CEO: 5,000 % drug price hike "not excessive at all"

[J. Falcon]

This is seriously fucked up:

When Turing Pharmaceuticals bought the 62-year-old drug called Daraprim in August, the company immediately raised the price of one pill from $13.50 to $750. The increase drew protests in the medical community from those concerned that many patients will no longer be able to afford the drug. According to Turing CEO Martin Shkreli, however, the move is simply a smart business decision.

"Why was it necessary to raise the price of Daraprim so drastically?" CBS News correspondent Don Dahler asked Shkreli.

"Well, it depends on how you define so drastically. Because the drug was unprofitable at the former price, so any company selling it would be losing money. And at this price it's a reasonable profit. Not excessive at all," Shkreli responded.

Daraprim was developed in 1953 as a treatment for toxoplasmosis, an infection caused by a parasite. It comes from eating under-cooked meat or drinking contaminated water, and affects those with compromised immune systems, like AIDS and cancer patients.

When Turing Pharmaceuticals raised the price of Daraprim to $750 per tablet, the average cost of treatment for patients rose from about $1,130 to $63,000. For certain patients, the cost can go as high as $634,000.

While Shkreli acknowledged that the move might look "greedy," he said there are "a lot of altruistic properties to it."

"This is a disease where there hasn't been one pharmaceutical company focused on it for 70 years. We're now a company that is dedicated to the treatment and cure of toxoplasmosis. And with these new profits we can spend all of that upside on these patients who sorely need a new drug, in my opinion," he added.

Oncologist and CBS News medical contributor Dr. David Agus disagreed.

"Patients shouldn't be taxed and charged for future research and development. Patients should pay for the drug they're getting and what they need in the situation that they are" Agus said.

"It's predatory practice and it's inappropriate," he added.

The topic entered the political debate on Monday, with Democratic presidential candidate Hillary Clinton tweeting: "Price gouging like this in the specialty drug market is outrageous."

LINK

[Jman]

Guy now as a HUGE target on his back. C&^%

[Bryan G]

He just looks like a little dick as well.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Jman

Guy now as a HUGE target on his back. C&^%

I will honestly be suprised if that guy doesn't end up with a bullet in his head from some fucker who can no longer afford the meds.

[Barry-xlovecam]

I read that yesterday also ... His reasoning was that the low quantities needed and sold justified the price.

One of the drugs was a re-patented, re-formulated generic drug, whose production had first begun some 60 years ago. These problems are caused by pharmaceutical patent policy abuse allowed by the FDA.

There has to be government tax and pharmaceutical patent policy, maybe in some cases, tax credit policy to prevent abuses like these by pharmaceutical patent holders. If pharmaceutical manufacturers produce drugs with unconscionable prices -- their patents should be forfeit with the government then licensing production at a reasonable cost to patients.

There would need to be a law that would allow this to be done with some equitable due process. Right now it could not be legally done. So, we are stuck with paying or dying at the mercy of profit -- that is too high of a price to pay -- human suffering with wellness a choice of bankruptcy or death. This extortion pricing should be illegal but it usually isn't in AmeriKa.

[J. Falcon]

Originally Posted by Bryan G

He just looks like a little dick as well.

[BlackCrayon]

i doubt you'll find many hedge fund managers with a heart out there.

[woj]

there is one catch though, biotech companies are generally not very profitable...

do you ever hear "if I would have invested $5k in pfizer 10 years ago, I would be worth $500k now"? you don't, cause you would at best double your money in 10 years, and that's including dividends along the way...

so while it sounds like a scam, no one is actually getting rich off it....

[kane]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

I read that yesterday also ... His reasoning was that the low quantities needed and sold justified the price.

One of the drugs was a re-patented, re-formulated generic drug, whose production had first begun some 60 years ago. These problems are caused by pharmaceutical patent policy abuse allowed by the FDA.

There has to be government tax and pharmaceutical patent policy, maybe in some cases, tax credit policy to prevent abuses like these by pharmaceutical patent holders. If pharmaceutical manufacturers produce drugs with unconscionable prices -- their patents should be forfeit with the government then licensing production at a reasonable cost to patients.

There would need to be a law that would allow this to be done with some equitable due process. Right now it could not be legally done. So, we are stuck with paying or dying at the mercy of profit -- that is too high of a price to pay -- human suffering with wellness a choice of bankruptcy or death. This extortion pricing should be illegal but it usually isn't in AmeriKa.

I don't have a problem with allowing the drug companies some protection when they invest a lot to make a drug so they can earn that money back. As it is right now that is supposed to be 10 years then after that the patent opens up and other companies can make generics.

