so now you want the fucking right to censor someones commentary for content you don't actually own

for someone who entire business is built on free speech it amazing how little you respect it.

Harmon, you do not understand it, sorry.. if you would at least discuss this with me in a somewhat civilized fashion like tblocker is, I would answer, but the way you talk, why bother?

tblocker, your example is flawed in the "encouraging" it... Our upload pages all say that you have to own licenses to the content to upload it. But, taking your statement and removing the encouraging part... so:

"so let me understand this, if i put online a tube site, and users upload all brazzers/bangbros/rk content for example, real users, so i build up a huge library with all this sites networks, until i get the DMCA, it would all be fine? and if after receiving the DMCA i put the content immediately down, it will be ok? i can't get sued then? Just one more question, what happens if the same content gets uploaded again after i took it down, and like this forever? If everytime i get a DMCA i take it down it would be legal what i'm going with my site?"

This statement is correct, yes.. and if this happened, all we would do is add you to the list of sites our team of people that look for our content on sites we do not put it ourselves checks every day. Because yes, we remove hundreds of videos from sites each day, including a few from tubes (although, as RycEric said himself, most infringing content comes up on non tube sites, by far).

DWB, I would very much welcome a system that would perfectly automate the process. I think Vobile is such a system which is why we implemented it. If something else came, I would implement it too, and we would use it for Brazzers and Mofos...

What I would love to see is a system to fight against file sharing sites, much much more important than tubes in my opinion...

Lots of the videos in the tubes are old and come from member area of sites closed since years, and their former owners have no wish or reason to file complaints. This include old VHS movies from amateur or small producers now closed. That's an huge amount of content that was produced commercially (also in russia, ukraine not in boureucratic way as in USA) but then no one of producers or closed-site owners would care or take the time to sue or just write a DMCA complaint even if they knew or seen it, they may make a laugh "oh look this is from that site I closed 10 years ago". Just digitize hundreds of european VHS cheap porn movies out of production from companies out of biz and you would get million hour long clips for a big tube with no likely anyone write any DMCA.

Different thing is content that is still in existing member areas from active companies and eventually also distribuded in DVD's, but how much of this material is in % in tubes?

Honestly, with the budgets you people have, doing the file sharing thing its pretty easy if i do a quick thinking, as they actually share it without non fucking re-encoding or so, the troubles of doing my service against you ( tube8, etc ), is that you re-encode videos in lots of different formats, cut pieces, etc and makes it pretty dam difficult to come to a final fingerprinting algorithm to check scenes ( I was thinking on my service i would had to come out with several ones for different encoding formats ) .....

But just a heads up, if file sharing is like it was a few years ago ( I'm not using those service anymore .... ), you just need a soft that can crawl those sites, download a small footage of videos, take a frame of the movie and check at the bottom right for specific pixels your brazzers logo always has .... There you would get almost all true positives, maybe some false results, but would be the less. As simple as that as it sounds, any more or less skilled programmer can do a job like that easily .... You can find someone like that with your budgets ;) ( Yes, i think even your videos should be safe .... as it makes all us bad, you are playing both sides, but the legit side you are playing, you are doing it pretty dam well and respectable so i dont want brazzers content to be out there for free .... )

So, Nathan, if my principles changed, i could start letting uploads to my tube and people uploaded your content all the time you would daily send me DMCAs and that would be all? Even when they uploaded it everyday it gets down? Thats what you are saying? Don't you get pissed off with this??? I mean, there is a lot of people out there that i think will start doing it as your content rocks ...

By being one of the "good Joes" and taking it down because it was brought to his attention. If it was intended to be there, respond as such. That would leave it up to the guy that reported it to contact and reconfirm.

Listen guys, go to Flash vids. Plain and simple. Inside your member areas. Let them stream it. What argument can you possibly have? They want to watch it later? They can. As long as they are a member. More money in the long run.

This is pretty simple. You give a kid a pail and a shovel (PC) and a sandbox (PORN) and he will dig all fucking day. Especially when all of the sand is free for the taking. He will make castles, drive his hot wheels through them, whatever.

Take the sandbox (PORN) away and all the kid is left with is a pail and a shovel (PC). He'll do whatever it takes to get back into that sandbox so he can use his tools (PC) and have the fun he wants to have.

You know, after this thread, the funny thing is that i'm seriously thinking on chaging my marketing strategies .... I already knew all this, but honestly, the only thing that stopped me was a principles thing and MAYBE some legal actions stuff, but it seems legal actions can't be taken if user uploaded it for what i got from this thread?

tblocker, we already do whatever we can... for what reason do you think people do not upload our content to other tubes? Of course they do....

And why get all upset over something I know I can not change? It makes no sense... I find a way to live with it...

Oh come on, is it cool if I start a manwin content owned tube site? Are you ok with that? I'll have no control of course. It's the user that does.

And here we are, two men in the same boat talking about the same thing. Money.

Yeah, you would sink my boat, but I can always build another boat. And I can do it in China. I can do it in the Netherlands. I can do it in fucking Antarctica. And I can do it cheap.

Is that the game you guys are calling out for?

EDIT: BTW, sig too big Nate

Show me ONE live example of a full length Brazzers video on another tube that wasn't uploaded today. Not a 5 min clip with a pretty thumb, a real PIRATED Brazzers video. Come on, you must have one nate

50 scumbags stealing your kids college tuition :2 cents:

Harmin, uhm.. the reason you will not find a full length video of brazzers on any tube is because we are good at sending DMCAs... whats your point?

Regarding your post before, if you actually think creating a tube specifically for brazzers is a wise idea, go try it... see how fast you get sued... you still do not get it...

