Has free porn effected the quality of models today?
 

Most girls today know if they get in front of a guy holding a camera they run the risk of getting found out by their family, friends and present/future employees. To say it's had no effect on the girls turning up and no effect on those who do turn up is wrong.

Over the last 20 years I have never known so few new girls turning up to castings than ever before. Did one recently and of the 10 girls who turned up only one was new. Agents we deal with are saying the same thing.

It has not only effected the numbers and quality of girls turning up, it has also effected what these girls will do in front of a camera. More today will only do solo than before.

Of course this is not the only reason for falling sales, the recession, Tubes, P2P and other things are also involved. But to sell a product you have to have a product worth buying no matter how many of them you have or how many people you show them to.

Now all those who are doing fine and getting great girls, sales and traffic can tell me I'm wrong. Or bullshit affiliates into sending them more traffic.

In case you have not noticed at least in the US, being a whore/slut is the new black so to speak. Having seen the numerous boat, street, or whatever parties - as long as you have barely legal girls, alcohol, music, boys, and beads you will see a free for all orgy. You can also go explore on either Halloween night or any Friday night at a club and see pussy lips and ass cheeks galore. Sluts are fashionable, sluts get free drinks, sluts pay no bills.

Now add in that the economy has seriously tanked. Girls still want money and more have no issues with taking some dick or showing some twat on camera. They really have no concern with who sees it. That is looking to far ahead.

I agree with you. You are spot on. Girls today are more broad minded and open to getting their tits out or even shagging their boyfriend in front of a web cam than ever before. Also they drink a lot more and do crazy things in front of cameras for fun. None of which has anything to do with them becoming models for adult. In fact it could have the opposite effect.

A girl doing something like I described above is more than likely to go onto free tubes sites rather than paysites or into DVDs. She might do a one off but not 20 scenes and we, the industry, need good girls who will do 20 scenes.

Whether girls who need money in the recsession choose to lap dance, strip or escort. None of which is likely to get them found out. Or decide to be porn models is a good question. What do you think?

LOL, here in America there are more hot American girls than ever before starting to do porn. Most of them love being porn stars. I can barely clear my email every day with new pics, and I am not even in LA. I film new girls every week. The porn business has issues for many reasons, but the idea that girls are scared off from doing porn is ludicrous, at least in my experience. It is not an issue for me or anyone I know. If you are having casting problems over there in Czech, maybe you should look at what is going on locally over there or how you are conducting business yourself.

And this is the result of the slow down on good new modles coming into the business.

http://www.recently18.com/tour1.php

Girl like Claudia Rossi could never be described as "Recently 18". :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

It has nothing to do with how we are conducting business ourself. It's reflected by the models on agents websites and agents are also saying the same. Good to know you are not seeing this problem and your clients are getting the results of your great models. Other shooters have said the same as me.

Your customers are the lucky ones.

But a few of you guys have content that's still late 90s-esque.. so you can blame that on the drop in sales too..

When a teen is wearing euro clothes, with a $50 quilt in the background and pink walls.. that's not necessarily the kind of teen guys are looking for.. They're looking for the modern, american girl look...

I think you might miss the boat with that on some customers, Paul... I know in terms of phone sex.. I can only use your content for extreme barely legal fantasies.. If I try to make a princess or brat domme with your content.. it doesn't sell...

and I think more guys are seeing the slutty tweeners looking all young, yet in slutty clothes.. and they seek that out. :) They like the bitchy, bratty, in control of her slutdom teen.... so don't just blame a drop in sales on the free porn or quality of girls.. it's changing with the times too that plays a part.. and your content looks the same as it did 7 years ago when I started in porn marketing.

Fantasy girls and women have changed... kinda like Playboy hasn't changed with the times and their sales/stock is in the shitter... because Hef refuses to update to what is "sexy" now...

I think as times change, you've gotta change too.. take some of those models you're getting.. and give them American clothes, a tan, some really pretty lipgloss.. and they might not be as "bad" as you think.

Like I'm scrolling through some of your stuff now..
and it's a HOT ASS CHICK..
but she has old lady hair. Old lady makeup. Euro clothes.. and Grandpa's house backdrop...

It looks like preposed, preplanned porn.. and I think guys looking at the teen stuff nowadays.. kinda like seeing into the life of the teen or whatever... It's our voyeuristic nature..

When they can go on youtube and watch a chick shake it for free.. in a short skirt and tank.. and see her house.. and see a natural smile..

The faux backgrounds and non teen clothes really throw things off.

