Too much free shit ...

[Rose]

http://www.wired.com/news/print/0,1294,42061,00.html

[aprilkorova]

Nice article.

Most professional adult webmasters have known this for a while, as I'm sure you have too. It's newbies or teenagers in it for the short run that have fucked us all off. Me? Very little pink and no penetration of any kind in my TGPs or free sites. Not even in my tours. Works fine and would work even better if there wasn't so much free hardcore floating around! How do they think this is going to benefit them in the end? Idiots!

[Rose]

I can not agree more
They get 100 000 clicks on their gallery,
200 clicks on the banner, sell one membership
and then start telling their ratios with TGP
traffic is 1:200...LOL But they dont see
that it took 100 000 surfers to sell one membership, SAD....


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Submit your free sites for free traffic

[NightLizard]

that's true, I agree with you both

[lynch1000s]

Did I read this article correctly. It said too much porn, not too much free. But anyways, people will always provide free porn provided they think that they're going to make money off it. Unfortunately, not a good percentage are making money off it.

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Terrance
http://www.penis-enlarge.com

[This message has been edited by lynch1000s (edited 03-17-2001).]

[Susan]

I agree too.

Not only is there far too much free stuff but some of these so called newbies are stealing content from newsgroups and posting it at TGP's.

I submit to TGP's one day each week and when I see 10,000 hits get no sign ups it makes me wonder. We have a loyal member base at our pay sites so any sign up I get from TGP's are a bonus but few and far between.
TGP's are feeding the underage freeloaders too. Perhaps the rules should be tightened even more - I really don't know what the answer is.

Read the post "JJJ stopped listing free web host galleries" Perhaps its the beginning of the road ahead and a way to keep out the time wasters.

[This message has been edited by Susan (edited 03-17-2001).]

[lynch1000s]

Blacklisting free hosts is a tough call. A lot of people lose money by submitting to tgp's on pay servers. To say that free hosts submitters are newbies or time wasters is completely untrue. But anyways, a newbie or experienced submitter are the ones that would actually submit to the big sites with their pay host, in my opion. But anyways, susan, how did you get christmas.com, just wondering.

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Terrance
http://www.penis-enlarge.com

[This message has been edited by lynch1000s (edited 03-17-2001).]

[Susan]

lynch1000s

I have American roots - though sometimes not proud of it. I work for a family business that began with a Titty bar owner in TX. Can't say any more.

[Rip]

I had an interesting talk with BD of SEG yesterday... the discussion evolved around perhaps requiring that all free galleries, tgp's ... sites have to have the good stuff pixellated

and maybe that, we should start a network of sites like that, everyone would sell more, and the people who didn't buy in would have higher bandwidth and less revenue

my personal opinion is that the knowledgable webmasters will survive, the people who go out and buy new content and post it for free will go broke, mostly

some people think the name of the game is how high your counter spins

but the real name of the game is the size of the number your accountant writes down at the end of the year

as far as I am concerned, outside of the tgp postings and sites behind avs's , with a couple of exceptions, all the open fed free sites I have are being changed so the "good stuff" is pixellated on the images

it's the first time I have noticed an upturn in sales in a while with the sponsors I am using there

Partly of course this is anticipation of restrictions being imposed on the adult online business, but certainly giving away 1000's of hardcore images isn't the answer.

If you doubt me, take a look at the ap tour... see any hardcore images there?

