So the world and the online adult biz fell apart....
 

....sometime between 2007 and 2008. Shady companies, Xsells, the economy, tube sites, adult falling behind mainstream in innovation, social media, 8 years of Bush.

Why/how are you still here?

in other words

How did you survive thus far? or How did you differentiate yourself enough so that the money in online adult is still more attractive then your next best alternative?

money, what else, you?

Bad habits are hard to break?

Although adult profits are down, real life is not doing any better. :2 cents:

When I thought of this post I had three things in mind.

1. Why do people choose to be on industry boards, the activity is probably near an all time low.

2. Why do you choose to remain in a deteriorating business?

3. If you have chosen to be here and in this business what sets you apart individually or as a firm that has allowed you to survive.

My answers are

1. I feel like beyond tubes and the economy the industry declined because online adult has big profits and low barriers to entry. Simply put, the money got competed away. I believe now that some of the largest most powerful companies in the biz are struggling with lower margins due to the lack of xsells their will be a consolidation industry wide an a renewal of opportunities, GFY is bound to be a part of that renewal and resurgence.

2. YanksCash runs off of 95% search engine traffic, most of which has existed since day one of Yahoo and google. This has always allowed such a constant and consistent stream of customers quitting and giving up that despite the decline would be insane.

3. I created Yankscash to fill a content void that I saw rather then as a money making machine that puts customers and quality at the bottom of the list. That alone has saved us. We still fill the niche successfully and treat our customers phenomenally. Thus as long as I produce the highest quality content I can they will keep eating it up. We have a few customers who have been rebilling since 1999. It blows my mind.

1) I could also watch TV and it's non-stop commercials, or join my girl in "As the world turns"...either way, I rather just (net)work, watch, listen and learn.

2) My businesses are growing. Not because the market itself is expanding, but because within my market, the competition is dissapearing/my clients are getting more demanding, which I see as a challenge and it works out.

3) Listen to your customers and go from there...wether it's traffic, vod, licensing, or just anything in adult or mainstream. Take my word for it here.

1) Still networking opportunities. A lot more non-sense on boards but I still get the 411.

2) It may be a deteriorating industry but my own business isn't deteriorating but rather growing. The car industry also sucks right now but there are still select dealerships that are doing just fine. Real estate sucks but there are still plenty of agents making plenty of money.

3) Without going into specifics, it is all about controlling expenses. Just one example ... I see people spend a lot developing new tube sites yet I can built traffic just as easily on a Tube Ace install using the default template with a homemade logo dropped in as I can if I spend hundreds on custom design.

I hope more people drop out -- it means more market share with less work.

1. Why do people choose to be on industry boards, the activity is probably near an all time low

= Cause it breaks the ice between work and my wife.

2. Why do you choose to remain in a deteriorating business?

= Cause it is real easy work to be honest

3. If you have chosen to be here and in this business what sets you apart individually or as a firm that has allowed you to survive.

= Continuation in work, never allow yourself a free day when your competition is working his ass off.

I do take sometimes free, and I have a fruit Farm to run also, and many other things, but this work is the key to all i am doing now. Thanks to my sponsors who are solid since the internet became a hype, and thanks to ME for never going for a PPS campaign :)

Life Time Revenue Rocks!!

1) Networking and money to be made, lots of it. Next to a list of targeted affiliate emails, forums are the best way to conduct mass business in our Industry without having to spam people.

2) I don't think it's deteriorating, it's simply moving technologies. Like before, lots of people go out the door during those times, but others will pickup the slack.

3) I would say my services have done that for me.

I'm still here because I enjoy it... but I don't think of it as the adult industry, but rather the entire Internet, so I have a lot to enjoy :)

I am learning a ton in this post, thanks epitome. I am leaving tomorrow for holiday but I have a fantastic site in the gay market that I sometimes struggle with promoting, maybe we can work something out

Great answers, but I have to ask what kind of fruit do you grow. That rocks!

and number 4 would be what handsome devil introduced me to gfy.com in a hottub in phoenix, hahahahahaha

Because I am insane.

Was a fun time for sure.... gota make sure we do it again sometime and catch up on things. :thumbsup


Enjoy your holiday, we just returned from Catalina Island - was a welcomed break from the mind grind.

I was up and coming. Really the only way I could go was up. Just like all recessions it is usually the larger companies that fail and the little ones creep in and take over.

I am going to bump this just to see if there is life here. I mean for god sakes do I have to put spam your self in the thread for people to promote themselves with some brainpower, lol. No offense to anybody above, they get it.

Hey Todd, its been a while! Times are always changing and will get better, a big part of it is people's morals and what they portray, and then the sheep follow them.

I see you don't follow sheep, that's good. :pimp

thanks man, how are you doing?