Oh and the totally DRY pussy/ass getting a toy shoved into it is just painful looking. LOL

I agree with this. We have been guilty of shooting the same style over the last few years. I will be changing what we are doing in the next few months. But falling sales has nothing to do with less fresh models turning up for castings.

As for the clothes they probably come out of the same factory in China. LOL

Yes we will always suffer from the fact that we shoot Czech girls and need to think about how we package and sell them, trying to compete with the US market wanting US girls is doomed. But again it does not lead to less quality girls turning up to castings.

I did say theis thread would attract people to tell us how well they are doing. :1orglaugh

Which is why the Adult Net is thriving and it's only my sales that are dropping. :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

We're all suffering..
It's just some of us could proactively take that 30% drop in sales.. and have it be a 15% drop in sales... with just a little tweaking :)

I'm sorry if I came off snotty, I didn't mean to...

hah I'll go to Forever21 shopping for you.. LOL and send you some American Clothes for your teenies.

AND, we're all looking for things we're doing wrong right now.. and paranoid...
because of the recession... economic downturn... so sometimes we look to see OMG what can we change...

I think the voyeuristic nature of porn now.. and the openness of the younger girls in today's age about just showing themselves nude... has really upped the ante of what guys expect of their teen princesses now :)


Of course there will always be sites that are pedo bear approved.. LOL and a place for that.. but it's good to have the whole gamut. (gammet? gamot? gammut?) whatever.

None of which effects the numbers of girls turning up to a casting. Stay on the subject please.

Yes we need to change the style of what we are doing. And I have plans to do so. But again it has zero to do with girls turning up to castings.

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nowadays it is critical factor for xUSSR models.

But it does.
The free porn out there.. boyfriends putting shit on tubes sites.. girls dancing on youtube.. all that stuff..

Guys are seeing it.. and being drawn more to the real teen that's not naked on youtube..

And the feedback these girls are getting about their nude bodies.. is making them more apt to go pose.. You said yourself that more are showing up just wanting to do solo.. it's because the nature and openness of the world is changing... real girls are showing their sexuality daily.

It's a big ol' circle jerk pattern here... :) And you could probably capitalize on what you got showing up.. if you stopped and thought about the different ways she could be marketable.. instead of trying to put her into your mold.

Shooting porn and promoting porn isn't about what you like... but if some busted chick shows up... but she's way uber young looking... shoot some outdoor shit with her.. really amateur.. with real sex toys..

Lemons, lemonade.


Openess of young girls nowadays = more free porn out there = drop in sales for old teen sites because guys like the voyeuristic "real teen" porn = more girls showing up at casting because of feedback they've got for home made shit.

It does have something to do with all of it... but you were hoping you'd just get a bunch of photographers going, "GOD I KNOW, busted bitches showing up thinking they can be the next (insert solo girl)"

If all you want is people agreeing with you.. don't post on a message board.

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And it's common knowledge that in an economic downturn, more people turn towards the sex industry for work.

I honestly think that the internet made the user's habbits known. There was no real way for adult compagnies to figure out there was a market for all theses micro-niches out there.

I personally like to see a girl next door type of model then a airbrushed playboy model. It's more of a real fantasy when you know how re-toutched theses picutres are and how bitchy the girls are

Don't worry about being snotty we all tend to come over badly in type. :1orglaugh

Yes we are all suffering and it's going to get worse. I can only talk about business practices, content and porn, the rest I'm clueless about. ;)

I do know that girls here and the UK are becoming less willing to do porn modelling because of the loss of privacy. Many are choosing other options in adult to earn money. In an industry where most people will not use their real name or post pictures of themselves it seems strange that some think girls are eager to be seen fucking on the Internet. Risking their family finding out. :1orglaugh

But again the clothes girls wear in the scenes has nothing to do with the girls turning up to castings.

Hot teens in natural teen settings in real teen clothes.. :) because if a guy isn't getting that from his teen site.. he'll just go watch youtube and the 1000s of cheerleading, danceteam, wannabe webcamvids...

The internet has made younger girls more okay with showing their body.. AND OPENED the way for guys to be like, "See, that's what I've been looking for all these years" *fapfapfap* then cancelling his membership to whereever he pays for it.

It's all one big circle of fapping, nude life.

Uh it has to do with sales of all the girls that are turning up in casting and what you COULD be doing with them to make them marketable.. instead of talking about loss of quality....

You're looking at a girl and wanting her to fit into the mold you've had all these years...

BUT if you stopped and looked at what is happening to the teen fetish and men jerking off... I'd venture a guess that all this non quality girls you're getting... could be converted...