My sales are going up dramatically on the sites I have done, so far, so I am going to continue doing it

People that place large broadband "money shots" and multi meg movies for free are, well, you know shooting themselves in the pocket books

The best experts in manupulating surfers to click stuff, are cj sites. There is usually no real content, just links and banners... but lots of surfers still click the links

[Rose]

TGP's could be great marketing tools if used properly,unfortunately that is not the case.
Galleries should be just teasing full page ads for pay sites with few softcore pictures.
Not what we are seing today, 1 000's of pure hardcore images.TGP's today are kind of content providers for surfers.
Today any one can become adult webmaster,even
15 years old yes.And it doesnt cost you anything,no investment,no worries.Sign up for some free hosts,get some pics from news groups and start submiting your galleries.
Back when I started in 1997,there was no free host.I had to get my domain name($ 100)
find host,bandwith wasnt cheap back then,
I paid $ 10 per gig, on top of $ 300 set up fee,plus cost of content.I remember it cost me over $500 for my first free site, before
that site was even on line.Lots of those teenagers today wouldnt be building galleries
if they had to pay $ 500 from their pockets
up front.
So here we are now,ratios are droping,payouts
are droping and net is full with garbage.Just 3 years ago no one would advertise company for 3 cents pay banner click.My lowest click through sponsor paid me
10 cents per click.Other great sponsor was Cash Cow, 13.5 cents per banner or text link click.Conversions were great.

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Submit your free sites for free traffic

[Rose]

Rip I agree.
It's not hard to get 100 000 hits on your gallery today,but what is quality of those hits.If it takes 100 000 TGP surfers to sell one membership,then for me that traffic is worse then shit,even if my ratio is 1:20,
cause only 20 of those 100 000 clicked my banner.The rest (99 980 just sucked your bandwith and returned to happy TGP owner).
It used to be rule that you make about 2 cents for every surfer which entered your site.Not anymore.
Also what I found out over the years is
ugly free sites make more money than
nice free sites.

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Submit your free sites for free traffic

[Gemini]

I agree Rose. I have gotten the old man to basically not use the hardcore pics or email the license holder site to request permission to 'star' over the pics on galleries. lol Of course no permission has come back yet.

So I'll work on him to not use those progs or at least the more show pics. More and more galleries have 15-20-25 pics too. Alot of tgps are demanding 15-20 pics as well. We need to balk at that number and say 8-10 and thats it. We keep feeding the surfers and the signups will continue to go down.

Too funny. I just thought about 94 when Howies mom was mad at him and then brought him an article about the San Fran cops and feds busting a BBS for even HAVING porn pics available to their pay members! Back then it was pay up or shut up before you ever saw a pic one!

We'll have a battle with the Spanish and German speaking countries tho. They are the highest percentage of hotlinkers now. So they will be wanting to show it all. H*ll with no real govt in some of those countries, who will censor them?

I never was real comfortable showing hardcore unprotected. I guess thats why I was a gogo dancer instead of a stripper. lol Made more than the strippers to boot! Show it all and they are gone and happy for free!

[magnatique]

it's not the free part that's bad... it's the logic of the webmasters... some of em'...


you have to let the surfer want more..


wether it is by not showing pink, not having any hardcore, lower quality pictures, one niche you only sell, etc...


free is good...

free sites are the way paysites get most of their traffic... it makes the economy run...

[hottshot]

I agree with you guys but what can be done about it ! I just recieved a rejection for my Gallery from richards-realm. Because my Pictures had the money shots covered up with a star. These TGP's are requiring too much in order to get listed !

e-mail From Richard-realm

Many thanks for submitting your page, but I've
decided not to list it for the reason given below:

"Censored images."

URL Submitted:

If you re-design your page to take care of the
above reason, please feel free to re-submit at:


[This message has been edited by hottshot (edited 03-18-2001).]

[This message has been edited by hottshot (edited 03-18-2001).]

[chass]

Don't blame the newbie webmaster...you were all there at one time..hoping to make money..Now that you are..seems you want to run the newbies out the buiz..What's next? Are we to police the new webmasters and tell them what they can and cannot do? Baloney!

Agree that pics should be limited to no more than 12...even that may be too much.

Well, just wanted to throw my $.02 in...

[Rose]

Chass, I dont blame new webmasters,
but stupid ones

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Submit your free sites for free traffic

[Gemini]

Ummm chass, the frontier days of net porn are going. So yes, we need to see to our ownselves as well as the newbie webmasters. Now that alot of foolish people are online and tout themselves the term webmaster, we could be in trouble.