Well... I looked at our 2010 database and there are over 100 million records related to piracy covering some 50 or so of the top infringing sites we sent notice on. The reason for this is because we ran out of space, on one of our servers, which is pretty insane to do when you're just talking about text files. :2 cents:

I get it. :2 cents:

Uploaders can be identified, using the legal system, and is exactly part of our strategy this year. It's working quite nicely. Ask the guy who uploaded 37K pics/vids to a popular tube site and found his account canned after the tube site received a court order for his info.

You mean you find a way to profit from it, but i guess if its legal ....

I think i'm right now in a serious conflict with myself .... If starting doing lots of things i just realiced are LEGAL but not ETHICAL and not doing so ....

LOL, i guess i will finally have to get a little bit dirty, as it seems there are not any more companies/studios even taking care about all this shit as nobody here actually replied that could somehow represent them .... Only you, LOL, so i guess i would had to get a little bit dirty just to compete, then a little bit more, i guess i will get all my body dirty all at once if i decide too and not just go slow, there is no space for slow players here anymore ....

Anyway, thanks Nathan for your feedback, LOL, you are clearly an UN-ETHICAL BUT BULLET PROOF SUCCESSFULL AND SERIOUS BUSINESS MAN, i'm not surprised about this, Brazzers came out and took down two huge companies like if they where two kiddies, its funny how this thread for me ended, but it seems it has no sense for me to develop such tool or try to fight someone else interest as there are no studios/producers here really even taking care of answering a thread like this, its not surprising they don't take any legal actions.

So, for me, its the end of this thread, right now i have a lot of things to think about, if finally cut my fucking principles and start doing tons of things i could easily automate and develop quickly which are not ethical but aparently LEGAL or stepping away from the biz ....

Do you think i could reach you sometime via private email for some consulting about doing some non ethical BUT LEGAL projects? I could even bring you some good ideas :P ( I know that if i consult you about something is a good idea i'm trying to develop, you will try to develop it faster than me, LOL, thats not ethical but legal, but i know what i would be facing so it would be my fault if i still request the feedback ;P But honestly, i must admit even when i not share with lots of people the things they do, i still can admire their determination and success, like a guy in my country says: "There are lots of good people, the problem is that the bad ones, are a few, but have dam strong determination ...", anyway, would love sometime to chat with you privately, would you mind? )

Ps: Yeap, i know lots will be dissappointed how i started this thread and i'm ending it, but honestly, if the very same owners of the content dont give a fuck, i won't give a fuck for them either, this is a breaking point and you are letting it happen, well, then i will have to play with what i have in my hands like Nathan says .... I'm even ashamed i'm writing this, but i have two options, or quiting, which would not change anything, or staying and playing their hame, i want to serve surfers good products i can be proud off, be recognized by them, all my friends love tube8 .... Ok, its legal, then lets play that game if no one gives a fuck about it .... It seems this is a not ethical business anymore ..... I can't keep being this way .... i need to adapt, and fast ....

Good luck and shame on you producers/studios ..... You let this happen .... I'm a mere affiliate, so for your laziness is that i got fucked up like this by Nathan and other people, i guess i will have to start playing that game too because you are too lazy to take care of your own properties.

Yes, i'm in a real mind conflict right now, LOL

Wait a second. In defense of the "producers/studios", a lot of them are simply too busy to be posting here and frankly do not care about this board... from what I have been told. It's more comedy to me.. personally speaking. There's a ton of people who do "give a fuck" :2 cents:

The thing is that, if its really user uploaded, the tube still gets profited and gets not punishment for this while his surfers audience keeps rising, and if its the owner who uploads it and its skilled enough, believe me, there is no way you could track him down .... It just came to my mind two ways of doing so without leaving a TCP track of all this ....

btw, something funny i always wondered, i see all the time this stuff about the tube/site/etc giving out server logs in order to track down someone, are you aware how easy that is to forge? I could do it by simple running a script and modify ips or even making it as complex as developing a daemon plugin or kernel module to forge them each time the web server wants to write the real IP so even if you where infront of the pc waiting for the log line to appear, it would not be the real IP ....

I would never rely on a server log ( On server side ), i would rely on the hostings companies switch logs MAYBE, but i'm not sure they really have one, and still if it did, i'm not sure you can match them technically speaking to the HTTP TCP connection that the HTTP WEB SERVER daemon thread/process that actually took care of uploading that content ... So then you would only have probes there was a lot of bandwidth going upstream from X IP ( which off course can be forged in many other ways, we wont enter on that one ), but you then had off course to track the IP which can be pretty difficult or even impossible if uploader is skilled enough, and on the other hand, it still doesn't probe the uploader uploaded THE CONTENT BEING INFRINGED, the switch would at most keep track of dates and ammount of bandwidth and maybe matching source/destination ports to the server, but server does not save on the logs the port from where connections come, and they are not fingerprinting the data that passes through them, actually i think that would be illegal .... that actually would be like the famous government sniffing emails/etc stuff which people wont never accept.

So you are on a dead end there too if you are facing a skilled enough uploader ( Which could be a non skilled at all honestly if he just connected himself and uploaded it from a wifi connection on a bar that has no cameras and you can't track him down [ The other options i was thinking are pretty more advanced and would let him use high bandwidth servers ;) ] ).

Well, honestly, i dont see a fucking sue or any troubles at all for Nathan tubes operation on XBIZ news, etc. On the other hand i see Nathan HERE giving out lots of feedback, so for me, its obvious they are still MORE lazy if they are not taking the time to watch or ask someone to take a look at this board. ( And again, that process, can be easily automated in 15 minutes with a simple script ).

FYI Pandora never was in the box, she just opened it :)