Can this industry survive?

[cashcows]

So here I'm converting pretty well. But conversions have been going down across all sponsors and my best converting just raised their trial price from $1 to $4.95 and conversions went from 1:100 to 1:1100.

Now that may help them but it totally screws me. To the point of why bother.

Obviously they must have been losing money...but It also seems that over the last two week nothing is converting very well.

I'm really starting to wonder how long before all of the program close up. Not trying to be negative but let's be real it's easier to find porn on google video search than signup at a site or navigate some members areas.

I personally check out all sites I promote and if I would not stay a member I won't promote it.

I don't see how anyone is still making money really. I mean sure if you have a huge 1000 site network that's been around for years. But to take the time to build a network now is it even worth it?

Or do I just need new sponsors?

I miss the days that I could just point domains for type in traffic and collect checks.

But Free will always have a huge and unfair advantage over what you have to pay for.

And people seem to be of the mindset these days that they don't want to pay for anything digital these days, screw the hard work & money people put into it.

PS: I know porn will always be around but, this industry as it is now I don't see surviving for long, unless they do what I have been saying for 10 years, stop giving out from content ad start using DRM. Look at the Digital Playground site, no downloads and all streaming content.

The best thing that could happen to this industry is the GOV. banning all porn that does not have a credit card screen or age verification.

[Kiopa_Matt]

Of course the porn industry will stay alive. The harder the free shit hits the industry, the less porn gets produced, and the more the demand rises. There'll always be a demand for paid porn, but just not as much as before.

It's you affiliates that are going to get fucked the hardest. If I were you, I'd be finding a new line of work.

[Machete_]

adapt or die

[seeandsee]

build tubes and let users upload full movies, then sell ads, and then gfy mother fucker

[madawgz]

visa and mastercard only getting stricter...

[botfurom]

Originally Posted by madawgz

visa and mastercard only getting stricter...

Indeed, every month they are putting new rules.

[LushBoobs]

We all have too many years in it for it NOT to survive, right? yeesh that would suck!

[Sausage]

I made the move to mainstream this year leaving my adult on autopilot. I barely made $50k from adult this year... way way down from previous years. In under a year of pushing mainstream I have already blasted past my adult earnings.

Thing is you can't torrent a tangible good.

[Angry Jew Cat - Banned for Life]

Originally Posted by botfurom

Indeed, every month they are putting new rules.

good

[Angry Jew Cat - Banned for Life]

The industry as you know it now will be dead in a few years, those who weather the storm and make it out alive will forge a new adult internet.

[Paul Markham]

Porn will always survive. Not as it is today just as a slim down industry or a very changed one.

The Internet part of adult spent a fortune throwing up free porn, then the consumer did the same and the rot was in.

However when free is better than paid, why pay for it? Until the paid part spends more on the product and less on giving it away the rot will stay.

I feel some will step up on what they sell. They will realise the days of selling just videos are coming to an end, even for people like Manwin with their massive traffic. If ratios are getting worse for you Cashcows they are getting worse for everyone. So change has to happen. Even those supported by adverts will find ratios suffering.

Then the new wave will come in and realise that those with something worth buying are the ones selling.

[cashcows]

I agree with a lot of what you guys said...

@ Sausage - I have always been 50% in the main stream info products and piracy is hurting everything digital but I lock all of the new ones up with DRM it does help a lot. Because when someone google your product and a fucking torrent for it or a hotfile link ranks higher than your own site you're fucked! I had that same realization about physical products as well. Not only that they have real advantage over information that I also sell.

@ Angry Jew Cat - Agreed! I love that Picture BTW...lol

@ Paul Markham - Also agreed!.

The question is I still have several hundred adult domain I'm just not sure that they are worth developing. I have top 1-5 rankings in google now an and almost no sign ups! I think the sexy toy names will do ok if developed.

Also are solo girl sites surviving these days?



Time to find some new cheese.

[BIGTYMER]

Its alive and kicking. The same old tired methods of making money with porn don't work well now. You need to think fresh and outside the box.