Welcome, glad you could make it.:thumbsup Just in time for my slideshow presentation. Would you like the red or blue view-master ?

I sell domains here and am not in adult...am happy to be in that industry than in adult. That said, I still sell a decent amount of names here.

grow with the changes a long and you will be fine

Not doing as good as I use to, but all in all I am still doing good. I trimmed back expenses about a year ago to the bare essentials, cut out a lot of fat. Made sure every dollar being spent was going to making money. I cut out of the budget the tens of thousands I had been spending a year in new projects, none of which were producing anyways.

My income, as I am sure most people know, comes from cams which hasn't been affected by free porn (tubes), just the credit card crunch.

If you are still doing just picture and video sites you going to have a hard time holding on for the long run. Hit me up if you want to explore the option of building a ppm cam site and get it in the top 5 of cam sites. You will be doing really well then.

Personally, I still post here because when I am working for several hours I need to take short breaks. Some times I take the short break here.

Because I still make a lot more doing this than anything else and I am good at what I do, and every day am working to make more and more money. The pie might shrink but I only need a little bit bigger piece to be doing better than I did last year and the year before etc.

I am good at what I do and I work hard. period.

I don't agree. I think saturation of "competitors" had very little to do with. The industry exploded in the early 2000, not in the last couple years when everything took a dive for most people. Saturation of full length videos (tube sites) in the last couple years + the credit card crunch has done the vast majority of the damage. When the credit card banks wiped out a lot of available credit a couple years ago plus the record bankruptcies, foreclosures, and unemployment, in the matter of a couple years time our customer base shrunk big time because of the lack of people with money available on the credit cards that they could use to spend on porn.

With the tube sites getting ranked well and more and more people finding the tube sites, and your content ending up on tube sites even your SE traffic will tank over time.

If you ever want to make a money making machine with cams, hit me up I will help you.

Interesting info until about ABOVE.

So if I "hit you up you can get me in the top 5 of cam sites"

Whoo Hoo I am set then. Ten years in the business and all I had to do was hit you up to be a top 5 cam site owner. Just curious do you take the 1-4 spots or could I hit you up on consecutive days for maybe a three spot, lol. :2 cents:

Nice, good for you, breaks are nice.


I believe that and being good at what you do is big plus.



Can't argue with that, and neither would Drew Brees. I like the avatar. I lived in SD and followed Purdue for a bit. ;)

I agree 2000 was def a banner year, but 2001-2005 wasn't bad either. I agree that the credit card crunch and economy where the main culprits, however the business cycle cannot be ignored. I am not referencing a decade of GFY history here but rather 200 years of economics. There was an explosion, a downturn, a consolidation(now) and a re-emergence (to come (fingers crossed)).

I have to say I don't see that happening at all. The SE gurus are smart enough not to fill their listings with irrelevant "tube tags". The economy, the credit crunch, the tubes (from a free content point of view) have taken their tolls, but they have yet to render any relevant SE listings useless. At least I haven't seen that.

once again this is where your intelligent statements loss all mojo. If you wanted to say I am dead in the water cool. But to say that all I need to do is hit you up to turn my adult websites and their supporting traffic generation network into cams and I will be a "PLAYER" makes you look foolish. :1orglaugh

1. I'm here because I'm still recovering from cancer and unable to do much else. Eva still runs the business though. Lucky to have a partner and wife who picked up the reins and took over.

2. Since the decline of the magazine business there's still money in content if you know where to find it.

3. No idea at all. :1orglaugh

The business has been in free fall for at least 5 years. Tubes and the economy have made it worse. Some will survive and some will not. But the good old days of working a day or two a week, taking 3 holidays a year and trips to sunny climates to shoot naked females and making a 6 figure income are long gone for shooters. Lucky to have been there when it was good. Still better than a 9-5 job. :thumbsup

There is a little more to it than just my help, you have to have the resources needed to execute. So ultimately what spot you land on will depend on your finances and ability to stick to my plan. What mainly is needed is a lot of cash and a staff of competent programmers and designers, I would take care of the rest.

I'm not a self proclaimed SEO guru who is telling you that they will get a top 5 ranking "porn". I have 10+ years of working 80 hours a week almost 100% on just cam sites and generating traffic for cam sites. I have generated over 100,000 credit card joins to cam sites and have been paid 8-10 million from just clickcash over the years. I've owned my own cam site/house, worked hands on with cam girls (been a cam guy myself) worked with owners of cam sites, been an affiliate, worked with 100s of affiliates helping them. I understand the big picture (owner, chathost, affiliate, and customer) and know what needs to be done to put together a very successful cam site.

