seems to be alot of whining about Photoshop lately

[Amputate Your Head]

understandable.

It's a seriously over bloated program with more stupid plugins than a 16 year old kid with 112 home spam servers on a 4 plug surge protector.


I will never understand why you people snub your noses at Macromedia Fireworks...... it is my preferred tool, and I've been using it since '97.

There isn't ONE fucking thing you can do in Photoshop that I can't do better in Fireworks.


get a grip peoples. Let go of the hype. Use a tool that works.

[goBigtime]

You're everywhere



... oh... but on topic... the mac version is streeeeeeeamlined (as always)

[Steve]

only $300 for Fireworks?

that's like 1/2 price of CS

[goBigtime]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head

I will never understand why you people snub your noses at Macromedia Fireworks...... it is my preferred tool, and I've been using it since '97.

I remember back in the day when Macromedia first sent out mailers about Fireworks & they were so confusing they made it sound like it was some sort of post-processing image accelerator.

I had no idea Fireworks was a Photoshop wanna-be until maybe last year because of that mailer sent so many years ago.

[Mr. Marks]

I love them PS Actions.

[psyko514]

Originally posted by goBigtime
I remember back in the day when Macromedia first sent out mailers about Fireworks & they were so confusing they made it sound like it was some sort of post-processing image accelerator.

I had no idea Fireworks was a Photoshop wanna-be until maybe last year because of that mailer sent so many years ago.

i had no idea up until now.
i don't use either though.

[The Truth Hurts]

people snub their noses on anything they think it isn't cool to use.

simple ignorance.

I've been using PSP since 96 and see no need to stop, even though I own a copy of every other prog.. with PSP i really have no need.

[brand0n]

i know its early, but we are intrested in your sig space for next month. would you consider selling to signup4cash?

[stev0]

i've always used photoshop... might have to try some of these other ones soon. Photoshop is pretty bloated, long load times even on fast PCs..

[washiez]

I still prefer to use Photoshop 4.0 or 5.0

[TheDoc]

The day I can see people do all around design work in fireworks like they can in CS, then I will bow down.. Seeming that hasn't ever happened and never will.. I have nothing to worry about.

Did fireworks ever make so you can save a master editable file?

[slackologist]

fireworks is great for vector work.

[Morgan]

I use photoshop. However, I dont really find myself qualified enough as a designer to notice a difference. I love CS.

[gwilkins]

Photoshop is about the last piece of software I'd bitch about. If you want to sling mud how about Premiere.
BTW, if you don't like bloatware, what about Dreamweaver....

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by TheDoc
The day I can see people do all around design work in fireworks like they can in CS, then I will bow down.. Seeming that hasn't ever happened and never will.. I have nothing to worry about.

Did fireworks ever make so you can save a master editable file?

for the love of god..... it's 2004 already.

Of course Fireworks source files are editable. And as far as doing "all around" design work? Well, I can tell you that I don't use Photoshop AT ALL. How's that?

[AMADude]

I love Fireworks too, but there are certain things I like better about Photoshop. I use them both.

[Shaze]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head
understandable.

It's a seriously over bloated program with more stupid plugins than a 16 year old kid with 112 home spam servers on a 4 plug surge protector.


I will never understand why you people snub your noses at Macromedia Fireworks...... it is my preferred tool, and I've been using it since '97.

There isn't ONE fucking thing you can do in Photoshop that I can't do better in Fireworks.


get a grip peoples. Let go of the hype. Use a tool that works.

i got fireworks but never knew what it was really for....always used photoshop...guess i gotta look into it.

[Ironhorse]

Originally posted by goBigtime
I remember back in the day when Macromedia first sent out mailers about Fireworks & they were so confusing they made it sound like it was some sort of post-processing image accelerator.

I had no idea Fireworks was a Photoshop wanna-be until maybe last year because of that mailer sent so many years ago.

Same here, I didn't realize its capabilities until Amp started talking about it. However I already switched from Fractal Painter to PS so I'm not doing that learning curve again.