Still, companies find a way around the system. I have asthma and was diagnosed in 1978. The first inhaler I was prescribed was called Proventil. It is still on the market today. Most albuterol inhalers are pretty much the same, but there are 4 or 5 brands out there. In the 37 years since I was first prescribed this medication there have only been generic inhalers available in the US for about 5 years because the drug companies keep finding ways to re-claim their 10 year patent. The most recent was when they were forced to changed the type of propellant they use to a more environmentally friendly kind. There is no price difference in the propellants and every item that comes in a spray can like hairspray or spray paint had to change. Still, the pharmacy companies were able to claim that this was enough of a change that they get another 10 years of protection so we went back to $50 inhalers instead of the generics were were about $10.

[wehateporn]

Originally Posted by J. Falcon

He's currently doing some damage limitation

https://np.reddit.com/user/martinshkreli

[Barry-xlovecam]

Originally Posted by kane

[ T]here is no price difference in the propellants and every item that comes in a spray can like hairspray or spray paint had to change. Still, the pharmacy companies were able to claim that this was enough of a change that they get another 10 years of protection so we went back to $50 inhalers instead of the generics were were about $10.

That should be an unjustified and unconscionable price increase. Either the federal courts must make a ruling that will stick or the law needs to be changed to fit the circumstance.

[wehateporn]

[wehateporn]

Relevant history

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by woj

there is one catch though, biotech companies are generally not very profitable...

do you ever hear "if I would have invested $5k in pfizer 10 years ago, I would be worth $500k now"? you don't, cause you would at best double your money in 10 years, and that's including dividends along the way...

so while it sounds like a scam, no one is actually getting rich off it....

No blue chip stock is going to give a 1,000% return in 10 years.

Last year Pfizer profited $40 billion, in perspective the largest oil company Exxon profited $36 billion. Yea, no one is getting rich. Pity the poor pharmaceutical companies.

[wehateporn]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

No blue chip stock is going to give a 1,000% return in 10 years.

Last year Pfizer profited $40 billion, in perspective the largest oil company Exxon profited $36 billion. Yea, no one is getting rich. Pity the poor pharmaceutical companies.

Big Pharma is a Trillion Dollar Industry

[woj]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

No blue chip stock is going to give a 10,000% return in 10 years.

Last year Pfizer profited $40 billion, in perspective the largest oil company Exxon profited $36 billion. Yea, no one is getting rich.

yea, lets muddy the water by using the "billion" word... like that has any relevance... every big company makes billions of profit / year... doesn't make them profitable...

if they are so profitable, why don't you invest and get rich? could it be that they are far less profitable than you make it sound?

they are in fact a pretty damn poor investment, investing in sp500 over the past 10 years would have resulted in more profit (with less risk) than pfizer...

[wehateporn]

[wehateporn]

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by woj

yea, lets muddy the water by using the "billion" word... like that has any relevance... every big company makes billions of profit / year... doesn't make them profitable...

if they are so profitable, why don't you invest and get rich? could it be that they are far less profitable than you make it sound?

they are in fact a pretty damn poor investment, investing in sp500 over the past 10 years would have resulted in more profit (with less risk) than pfizer...

Pfizers gross PROFIT was 40 Billion last year. And no, not every big company has those numbers every year.

Gross Profit for Pfizer (PFE) - Wikinvest

[wehateporn]

Originally Posted by woj

if they are so profitable, why don't you invest and get rich? could it be that they are far less profitable than you make it sound?

Need to get in when they are growing before price goes up

[Rob]

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

If the drug would have just been approved and came onto the market, it could have sold for more than what he's charging. There are life saving cancer drugs on the market that cost more per pill than those, and how about Viagra costing so much? No one bats and eyelid at the Pfizer family becoming uber-billionaires off our boners. No single medication should cost what it does. Even if it were made out of weapons grade uranium and Dodo bird tears, it still shouldn't cost $1000 per pill.

So he's pricing his pill based on current market value for a life saving drug. Yeah, people are painting him as a douche-bag, but as a business man, I can't have ill feelings toward the guy. Let's say you get a manufacturer hookup for iPads for $15 each. Are you going to sell them for $15 or the current market value? Are you a cock sucker because you're making so much profit?

If your life is worth it, then find a way to pay for the pill. If you can't afford it, then become a hedge fund manager or take chemistry courses and start your own pharma company.

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by Rob

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

If the drug would have just been approved and came onto the market, it could have sold for more than what he's charging. There are life saving cancer drugs on the market that cost more per pill than those, and how about Viagra costing so much? No one bats and eyelid at the Pfizer family becoming uber-billionaires off our boners. No single medication should cost what it does. Even if it were made out of weapons grade uranium and Dodo bird tears, it still shouldn't cost $1000 per pill.