Just to reply in advance to a couple common responses I get:
Why don't you do your own cam site. I don't have the resources (cash, time and staff) big enough to do it right, and I know enough to know that I am not going to half ass it like a lot of people and be a flash in the pan.
About the bragging or whatever. It is what it is, i've done everything I listed above. I am not one to brag about my success, but if you don't know me then how do you know unless I mention it?

Cam sites are the most difficult sites to start. You are dealing with more moving parts (company, cam girls, affiliates, customers) than most sites, especially picture and video sites. You have to have a perfect mix of quality cam girls and traffic, if you get more or less of either one it throws everything out of whack and it comes crashing down. Anyone can do a white label, or use another company's cam girls. But your earning potential is extremely limited and you will never be a successful cam site going that route.

Don't be an asshole and put words into my mouth. I said "I CAN HELP YOU". I never said all you needed to do was contact me and you will be instantly a player, rich or whatever. I said "If you ever want to make a money making machine with cams, hit me up I will help you. "

I am not promising you that you will be a "player" or not. If you want to look, act like, or a be a player that is entirely up to you. What I am pointing out is the obvious, picture and video sites are going out of business left and right. Cam sites are still trucking along doing fairly well because they are not affected by tube sites, which are hurting a lot of picture and video sites. If anything tube sites are a good source of traffic for cam sites as an upsell. A lot of picture and video site owners are diversifying into cam sites. It's a smart idea but a lot of these guys have 10 - 15 years experience in membership sites and zero in cam sites. It's like a different language. I see a lot of them doing things wrong. What I was offering, off the cuff, was that if you wanted to diversify into a better market, and make additional revenue with having a better level of stability added to your business, don't try to do it yourself, hire someone that knows what they are doing. I am one of the people who can help.

1. It allows me to be interactive with people, as compared to watching TV all day which is a one-way conversation. If I have zero interaction with other people, I will go insane. And it helps me sharpen my thought processes, debate and writing skills, because GFY members will catch and exploit any weakness or screwups in both premise & writing execution.

2. I have no idea. I need to get the fuck out, but can't come up with something I would prefer to do.

3. I'm good at what I do. It is the only reason I still entertain the notion of working in this biz. I just don't much care for what I do any more. I've got the tools and the studio and the skills of a professional graphics shop, but feel like I'm stuck in 3rd grade. I need something more challenging.

i came for the free pizza and disappointed there isn't any.

Short but sweet.

sorry, perhaps I read into that a bit more then I should have. I felt you came across as more of knocking the model I am running then wanting to help. :pimp Apparently I was wrong. :)

I think cams are amazing and perhaps I will hit you up sometime in the near future to learn more. However I don't think pics and vids are going away permanently and this post was to promote some positive thought about who will be there when the dust settles in all facets of the biz.

I know I will be. Tubes aren't going away but the growth they have experienced is unsustainable. I was actually trying to figure out an equation to that affect. The average tube surfer more then likely consumes more vids then can be produced by the few real amateur submitters. Thus someone has to produce.

Tube traffic converts like shit for paysites but if they keep growing the diluted revenue they generate from cam sites won't cover their bandwidth costs.

In other words the industry will have to rebalance.

Cam sites will still rock and I am sure you will do fine. But I have a really positive mindset about my biz model as well.

Sorry if I offended you, it was late, lol.

I've been good man! :thumbsup

Judging by the answers in this post, everyone is doing "great" and doing "millions" in adult..

then I wonder why everyone says that the adult business is "done" in other threads.

strange.

I'm not knocking your business model at all. I am sure you are very successful with it. It is just a very hard model these days to make money with any more. I've had some decent membership sites back in the 2000/2003 time frame. Personally in my situation I got tired of building up membership bases just to have the wiped out by 3rd party billers going out of business. That wasn't the only reason I stopped promoting them as I could have gotten my own merchant account, but the main reason was the amount of time I was putting into creating membership sites, updating them, buying content, doing customer service, etc... ate up a lot of my time that was better used into generate traffic. For me, I was best at generating traffic and left all of the updating, customer service to the site owner.

Membership sites still have a lot of potential, but personally I believe only the ones that have interraction will survive in the long run, or at the most stay as a good profitable business. If you shoot your own content and pay thousands of dollars for scenes for your members just to have it stolen and posted to tubes sites within a couple hours, you can't compete with that. The learning curve on the net is slow, there is still a lot of porn users every day finding tube sites for the first time, mainly the older users. The under 24 crowd already knows about all the free porn, so as the older generations find out, the membership sites with no interraction will continue to decline unless something drastic changes.

I agree with you that at some point the tube sites will have all of the content on the net on their sites and will run out of new content to put. BUT, they will just wait for you to post new content and then steal it and use it as their fresh updates as well. Why would a user pay to see your content on your site when all they have to do is wait a little and it will be on another site (tube) for free to watch.