I just found out my favorite Html editor is also gone so I have re-learn Dreamweaver. I'm a bit pissed about it, HotMetalPro had a really cool tag-based way of doing your html that worked really well for the way I work, I'm not too fond of the WYSWG and text based has too much margin of error.

[gwilkins]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head
for the love of god..... it's 2004 already.

Of course Fireworks source files are editable. And as far as doing "all around" design work? Well, I can tell you that I don't use Photoshop AT ALL. How's that?

So the MX 2004 Version does? Fireworks MX doesn't but you can export to psd and other multi layered file formats.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by gwilkins
So the MX 2004 Version does? Fireworks MX doesn't but you can export to psd and other multi layered file formats.

the Fireworks PNG files have been layered and editable for years man

[Amputate Your Head]

are you people daft?

[TheDoc]

Originally posted by Amputate Your Head
for the love of god..... it's 2004 already.

Of course Fireworks source files are editable. And as far as doing "all around" design work? Well, I can tell you that I don't use Photoshop AT ALL. How's that?

Big difference between creating low level graphic work for porn sites and personal pictures, than creating full all out art. You don't find "firework" art sites, you do find photoshop art sites.

If it wasn't for photoshop (adobe) fireworks and every other graphics program would still be in the dark.. That is all that really matters.. Adobe lead the way, all the way, and still does.. Nobody can argue that.


Glad they finally added editable layered files...

[KraZ]

Originally posted by Ganjasaurus
I use photoshop. However, I dont really find myself qualified enough as a designer to notice a difference. I love CS.

I've "invested" 6 years in Photoshop, I have a expert-level certificate in it so why should I switch to Fireworks? I feel so much at home with Photoshop. The new CS version isn't anything spectacular but anyone will have a difficult time improving an almost perfect application.

Same as MS Word - I don't see a lot of ground for improvement there either. Peace

[Roald]

I wanted to try it out some while ago (fw) and found out I don't have the time to start learning it like I did with ps lol

[Stewie]

Originally posted by Ironhorse
I just found out my favorite Html editor is also gone so I have re-learn Dreamweaver. I'm a bit pissed about it, HotMetalPro had a really cool tag-based way of doing your html that worked really well for the way I work, I'm not too fond of the WYSWG and text based has too much margin of error.

Check out the HomeSite software that comes with dreamweaver. Edit in raw text or with tag assists, and you can switch back/forth with dw while working on the same doc. I've used homesite since it was shareware in 95, and only use dw occasionally.

[johnbosh]

it rocks

[Stewie]

Originally posted by TheDoc
You don't find "firework" art sites, you do find photoshop art sites.

I would imagine that it has more to do with customer loyalty, and Adobe's long-time hold of the market, rather than the capabilities of fw.

[SomeCreep]

I <3 photoshop

[KRL]

Originally posted by brand0n
i know its early, but we are intrested in your sig space for next month. would you consider selling to signup4cash?

[KRL]

Not saying you can't do just as nice work with other apps, but Photoshop is the standard program used by every major DTP pro.

[RicardoB]

Well actualy I prefer specialised tools for a job.

A thumbnailer to make thumbnails
An image cutter to cut pics up etc....

It's my experience that the results are always looking just as good as with the Fireworks and Photoshops that are available and less then half the size.

Maybe it's me but that's how I do it.

[Ironhorse]

Originally posted by overlord
Check out the HomeSite software that comes with dreamweaver. Edit in raw text or with tag assists, and you can switch back/forth with dw while working on the same doc. I've used homesite since it was shareware in 95, and only use dw occasionally.

I've used both before, there is a unique interface in HotMetalPro that I think is the best editor out there, yet somehow nobody cared to try it so the product was discontinued, I really prefer this to any other editor, I have the latest version but with no support will be another Betamax soon..

[Stewie]

Originally posted by Ironhorse
I've used both before, there is a unique interface in HotMetalPro that I think is the best editor out there, yet somehow nobody cared to try it so the product was discontinued, I really prefer this to any other editor, I have the latest version but with no support will be another Betamax soon..