So he's pricing his pill based on current market value for a life saving drug. Yeah, people are painting him as a douche-bag, but as a business man, I can't have ill feelings toward the guy. Let's say you get a manufacturer hookup for iPads for $15 each. Are you going to sell them for $15 or the current market value? Are you a cock sucker because you're making so much profit?

If your life is worth it, then find a way to pay for the pill. If you can't afford it, then become a hedge fund manager or take chemistry courses and start your own pharma company.

So in your mind you would have no problem with someone buying up the rights to all the insulin being produced and charging $10,000 for a vial of insulin?

Then you can tell the 350 million diabetics in the world 'hey if you can't afford it become a hedge fund manager'.

Christ the way some of you think.

[woj]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

Pfizers gross PROFIT was 40 Billion last year. And no, not every big company has those numbers every year.

Gross Profit for Pfizer (PFE) - Wikinvest

I meant profit is not excessive given the size of the company and risk involved... a simple common sense test to see if profit is excessive, is to just ask yourself: would I get into this business? would I invest in this company?, etc

for example:
porn 10 years ago: without a question "yes"
pharma company today: a "maybe" at best

[Rob]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

So in your mind you would have no problem with someone buying up the rights to all the insulin being produced and charging $10,000 for a vial of insulin?

Then you can tell the 350 million diabetics in the world 'hey if you can't afford it become a hedge fund manager'.

Christ the way some of you think.

Bad example. Insulin is readily available and no company has control of the market. Now if a company comes out with a pill that CURES diabetes, then I can't have a problem with their pricing structure. They did the research to develop the cure, they can charge what they feel is appropriate.

Look at the pill that cures Hepatitis C. It's over $1000 per pill. I don't see many people bitching about that.

[Sly]

This guy is a weasel. He is getting sued by prior investors already for screwing them over.

Believing anything he says as some great miracle project is a wish at best. Scam investors once, likely to do it again, and again, and again.

On one hand, he claims the increase in price will fund additional research. On the other hand, he claims nobody is taking the medicine anyway so it's not going to do any damage. If nobody is taking the medicine, why increase the price and claim it's going to fund additional research?

[MaDalton]

If there's karma he'll catch something where there's no cure for

[Sly]

Originally Posted by woj

I meant profit is not excessive given the size of the company and risk involved... a simple common sense test to see if profit is excessive, is to just ask yourself: would I get into this business? would I invest in this company?, etc

for example:
porn 10 years ago: without a question "yes"
pharma company today: a "maybe" at best

He just bought the patent within the last few months. He knew exactly what he was going to do. He would not have bought the company if he thought it was a big risk.

This is a pump and dump stock style (the industry he came from,) on the pharmaceutical side.

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by Rob

Bad example. Insulin is readily available and no company has control of the market. Now if a company comes out with a pill that CURES diabetes, then I can't have a problem with their pricing structure. They did the research to develop the cure, they can charge what they feel is appropriate.

Look at the pill that cures Hepatitis C. It's over $1000 per pill. I don't see many people bitching about that.

That's because the average person is an idiot. Instead of trying to figure out why our health care costs are what they are the simple minded thing is to blame Obama and argue why pharmaceuticals are justified in charging what they do. Meanwhile in just about every other modern country they are capped in what they can charge except here.

[Sly]

Originally Posted by woj

yea, lets muddy the water by using the "billion" word... like that has any relevance... every big company makes billions of profit / year... doesn't make them profitable...

if they are so profitable, why don't you invest and get rich? could it be that they are far less profitable than you make it sound?

they are in fact a pretty damn poor investment, investing in sp500 over the past 10 years would have resulted in more profit (with less risk) than pfizer...

Have you read anything about this guy?

He is a sociopath, at best. He is not some guy investing in biotech and hoping some great drugs come along to save lives. He is purchasing patents to flip them and get rich for his investors and hopefully pay off the people that are suing him for screwing them over on the last deal.

This guy is a worthless piece of shit. Watch his interviews, check out his recent Twitter "wisdom." He's a grown-up child/sociopath/future OD death.

[woj]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

That's because the average person is an idiot. Instead of trying to figure out why our health care costs are what they are the simple minded thing is to blame Obama and argue why pharmaceuticals are justified in charging what they do. Meanwhile in just about every other modern country they are capped in what they can charge except here.

in every other "modern" country some bureaucrat decides how much life is worth and how much should be spent on saving it... if the cost exceeds the number they came up with, you are shit out of luck... which drug you get is decided by some magic formula, which often favors lower cost over effectiveness...

it's debatable if that setup is really so much better...

