Are any current or former mechanics
 

...members of this board? I have a '03 Toyota Tacoma and the check engine light is now on. I had it checked and was told that the upstream 02 sensor is shot...and that it would cost around $400 to fix it. I was told that if I do not have it fixed it could burn out the catalytic converter which costs about $2000 to fix. Is this information correct.

Yes you could ruinnthe cat. $400 is this at the dealership? Sound a little to steep, but you could also be paying for diagnostics, and repair.

You can change them yourself not that hard i even cleaned one but its not recommended

Yes, do it yourself. Search on YouTube and you will probably find a video on exactly how to do it. I've been doing a lot of work on my own cars, easily save $1,000's and it's fun

Yes, it can ruin the cat. You can change it yourself, it's probably just screwed right into the pipe before the cat somewhere - on a truck like that you probably can get under it without even jacking it up.

Yes...at the dealership.

alternatively move to the country where they have no emissions test and saw off the converter :1orglaugh

I live in a State that does not require an emission test.

Never heard of someone paying that much to replace an o2 sensor. Unless Toyotas use more expensive parts. Get yourself an odbii reader so you can read the codes yourself in the future.

i wonder if plugging the o2 sensor is an option then?


https://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei...w=1280&bih=649

A quick Google search shows a toyota o2 sensor shouldn't cost much more than $160. It's just a matter of unscrewing the old one and putting in the new one and resetting the cel. Unless it's rusted so bad removal is difficult, seems you are paying too much. I don't recall paying more than $300 here in Canada for my old gm taxes in, and our parts prices are higher here.

That can be done but then you need to pay someone to reprogram the ecm.

You'll just spend more on gasoline, then

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...,parttype,5132 4cyl
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...,parttype,5132 v6

I believe that truck probably uses OBDII .. you can usually read trouble codes yourself by shorting a couple of pins in a connector under the dash ... also most chain stores like autozone will read your codes for free

Figure out how to reset them and then have two different people read them for you (or read them yourself)

If you don't have emissions testing, have some asshole weld pipe in place of the cat. The right person will do that if you give them the cat since they have platinum and other shit in them. Otherwise if you want to stay legal, they have "high flow" cats on ebay for $50 ... they're basically garbage and the same thing as having it straight piped

i thought both of these were to be removed together? i.e., plug the o2 sensor and replace the cat with straight-through??

I wouldn't do that because the computer won't know what to do and you end up running in closed loop mode. The computer does a lot of shit to increase fuel economy and it can't do that if one of the sensors isn't telling it anything. I could be wrong, but as I understand things, any one of the fuel system sensors or coolant temp sensors - shit like that - any of that not working causes it to ignore them all, I think

Upon further discussion with the dealership it turns out that they need to do their own check engine test to ensure for themselves that it is the upstream 02 sensor causing the check engine light to come on. I had it checked for free at AAMCO. Then they said they will need to run various tests on the engine to ensure that the firing system and fuel system is performing properly to ensure that it is not causing a problem with the upstream 02 sensor and then and only then can they have confidence that the sensor has gone bad. The sensor itself is $131 dollars plus the cost of the check engine test and the cost of the diagnostics run on the engine itself...possible fixes...plus labor...could run the cost up as much as $400.00 worse case scenario.

I had that wrong but the rest of what I said was apparently more accurate

http://www.autotap.com/techlibrary/u...en_sensors.asp

The computer uses the oxygen sensor's input to regulate the fuel mixture, which is referred to as the fuel "feedback control loop." The computer takes its cues from the O2 sensor and responds by changing the fuel mixture. This produces a corresponding change in the O2 sensor reading. This is referred to as "closed loop" operation because the computer is using the O2 sensor's input to regulate the fuel mixture. The result is a constant flip-flop back and forth from rich to lean which allows the catalytic converter to operate at peak efficiency while keeping the average overall fuel mixture in proper balance to minimize emissions. It's a complicated setup but it works.

When no signal is received from the O2 sensor, as is the case when a cold engine is first started (or the 02 sensor fails), the computer orders a fixed (unchanging) rich fuel mixture. This is referred to as "open loop" operation because no input is used from the O2 sensor to regulate the fuel mixture. If the engine fails to go into closed loop when the O2 sensor reaches operating temperature, or drops out of closed loop because the O2 sensor's signal is lost, the engine will run too rich causing an increase in fuel consumption and emissions. A bad coolant sensor can also prevent the system from going into closed loop because the computer also considers engine coolant temperature when deciding whether or not to go into closed loop.

Yeah, don't go to the dealership. You're looking at $100 for a diagnosis, there. Have some parts store idiot read the codes for you, it's free.. better yet, do it yourself.

If the dealership has the sensor for $131- definitely get it from them. Then put it in, yourself. As long as you can get to it, it could not BE easier. Might want to put some anti seize on the threads.. the socket you need is $5 OR the parts story will loan you one.

Genuine parts are almost always a whole lot better than anything else.. Only exception I can think of is the distributors on 98-99 lebaron convertibles

PS: If the engine is causing the sensor to get confused, why aren't they both upset? That doesn't make sense. They want your $100 diag fee
PS: I thought those greedy fucks would usually at least apply the diag fee to any repair, christ, they're getting worse

What do you mean by "why aren't they both upset"?

If there are misfires, etc or other problems going on they would normally throw their own code. Their "diagnostics" will probably consist of them plugging their obdii reader into your diagnostics port and pressing 2 buttons, the same thing they did at the auto parts store for free.

Got it. The engine itself runs fine. It does not appear to misfire and fuel consumption appears to be the same as when I bought it new. It only has around 70,000 miles on it.

I mean that if the engine is causing one of the o/2 sensors to malfunction or read out of range, why is it not causing the other 0/2 sensor to do the same thing?

Agreed. Unless it's something you're having a VERY difficult time troubleshooting, you don't need their billion dollar scan tool. They do have this extremely expensive version that gives them far more detail and more parameters but it's hardly ever necessary.

same. o2 sensor especially for a toyota should run a buck and change.

I'm shocked you own a Toyota vehicle. Toyota isn't an American car company. Be American, buy American.
Son....I am disappoint.

Actually I think the downstream sensor is $137 and the upstream sensor is $212 from the local dealership. I will confirm this tomorrow. The upstream is $220.00 at the local NAPA parts store.

The Toyota is Japanese owned but the Tacoma is made in the U.S. as well as Japan. BTW...I am not your son...sport.

The profits still go back to the mother company back in Japan so that means you didn't support our US automakers when you purchased your Toyota.
The "Son...I am disappoint" was a reference to a funny internet meme. Not an insult. Lighten up.
Sport.

Get the part and hire a mobile mechanic from Craigslist to install it

Part of the profit goes to Japan but the payroll is paid to Americans as well as everything else involved in sales and service...but you are correct that it is not a 100% American company. I prefer to buy the best product while supporting the economy.

Did you check fiverr? Maybe you can get the o2 sensor changed for $5

Have not read all the replies.

If you are that concerned about the diagnostics, find out of your car is OBD 1 or 2 compliant and get yourself a scan tool off of ebay for $50 or so - check the fault codes and if it is something as simple as an o2 sensor - spend 30 mins to swap it out yourself (it is easy as piss to change).

Saw a truck like you have in a supermarket car park here yesterday (never ever see them here) and fuck me dead that thing is enormous! Need a ladder to get in the bastard.

I think the tundra is the huge one