Do we want Ashcroft telling us we're out of business? All due to a pack of newbies screwing it up for everyone? Not many old timers will go along with that. I don't doubt that RR turned starred over pics out. (Once upon a time scammers stole sample pics to use with banners) lol

We don't think censored pics will come about overnight in tgp's. But it's *your* choice to send the harder ones at all. Pick thru them and use the softer shots. You can always do an AVS to hide the hard ones and pick up some extra cash doing it. Just a thought.

Ahh well we'll have to be licensed within a few years just like other businesses probably. Then they can track and prosecute us for doing illegal practices. Ugh!

[lynch1000s]

Anyways, isn't that article talking about too much porn, and too much competition. I just skimmed it, but I didn't really get the impression that they were pointing to too much free porn as being the problem. Oh well, just wondering.

Also, susan, how much traffic do you get with christmas.com. I still can't believe that you have a domain name like that.

[This message has been edited by lynch1000s (edited 03-18-2001).]

[Interlude]

Yes, there is too much free porn out there, and everyone who makes a living from this business has suffered in one way or another because of it. You might think you're doing well, and that's great, but believe me - you'd be doing better if the industry wasn't so damned big. Back in the good 'ole days, I used to pull in $2K a month from a shitty AVS site. I don't consider that a lot today, but it was a damn good turnover for the little amount of work.

If you've ever taken a college psych course, you may have heard of the "prison dilemma" - basically, 2 guilty guys facing 5 years in prison get arrested and interrogated by the cops:

- If they both keep their mouths shut, they get no prison time.
- If one talks and the other doesn't, the person who talks gets 1 year and the other gets 5 years.

I may have the numbers wrong, but you can see where I'm going - if webmasters would band together and stop giving away free porn, we would all do better. But, facing uncertaintly, it's easier for people to cheat. For example, if the major LL's stopped listing hardcore sites, the one guy who says "fuck it" and lists them anyway will do better.

Understand that the industry right now is set up in a pyramid - 99% of webmasters are promoting sites run by an elite 1%. Most newbies are taught to build free sites as quickly as possible to funnel business into the megasites. Hell, there is a whole industry these days in "teaching" webmasters, an industry that actively tries to discourage people from starting a paysite of their own. Is it any wonder there is a porn "glut" under these circumstances?

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50/50 Celebrity Partnership Program

[CyberHustler]

I think this deserves a bump...

[Iron Fist]

Originally Posted by Rose

I can not agree more
They get 100 000 clicks on their gallery,
200 clicks on the banner, sell one membership
and then start telling their ratios with TGP
traffic is 1:200...LOL But they dont see
that it took 100 000 surfers to sell one membership, SAD....

No no, I like the program owners who jump in here and spam out join page ratios... now THAT'S awesome!

[IllTestYourGirls]

Originally Posted by Nick Decker

I think this deserves a bump...

great bump and funny as hell. I thought this was from THIS YEAR!

[sandman!]

haha Flying Crocodile havent heard that name in years

[- Jesus Christ -]

The sky always has and always will be falling.

The solution is EASY.

We need somone brave enough to start producing real snuff! Then we can party with conversions like it 1999!

(too far?)

[Jarmusch]

[papill0n]

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls

great bump and funny as hell. I thought this was from THIS YEAR!

so did I

[NinjaSteve]

Originally Posted by Nick Decker

I think this deserves a bump...

How the hell did you find it?

[tony286]

thats funny

[Barefootsies]

There is only ONE way your idea works toots.

You band together the high traffic TGP's. You make a new set of rules ALL follow.

No money
No pussy
No long videos
etc.

Once you change the rules to get listed. Submitters will comply.

Period.

It will take time, but that is the ONLY way you will get a change. If you want to further change the biz. Get the submitters to also apply these rules. Tada. In time, you have cleaned up the industry.

The beer money barons vanish. People learn how to sell again. Free porn bye bye.