[Angry Jew Cat - Banned for Life]

Originally Posted by cashcows

I agree with a lot of what you guys said...

@ Sausage - I have always been 50% in the main stream info products and piracy is hurting everything digital but I lock all of the new ones up with DRM it does help a lot. Because when someone google your product and a fucking torrent for it or a hotfile link ranks higher than your own site you're fucked! I had that same realization about physical products as well. Not only that they have real advantage over information that I also sell.

@ Angry Jew Cat - Agreed! I love that Picture BTW...lol

@ Paul Markham - Also agreed!.

The question is I still have several hundred adult domain I'm just not sure that they are worth developing. I have top 1-5 rankings in google now an and almost no sign ups! I think the sexy toy names will do ok if developed.

Also are solo girl sites surviving these days?



Time to find some new cheese.

So how about those sex toy domains? Any nice generic keyword domains you're interested in parting with?

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by cashcows

@ Paul Markham - Also agreed!.

No one is allowed to agree with me. It says so in the rules.

[jerryb]

Originally Posted by Sausage

I made the move to mainstream this year leaving my adult on autopilot. I barely made $50k from adult this year... way way down from previous years. In under a year of pushing mainstream I have already blasted past my adult earnings.

Thing is you can't torrent a tangible good.

That's why I have been heavily promoting Phone Sex. It is next to impossible to find it FREE on the web. The sites that do say FREE Phone Sex have it tied to a Credit Card in some way or other.

My sites, even tho they have some sponsor links, are 90% slanted towards Phone Sex ... and, it is paying off. Want to talk dirty to me --- pull out your CC and we'll chat.

I can find ALL the free porn on the web to last me 100's of years. It is out there and we all know it. Sure, you may have pretty Amy Sue doing anal and have a contract with her ... but, there are 100's of other Amy Sue lookalikes out there that I can see doing anal for FREE FREE FREE.

Sad, but true.

[Davy]

Things are going downhill pretty fast!

[Davy]

Originally Posted by jerryb

That's why I have been heavily promoting Phone Sex. It is next to impossible to find it FREE on the web. The sites that do say FREE Phone Sex have it tied to a Credit Card in some way or other.

My sites, even tho they have some sponsor links, are 90% slanted towards Phone Sex ... and, it is paying off. Want to talk dirty to me --- pull out your CC and we'll chat.

I can find ALL the free porn on the web to last me 100's of years. It is out there and we all know it. Sure, you may have pretty Amy Sue doing anal and have a contract with her ... but, there are 100's of other Amy Sue lookalikes out there that I can see doing anal for FREE FREE FREE.

Sad, but true.

And how many guys will pick up their phone when they can jerk off to as much porn as they like?
Not many. The average surfer is a fag who would never even think of making that phone call.

[CaptainHowdy]

This industry will... swurve.

[jerryb]

Originally Posted by Davy

And how many guys will pick up their phone when they can jerk off to as much porn as they like?
Not many. The average surfer is a fag who would never even think of making that phone call.

The Phone Sex checks I get monthly FAR exceed the sponsor signup checks I was getting in 1999-2000.

I agree that the surfer is like a broken dildo but there is a certain percentage of them that do want to talk LIVE with a dirty talking guy/gal while they whang their weinies. Thank heavens for that percentage.

[cashcows]

Originally Posted by jerryb

The Phone Sex checks I get monthly FAR exceed the sponsor signup checks I was getting in 1999-2000.

I agree that the surfer is like a broken dildo but there is a certain percentage of them that do want to talk LIVE with a dirty talking guy/gal while they whang their weinies. Thank heavens for that percentage.

So is this off targeted phone sex traffic or just adult traffic. I would think cams would do better than phone sex.

Any phone sex sponsors you recommend?

[Fabien]

Originally Posted by Sausage

I made the move to mainstream this year leaving my adult on autopilot. I barely made $50k from adult this year... way way down from previous years. In under a year of pushing mainstream I have already blasted past my adult earnings.

Thing is you can't torrent a tangible good.

Exactly what i'm doing right now.