And if you were to dress them in the clothes that they're wearing in these youtube vids they're making.. or the home made porn shit their boyfriends are shooting.. your sales would go up a lot more..

third time,
it's all a circle of porn life.

More girls showing up.. means more for you to shoot.. if you stopped, took a second to see what her benefits MAY be.. and how you could exploit them for $$$$$$$$.. instead of thinking, "Damn she's not going to look good on a baby blue quilt with fluffy pillows and pink walls"

and second time,
lemons, lemonade :)

Okay before I go to bed..
You said that over there.. you're seeing less and less girls want to get into porn..
but then you said you've got more and more girls showing up...

:error

Maybe it is just a factor here in Europe. Girls in most European countries were always reluctant to do adult. There are girls from all countries turning up but not in numbers. The main countries were UK, Russia, Ukraine, Hungary and Czech. I do know Czech and Hungary has had a recent slow down in new models and the UK has ground to a halt.

Maybe the US shooters are finding the opposite.

Totally agree with you. There are some great scenes on Tube sites put up by girls having some real fun for the hell of it. I wonder why so many of us shoot faked posed scenes with models who clearly are doing it only for the money then?

Yes we all need to step up in what we shoot and tell models to get real or go home. And with the slow down in work available now is the best time to do it. On a recent meeting and casting at an agents office the slow down in work came up. I said the same as you, guys are turning away from the faked scenes we as an industry put out and turning to the real stuff they get for free on Tubes. I then told them that if they faked it I would send them home without any money.

Their reply was "No one else asks for that." To which I replied "And no one else is shooting as much as they used to. Because guys would rather watch it done for real on Tube sites."

Glad you brought this up though. Even though it is going off subject. ;)

If as you say the surfer and members want to see a real scene rather than what many of us produce, why are so many sponsors paying so little for the conent? The norm is or was 4-5 solo girl scenes for $1200 to $2000. (Some site like Twistys break this mould.) You simply can't ask a girl to fuck herself with a vibrator 4-5 times in a day in front of a shooter. The same applies to girl/girl and boy/girl content. Too many scenes for too little money.

Maybe the girl doing one mad scene for a tube site for the hell of it is a better seller than a girl faking her way through too many scenes. So why don't sponsors see that?

Which is why Twistys sell so badly. :1orglaugh

This has always been a general rule of mine. We have to sell or produce the porn we like because we know it's good or bad. There are exceptions but in general we all know it's right.

So do my style of teens sell today as well as they sold yesterday? Taking into account the market. Ask all the other teen sites pushing the same style. :1orglaugh

But is that the problem. Too many sites pushing the same style/niche? I would 100% agree with you.

So any sponsor who would like real content with real girls doing it for real needs only step up and ICQ me. They will not be able to speak with a US accent but I promise the girl will be shot in the style they wish and give her all to the one scene, because after that she will be finished. She can be done in Twistys style or girl next door.

The price will reflect the fact she is only doing one scene and giving it everything she has. LOL

Seriously I hear what you're saying and every casting I earn a lot of money shooting the content you like. For magazines who pay the price.

Very good points and I'm working on it.

Sorry I did not explain it properly, less girls are turning up today and of them more will only do solo.

Yes and already putting it into plans. I'm going to launch the retro site next week, if Epoch approve it, and then looking at shooting more stuff. Eva and I were planning the future shoots with what we have yesterday. Will be working in a different style though.

Not finding more girls turning up for castings here. Might be different in the US. And no I do not expect people to agree with me. :1orglaugh

Agreed 100%. :thumbsup

I'm off shopping, thanks everyone for contributing. In the future we need to make sure we all maximise our sales potential. Good content is only part of that.

go take a look at sites like shakinit.com

I rest my case

Why do you have to make a fool out of yourself so much?
Do I own that site? Hell do I own sluttydollars? Do I even run the websites they have? Hell what about produce or order their content?

Let me make it simple - no.
I run their affiliate program by helping affiliates out.

I only buy, shoot, produce, order for and maintain my own paysites, VOD, clip stores, ETC. Of which I do not run around sharing, trying to get affiliates for, or what not. Nothing invalidates what I said in the least though. Congrats though on being able to name some packaged content site (your specialty isn't it?)

In America quality of models could also be from obesity. We have the highest rate of fat chicks in the whole world. That also means that some other chicks are still going to be out of shape or a bit flabby.

Reality is the US does not have the highest rate. Damn near positive that belongs to a country in the middle east.

why is it always about the "girls"

what about the gay models, has that slowed down at all? lol

as long as the content guys keep pumping out cute and sexy first time boy sex, you can have the girls ;)

Did I say you owned, run or produce/order content for the site? No I just pointed out that some of those girls are not new faces.

you guys are forgetting one big thing here, years ago if a girl wanted to sell her body may it be for videos or for hooking she had 2 choices, walk the streets or go to a agent/photog and get work or work with a agency / pimp.