[woj]

Originally Posted by Sly

Have you read anything about this guy?

He is a sociopath, at best. He is not some guy investing in biotech and hoping some great drugs come along to save lives. He is purchasing patents to flip them and get rich for his investors and hopefully pay off the people that are suing him for screwing them over on the last deal.

This guy is a worthless piece of shit. Watch his interviews, check out his recent Twitter "wisdom." He's a grown-up child/sociopath/future OD death.

I'm not really familiar with that guy, I was commenting about the pharma industry in general... it's possible this guy was actually running some scam, but I don't know about him enough to comment on that though....

[SuckOnThis]

Originally Posted by woj

in every other "modern" country some bureaucrat decides how much life is worth and how much should be spent on saving it... if the cost exceeds the number they came up with, you are shit out of luck... which drug you get is decided by some magic formula, which often favors lower cost over effectiveness...

it's debatable if that setup is really so much better...

Yea, thats why the US is ranked 34 in life expectancy, because every other country is based on some bureaucrat deciding what drug people get based on what their life is worth.

Get over yourself already.

[woj]

Originally Posted by SuckOnThis

Yea, thats why the US is ranked 34 in life expectancy, because every other country is based on some bureaucrat deciding what drug people get based on what their life is worth.

Get over yourself already.

statistics like "life expectancy" are kinda meaningless, there are dozens of reasons why US ranks #34, but quality of medical care is not one of them... as long as you can afford it, here you get one of the best medical care in the world...

[kane]

Originally Posted by Rob

Don't hate the player, hate the game.

I've always hated that saying. Just because a game exists doesn't mean you have to play it.

If a shitty game exists and you decide to play it then it makes you a shitty person.

[arock10]

Originally Posted by woj

statistics like "life expectancy" are kinda meaningless, there are dozens of reasons why US ranks #34, but quality of medical care is not one of them... as long as you can afford it, here you get one of the best medical care in the world...

It's quality of healthcare... Overall available quality of healthcare to everyone

[j3rkules]

A 5000% increase in the price of a drug that's been around for decades?

That guy should be in jail.

This is preying on the sick in the most vicious way.

[woj]

Originally Posted by arock10

It's quality of healthcare... Overall available quality of healthcare to everyone

not necessarily...

- cars are more popular in the US, which lead to more accidents which lowers life expectancy (LE)
- US has relatively high homicide rates, which lowers LE
- US has relatively high obesity rates which lead to lower LE
- US has higher inequality than most socialist countries, which results in some poor not getting adequate health care, resulting in lower LE
- US is generally less "paternalistic" than most socialist countries, which lowers LE
(for example: most countries require wearing a helmet while riding a motorcycle, in many US states there is no such requirement)
..etc

none of these have anything to do with actual quality of health care available to US citizens...

[Robbie]

It's just one of the many results of Obamacare. The govt. gets involved, prices go up. And now that everyone is forced to have insurance... all prices have been going up fast, including premiums.

[Sly]

He's rolling it back: Turing To Roll Back Massive Price Hike Of Daraprim After Outrage

Someone put pressure on him, and it wasn't the "public." Most likely investors.

[Google Expert]

His reply made sense. He said he was doing what's best for the company and shareholders.

[CurrentlySober]

Interesting Factoid. since being diagnosed with type 2 diabetes last week, from now on ALL my prescription meds are free ! Woot Woot!

[wehateporn]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

Interesting Factoid. since being diagnosed with type 2 diabetes last week, from now on ALL my prescription meds are free ! Woot Woot!

You don't fancy reversing it through diet and exercise?

[woj]

Originally Posted by Robbie

It's just one of the many results of Obamacare. The govt. gets involved, prices go up. And now that everyone is forced to have insurance... all prices have been going up fast, including premiums.

good point, he is really just fleecing insurance companies and everyone else only indirectly... the whole setup with insurance companies is like having a porn surfer that has a credit card with unlimited credit limit that he never has to pay back... so what would you do in that setup? charge $39.99 for a membership or $399.99? obviously 399.99 since surfer could care less if the membership is 39.99 or 399.99, someone else (insurance company) is paying the bill...

[CurrentlySober]

Originally Posted by wehateporn

You don't fancy reversing it through diet and exercise?

And give up FREE drugs? You 'aving a larf mate or wot?

[wehateporn]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

And give up FREE drugs? You 'aving a larf mate or wot?

You can pretend you are still sick and flog the drugs in the bike sheds