[Sausage]

The free stuff isn't the whole issue either. In mainstream you can expect vastly better ratios depending on the product you are promoting.

Heres my main mainstream sponsor since oct .... seriously we haven't seen ratios like this in adult since 1996! Its normal to see ratios of 1:5k or worse now even on SE traffic in adult.



Why would I bother with adult when I am seeing these results... and within a year of first starting !!!

[signupdamnit]

I'm focusing more on cams and dating. In 2011 I plan to go more mainstream along with both. I'm still debating on whether I will bother with micro-niche pay sites. Regular niche pay sites have started to become a waste of time and vanilla porn generally has been for many years.

I believe that games from sponsors is more of an issue than lack of conversions. Unfortunately as revenues decline more sponsors turn to the games as a way to shore up revenues in order to keep them alive because they lack any business sense. This has hurt much more than conversion changes in the last few years. Shaving schemes, late or no payments, 0-day program closures or terminations are huge issues. If it were only conversion changes it would be a breeze (I have a way to deal with that), but it's not. It's the scumbags...

[cashcows]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

I'm focusing more on cams and dating. In 2011 I plan to go more mainstream along with both. I'm still debating on whether I will bother with micro-niche pay sites. Regular niche pay sites have started to become a waste of time and vanilla porn generally has been for many years.

I believe that games from sponsors is more of an issue than lack of conversions. Unfortunately as revenues decline more sponsors turn to the games as a way to shore up revenues in order to keep them alive because they lack any business sense. This has hurt much more than conversion changes in the last few years. Shaving schemes, late or no payments, 0-day program closures or terminations are huge issues. If it were only conversion changes it would be a breeze, but it's not. It's scumbags...

This is not an attack on your just a rant on dating sites.

Dating sites are a huge scam bordering on fraud... Even Match.com got sued and accused of paying women to go out on dates with men. And those sites work for only about 5% or less of all of their users.

I actually review them and they are all a fucking joke I pickup women on facebook and myspace. Dating site are filled wit ugly fat women. I feel like a con man promoting stuff like that. Cam and porn I'm fine with it a legit service, you pay to watch people fuck or masturbate and talk to you.

Sites with live interaction is the way to go! Naughty America has or had a live interaction area which made is someone unique.

[2intense]

porn will never die

[cashcows]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

I'm focusing more on cams and dating. In 2011 I plan to go more mainstream along with both. I'm still debating on whether I will bother with micro-niche pay sites. Regular niche pay sites have started to become a waste of time and vanilla porn generally has been for many years.

I believe that games from sponsors is more of an issue than lack of conversions. Unfortunately as revenues decline more sponsors turn to the games as a way to shore up revenues in order to keep them alive because they lack any business sense. This has hurt much more than conversion changes in the last few years. Shaving schemes, late or no payments, 0-day program closures or terminations are huge issues. If it were only conversion changes it would be a breeze (I have a way to deal with that), but it's not. It's the scumbags...

That's true of some. Also if you do convert well they accuse you of fraud! I have had that happen 3 times fortunately they still paid me. I just was able to get them to convert, they said people were canceling.

NOT MY FAULT you make them stick not me I mean really with all of the free porn if their content is not up to par or the site is not top notch how are they going to keep people.

If I thought there was still money I might start my own site but I see more opportunity in main stream now. Adult is a low odds venture at the moment.

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by cashcows

That's true of some. Also if you do convert well they accuse you of fraud! I have had that happen 3 times fortunately they still paid me. I just was able to get them to convert, they said people were canceling.

I'm seeing huge % drops in rebills suddenly develop within a month after years of consistency (in some cases -50%). One sponsor I have sent a few $100 sales (this is typical of my traffic) only to have them turn into $14 sales four days later (they have people manually review each sale). I'm sorry but I'm not going to send traffic under those terms. Those $100 sales and the rebills are what made you worth it. I can't trust you. Revshare no longer seems worth it unless you can be 100% sure the sponsor is trustworthy. At least with PPS you can bail immediately when conversions suspiciously double or triple and lose little.