I tried hmp around 99, and while I don't remember much about the program, I do remember it feeling kind of "klunky" and un-optimized. Either way, every artist has their favorite medium. I work in raw text 95% of the time.

[TheDoc]

Originally posted by RicardoB
Well actualy I prefer specialised tools for a job.

A thumbnailer to make thumbnails
An image cutter to cut pics up etc....

It's my experience that the results are always looking just as good as with the Fireworks and Photoshops that are available and less then half the size.

Maybe it's me but that's how I do it.

Photoshop and Fireworks arn't a thumbnailers and image cutter-uppers, they are graphic creation programs. Of course unique programs created for smaller tasks are going to be less than half the size and faster, also how most of us do it

[Ironhorse]

Originally posted by overlord
I tried hmp around 99, and while I don't remember much about the program, I do remember it feeling kind of "klunky" and un-optimized. Either way, every artist has their favorite medium. I work in raw text 95% of the time.

It has its own problems for sure, one of the main things I like about it is how you can easily grab entire tags hahahahahaha and close) and move elements around while trying different things, and it won't let you make errors. I will no doubt end up using Dreamweaver and HS again soon as seems they have elbowed everyone else out of the market.

[Stewie]

Originally posted by Ironhorse
I will no doubt end up using Dreamweaver and HS again soon as seems they have elbowed everyone else out of the market.

Well, dw has for all the wysiwyg coders out there. The only reason HS is in the mix is because Macromedia got it as a free bonus when they bought Cold Fusion/Allaire. Macromedia had no use for it, so they slapped their name on it, and added it to dw like a plugin for text coders.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by TheDoc
Big difference between creating low level graphic work for porn sites and personal pictures, than creating full all out art. You don't find "firework" art sites, you do find photoshop art sites.

If it wasn't for photoshop (adobe) fireworks and every other graphics program would still be in the dark.. That is all that really matters.. Adobe lead the way, all the way, and still does.. Nobody can argue that.


Glad they finally added editable layered files...

it's all about the proper tool for the job. I doubt anyone here is in the business of making "full out art sites" as you put it. And hence, the problem and the source of all the frustration. You got 16 year old kids trying to make TGP logos with Photoshop. It's like having Picasso paint your fucking garage.

Do you really need a full surgical team staffed by worldwide experts in order to clip your toenails? No.

Like I've always said, (and nobody ever listens) use the tools that work, and let go of the fucking hype. Sure... Photoshop make be the bomb if you're designing the next CD cover for TOOL.....

no one here is doing that. Get over it.

[Amputate Your Head]

Photoshop takes up a nice little chunk of my disk space..... that's about all it's good for. Cuz I can't remember the last time I actually opened it for something.

And lest we forget.... Macromedia also brought us Flash, Shockwave, Dreamweaver, etc.... and they are all constantly improving.

wtf has Adobe done for you lately?

[Jakke PNG]

I use photoshop almost exclusively. I like it and CS is worth every penny. I do however use fireworks to cut up my psd's for some reason. Now that I know pretty much all the tricks of PS, it's hard to change away from it. Especially since there's no free time in a day. No time to learn new tricks.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally posted by The Truth Hurts
people snub their noses on anything they think it isn't cool to use.

simple ignorance.

I've been using PSP since 96 and see no need to stop, even though I own a copy of every other prog.. with PSP i really have no need.

also a staple tool... I use PSP daily for numerous things.

[Raf1]

I'm used to Photoshop and I will keep on using it

[RicardoB]

Originally posted by TheDoc
Photoshop and Fireworks arn't a thumbnailers and image cutter-uppers, they are graphic creation programs. Of course unique programs created for smaller tasks are going to be less than half the size and faster, also how most of us do it

Just to be clear I don't mean the tools themselfs but the outcome.

A thumb generated by a thumbnailer is Much smaller in kb's then one made with Photoshop.

When you use the tools like that all you need for the graphs is a barebones editor like Painshop

The downside is I have over 50 different tools so I loose track sometimes