Now you have girls that post online on escort sites etc and they go do 20 minute calls 2 3 times a day and make more then doing shoots and they work less, this applies especially to girls with bad tests and so many girls today even non industry have bad tests.

Strip clubs have a very interesting problem in these days and that is they cannot hold on to the hot girls, most girls who start working in strip clubs soon relaize that if they dont do more than dance they will make nothing, once they start doing more they stop stripping and just do the more part by either working for an agency or posting online.

all girls are sluts

You are right they are.
In the context of the thread it had other meaning. Honestly I think that is a fairly new site that still has an older cover on it (tour area and such - not positive yet) and is not even ready for promotion yet as it falls into something that was recently bought.

You did quote me, dug it up and then proceeded to laugh about it. That was your intent at a jab, one that just happened to fall short.

This is one of my pet peeves--it drives me crazy when I see a cute teen girl dressed up in stockings and garter belt or other inappropriate clothing. Or dressed in teen clothes, but waltzing around in some huge mansion. And the Euro shooters seem to be more guilty of doing stuff like this than US shooters.

As for new models coming into the biz, I share an office with an agent in the San Pornando Valley, and we've seen more girls coming in over the last couple months. Sure, not all are cute, but I'm betting the recession will bring lots more hotties into the office.

Oh, and one more pet peeve not related to this thread: could all you guys who shoot outdoors just cut it out. Most of you have no idea how to resolve the technical problems associated with shooting in bright sunlight, and you also have no idea how to fix it in post (even if that's possible). Thanks.

thank you ...

Very true, good post. 20 years ago I think a girl had 3 options (not 2 LOL) stripping, hooking or modeling. Today she can do all those and added to that is lap dancing and stripograms (party strippers). The last one as EscortBiz points out can be a big earner for a good girl. Recently a shooter here tried to book two UK big tit girls for a very big sponsor. They turned down $1,500 for a days work each, soft solo girl.

A good escort girl can easily make $400 a call out which is 20 minutes of sex tops. A very good one can earn $1,000 a call out. Sometimes girls can do 2 a night and it's possible for girls to do 4-5 a week. When I worked in London these were both major competition for models.

None of what I have mentioned or EscortBiz include the girls pictures being spread all across the Internet and her family finding out. Unless Dad books her. ;)

So consider the consequences of a girl taking $400 to $1,000 a day from us or choosing the other Adult Industry options. She might not get 2 days work a week over the course of a year with us, her family will find out if she does. The other options include her making more money and no one should find out.

Yes but they are not stupid, they know what will happen by taking out coins.

I don't think girls are sluts for working in the Adult Industry. They are adopting a boys attitude towards sex. Maybe someone has a problem getting laid in a world of sluts. :1orglaugh

Getting the setting right is important and as you point out some do it badly.

I will argue with your point about stockings, it appeals to the buyers over 45 years of age. Guys of my age can remember pre tights times when all girls wore stockings. Who is more likely to buy a membership 18 to 28 or 48 to 58? We are not all senile and unable to surf. LOL

But you are spot on about building the scenario and many are totally clueless about it. 8 years of "anyone can shoot porn" has brought that about.

Without a doubt the economic downturn will make a difference. The problem might be that we don't have any work to give them. ;)

Or a lot less.

See my comment about anyone can shoot. :1orglaugh

I find shooting outdoors a nightmare, traveling to a location, sunlight is a bummer to control, wind, insects, noise, people, etc. And some clowns think I should do it exclusive for $400 a set. :Oh crap

Again it's the policy of anyone can shoot it and anyone can fill a site with anything and solve it with traffic business model that has brought this about. OK I know that's a bit over the top but most will get what I mean.

Something struck me last night about some of the comments in this thread. They are saying our content is wrong and does not sell. Last year they were saying our content was saturated, which means it sold very well. So remember, our content is saturated and members have seen it before and it does not sell because it's wrong and surfers are not looking for this content. :upsidedow

Or these guys are talking BULLSHIT and spamming their sites or/and the way they work. :1orglaugh

Have you ever thought that a lot of sites don't convert because the people putting them together are making simple mistakes like this one. Putting up porn stars and girls who have been in the business for years on a site stating they are new faces?

You have to remember our content is saturated and the members have seen it everywhere. :1orglaugh

No worries with your expert advice and help affiliates can send lots of traffic to it. :Oh crap

You opened the door.