[Redrob]

Personally, I am optimistic that this industry cashflows are turning around and improving.

I sense the pending defeat of .XXX TLD, the widespread acceptance of FSC's Anit-piracy Action Program, and the economic recovery of the nation becoming realities.

This industry will always have problems such as pro-censorship groups trying to curtail our 1st Amendment rights; governmental regulations such as 2257, the Utah email registry, CALOSHA and zoning issues; and, new technologies replacing existing methods of content delivery to which we will have to adapt.

But, know that we are not alone.

Other industries are facing, more or less, the same challenges and we all learn from each others mistakes. Moreover, we have the FSC as our vanguard pointing the way.

Have courage and buck up, Boys. I believe the best is yet to come.

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by cashcows

This is not an attack on your just a rant on dating sites.

Dating sites are a huge scam bordering on fraud... Even Match.com got sued and accused of paying women to go out on dates with men. And those sites work for only about 5% or less of all of their users.

I actually review them and they are all a fucking joke I pickup women on facebook and myspace. Dating site are filled wit ugly fat women. I feel like a con man promoting stuff like that. Cam and porn I'm fine with it a legit service, you pay to watch people fuck or masturbate and talk to you.

Sites with live interaction is the way to go! Naughty America has or had a live interaction area which made is someone unique.

Actually I mostly agree with you. The problem mainly seems to be that it is very difficult to get real women to participate in these types of sites and the ones who do usually gravitate towards those with more of a relationship focus. That it only works for 1 - 5% of the guys signing up isn't something I have a problem with. It's more the fraud which is commonly used in order to entice them to upgrade or the use of fake profiles (this one is probably a lot harder for new dating sites to avoid).

Perhaps the model itself needs to change in order for a more legit dating site to be sustainable? Instead of seeking to upgrade them to a premium membership try to upsell (but without the shady practices) other related goods and services and try to become more of a portal. It's probably still sustainable under the affiliate model but perhaps at a much lower PPS rate like $10 or $0.25/$0.50 per free (no CC required), $1 free (CC required).

I know I could send free signups to dating sites where no cc was required in huge numbers and wouldn't have a problem with $0.25 per free under those circumstances. I'd probably do far better than under the current model. Of course fraud would be the issue as it is now with PPFS.

[SGS]

Originally Posted by 2intense

porn will never die

Everything changes but porn will never die.

[sologirlcontent]

Originally Posted by Sausage

I made the move to mainstream this year leaving my adult on autopilot. I barely made $50k from adult this year... way way down from previous years. In under a year of pushing mainstream I have already blasted past my adult earnings.

Thing is you can't torrent a tangible good.

[Agent 488]

sausage, you don't have to out your techniques, but how you driving traffic? seo, media buys, blackhat? just in general.

[Agent 488]

exactly. you can torrent a sausage.

http://www.sausages4all.co.uk/

[whitealex]

I agree That its not worth it to promote adult sites, tried a new site and it sold good, then half september it just stopped. But what Im wondering, a few years ago there was the 2257 stuff, as the tubes host all these videos, how about the 2257?

[The Porn Nerd]

The adult biz will always be around because of the convenience factor: guy has dick in hand, he finds your site, likes it, wants to pop NOW - signup.

Sure, the percentages will change/drop, ppl and programs will close and move on, but those of us who will be around five years from now, or even sooner, will profit from the vacuum left by some closed BROgrams.

At least that's what I'm hoping. LOL

It all comes down to who you promote, HOW you promote them, and what your goals are. Sounds simple, doesn't it? LOL It's Sunday - not the day for "deep" posts.

GO JETS!

[Sausage]

Originally Posted by Agent 488

sausage, you don't have to out your techniques, but how you driving traffic? seo, media buys, blackhat? just in general.

Organic and blackhat seo, some media buys, building up my newsletter lists (damn i make $1k each time i run my 50k list!).

I am more protective of my sponsors than my methods though.

[tony286]

I think it will be around but alot less companies like it was before.

[nikki99]

I will survive, I wll survive