I also never suggested you stop doing what you doing. I was mentioning if you were ever looking to diversify, start a new stream of income and if they both do well for a long time, perfect make more money. If the membership sites starts decline bad, then you have the cams site to supliment lost income. If done right you can use the cam site as an additional source of revenue and upsell to your existing members.

The only thing I could suggest you to help with your present model would be for you to add interraction in your member's area, something that people can't steal.

To clarify a few things, I said I made millions, but have also said I am not doing as good as I use to. Credit crunch and economy, unemployement, foreclosures etc.. have drastically shrunk the pool of potential customers with credit cards that have funds available.

Also you are generalizing "adult". Adult pic and vid sites, for the most part are dead and a good bit have gone out of business. However people promoting adult cams and dating sites, most of them are still doing pretty good.

You also have people who realize that even if the total number of sales shrinks in half it is still a lot of fucking sales. You just need to work a little harder to still get your piece of the pie. But if you trying to do it with a pic and vid membership site with no interraction, <- for most people.

I think the whole theme of this thread was how people have managed despite the struggle. Not the the everyone is great. I can say absolutely I wish I had my 2003 sales back. I am still here though.

I'm in a wheelchair, have been for years. While I get out often, a lot of my social activity is had via online. Chatting, message boards and what not. Online, I have legs.

Fact #1:
You can't spend another guys money. Just your own. So stop looking at others if it makes you feel bad. That's just a big illusion and it could make people feel bad about themselves whereas it's uncalled for.

Fact #2:
Some florish and others fail. Don't ask me why. It is like it is. There are no rules in live. Bing wants to be google but it's not.

Fact #3:
Strange? You should meet my mother in law....:winkwink:

Well,i adapted before 2 years,but the problem everything is in decline now,no matter what kind of bussiness model you have or what kind of site.

I too started the hole switch about 2 years ago but the hole damn thing went down too quickly !

SPAM MODE ON. The doll stuff is really really picking up why ? It's tangible goods. You can't get this stuff for free and it's adult related.
Now do as i did. SPAM MODE OFF

My point is, yeah adapt, no choices. You need to offer something special. Plain porn ain't working anymore. This hole biz is changing at the speed of light. It's behond anything that i could even thought possible.

Shit my english sucks tonight. (i'm having wine fuck it hehehehe cheers)

You have a good product but 7% seem's a bit low? ~15 would be more interesting.

Enjoy your holiday. I am always around...contact info in sig.

Might as well be my last year in adult, but I sure want to make the most of it

Most people in our industry believe the sky is always falling. Some of us remember the movement to limit the amount of pictures TGPs can use because they were giving away too much content. Then there was Google picture search that was giving surfers easy access to our content, and some of us complained about that. (At the same time some of us learned how to use Google picture search to our advantage.)

The truth of the matter is you can blame this on TGPs giving out too much content, Google picture search, Tubes.... The funny thing is no on in our industry seems to give any thought to other issues that kills us - such as the fact that a handful of websites now suck down more than half of all Internet traffic. That's sixty percent of our potential customer base out the window from the start. (I'm talking about Facebook, Ebay, Myspace, and YouTube here.) The Internet is now useful and entertaining, and we are being left behind.

No one in our industry seems to be accepting the truth. We are in the worst recession we'll see in our lifetime. People are loosing their jobs and their houses; Discretionary cash for cheap entertainment is at an all time low. More than half of the houses on my street are empty; I can name a dozen restaurants within a two miles radius of my house that have closed up shop. The problems our industry is facing isn't because of tube sites; Open up your eyes - every industry is hurting.

How have I kept my head above water? Blogs. I launched four more this week, all hand written. Cost me nothing to make, and after a few months each blog makes me some coin. While everyone is bitching, my blog network has been rising every month except for last month.

I have a different perspective because I didn't start making decent money in adult until 2006. I've had to work hard for each and every sale, have always focussed on niches, and have never been spoiled by the easy 1999 days.

To me selling porn isn't much more than monetizing traffic... I can do this in non-adult niches as well, but adult is a lot more fun :)

95 pct. of earnings in porn in the past = easy money

I suppose those that actually know how to sell can still make decent income

There's still money in adult biz :)

i'm here cause some parts of our business do better than ever, especially the content shop.

i just made $5,500 in a 20 minute phone conversation and will now go and have a nice evening with food and good czech beer. :)

Practicing my English - I need to practice being a Euro Trash

If it was for me only I'd be out already, might as well be my last year, depends on how it goes, if it works well, there'll be no reason not to milk the cow

I never though about myself as "adult" businessman, I've held many mainstream jobs and asked for my first real job in adult on my own, I applied for the job and I wanted it, hardly any other opportunity would allow me to try more crafts and travel the world in my 20's

:pimp:pimp:pimp