Arab dynasty whose original strength stemmed from the network of tribal alliances and blood loyalties in the Hejaz region of Arabia, along the Red Sea.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hashemite

During the war, Lawrence fought with Arab irregular troops under the command of Emir Faisal, a son of Sherif Hussein of Mecca, in extended guerrilla operations against the armed forces of the Ottoman Empire. Lawrence obtained assistance from the Royal Navy to turn back an Ottoman attack on Yenbu in December 1916.[20] Lawrence's major contribution to the revolt was convincing the Arab leaders (Faisal and Abdullah) to co-ordinate their actions in support of British strategy. He persuaded the Arabs not to make a frontal assault on the Ottoman stronghold in Medina but allowed the Turkish army to tie up troops in the city garrison. The Arabs were then free to direct most of their attention to the Turks' weak point, the Hejaz railway that supplied the garrison.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T._E._...ce#Arab_revolt

The Hashemite was separated from the Saud tribe by the British victors of the First Word War and given the territory of Trans-Jordan, now known as Jordan, to rule as a sovereign domain in return for his tribe's support of Lawrence of Arabia. The Royal Hashemite Hussein family is overlord foreigner to a mixed Arab population, many of whom are expatriate Palestinians. They are "pander bears" to the greatest extent to save their British imposed kingdom.

Hussein bin Ali was born in 1853 in Istanbul as the eldest son of Sharif Ali ibn Muhammad and his wife, Salha Bani-Shahar. He was the last of the Hashemite rulers over the Hejaz to be appointed by the Ottoman Sultan.[4] As a Hashemite,[5] he was highly respected in the Islamic world. It was his noble lineage which granted him the status he maintained in the Hijaz. As a descendant of the Prophet Muhammad, even the British, during his period as Emir, recognized this special status.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hussei...cca#Early_life

In the aftermath of the war, the Arabs found themselves freed from centuries of Ottoman Sultanate rule, but under the mandate colonial rule of France and the United Kingdom. As these mandates ended, the sons of Hussein were made the kings of Transjordan (later Jordan), Syria and Iraq. However, the monarchy in Syria was short-lived, and consequently Hussein's son (Faisal) instead presided over the newly-established Iraq.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hussein..._World_W ar_I

Al-Hejaz, also, Hijaz (Arabic: الحجاز‎ al-Ḥiǧāz, literally "the barrier") is a region in the west of present-day Saudi Arabia. It is bordered on the west by the Red Sea, on the north by Jordan, on the east by Nejd and on the south by Asir.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hejaz

You need to have a little understanding before you start quoting and understand the political motivations ... What you quote King Hussein as saying seems to me: That his fellow Arab leaders would not assist in the Palestinian exile population problem destabilising his kingdom gifted as the British reward for his father's loyalty in the First Word War. Truth hurts :P

"taal" or "tell (the phonetic pronunciation)" means foothill in Hebrew and "har" means Mount" -- "harim" would be Mts. plural. Tal Megiddo is an archaeological site now ... Been there ...

[madm1k3]

Thanks Barry-xlovecam, this post made me laugh pretty hard

[PornDiscounts-V]

Are Jesus quotes in red?