Clown :1orglaugh

Out of you and me, guess who mentioned stats, and who didn't?

You forgot the important part about these fun, kind, gentle and peace loving animals who are great with children:

It was the third time law enforcement officers have shot and killed pit bulls in the area in recent weeks.

In June, a Kern County Sheriff's deputy shot and killed a pit bull that attacked him and last week another deputy shot and killed a pit bull that had a family trapped in a car in Derby Acres, then turned on the deputy.

Earlier in the day off-duty Taft Police officer Veronica Sandoval shot and killed a pit bull in the yard of her Bakersfield home.

A lot like pitbulls, you have lost it, and have started attacking everyone in sight without even knowing why - way to go :)

they are great dogs until they come into contact with the rest of humanity.

But you're denying was I said about .22's People are going to get the best for the job, pits have the record, so they are a psychological edge over other breeds for the same job, people are stupid.
So there are more going to be used, more are going to show up in reports, it's simple numbers. A rot is a much mjore dangerous animal. But you want to kill the ones that are the most popular

As I post this, there is a Pit Bull Terrier sitting at my feet, I will defend him from people that show all the signs of prejudice that judge him solely by the actions of others.

Er... you surely meant "judge him by the actions of other pitbulls"

no, by the others was meant that pit bull owners know that the pit bull can be trained to do anything, they are an awesome breed. Those that train them for guard dogs, know they are worth more because of the stigma placed on them. While they have half the bite power of a Rottweiler. That stigma, though false, makes them better for the job. The pit bull in my house would just bark at you.

100 pink balloons for tragic Ayen

Young classmates of Ayen Chol, who was mauled to death by a pit bull mastiff dog in her Melbourne home last week, will release 100 pink balloons at their childcare centre today in memory of the four-year-old.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/10...#ixzz1WMM9fr4T

another heartbreaking story. i think it's time to stop the madness.

I'm denying what, where? You are a fucking rambling idiot mate.

Yes, especially when we're talking about made up breeds.

Pittbulls and Bull Mastiffs are very different dogs. :2 cents:

So now that we've had all "facts" as indivuals see it based on their very own and quite limited experience with dogs, what do the experts have to say about it?

Now I know that the GFY cowboys always know better than the professionals so it's hard to take the American Humane Society at their word.

Of further note, all of the national dog clubs and even the American Veterinary Medical Association have position statements denouncing the need or wisdom of such knee-jerk breed specific laws.

You will be hard pressed to find ANY Veterinarian anywhere that supports breed ban legistlation. I mean what could they possibly know about dogs? The average Vet probably doesn't see as many dogs in their career, treat as many dog bites or have any more education on the subject in general than your average GFY poster, right?

So on one side you have the knee jerk reactionaries and on the other side you have pretty much ALL of Veterinary science, the Humane Society and 100% of national dog clubs. I wonder which side is more credible?

the american humane association is not exactly an unbiased source.

How about the American Veterinary Medical Association?
How about virtually every Veterninarian practicing today?

I realize that your limitied experience and mastery of Google trumps pretty much everyone with any formal education on the subject of dogs and dog behaviour but for those who are not convinced can you go ahead and explain why again? Thanks in advance.

i will go with what the canadian courts tend to think.

Ms. Cochrane and the Attorney General of Ontario appealed different aspects of the decision to the Court of Appeal for Ontario.[26] In Cochrane v. Ontario (2008 ONCA 718), the Court of Appeal reversed the lower court's ruling:
It agreed with the lower court judge in finding that the “overbreadth” claim failed because the legislature had acted on a “reasonable apprehension of harm.”
It disagreed that the definition of pit bull in the Act was insufficiently precise and restored the original wording of "pit bull terrier" on the basis that, when read in the context of “a more comprehensive definition,” the phrasing “a pit bull terrier” was sufficiently precise.
It reversed the trial court and found that the government's ability to introduce a veterinarian's certificate certifying a dog was a pit bull would constitute proof only if the defendant failed to answer the claim: it was therefore a tactical burden, rather an evidentiary burden.[27]
On June 11, 2009 the Supreme Court of Canada declined to hear further appeal of the case, thereby upholding the Ontario ban on pit bulls.[26

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breed-s...gal_Challenges

even the US marines - god bless the troops - are wise enough to ban them as well.

the Marine Corps[2] has banned "large dog breeds with a predisposition toward aggressive or dangerous behavior,"[2] including pit bull-type dogs (among other breeds) in on-base housing and privatized housing, as have a number of United States Army,[1] U.S. Air Force and Navy installations.

Oh right I see courts are the experts in animals not the people that spend their entire careers working with and caring for. That clearly makes more sense and you're winning me over now.

According to Colorado?s state laws, no municipality may enact a law that is restrictive based on breed alone.

cently 4 BSLs were stopped due to public outcry or cost ineffectiveness in Colorado, Massachusetts and Oklahoma. However, California has recently repealed a ban on BSLs, allowing cities to adopt ordinances banning or restricting certain breeds.

It appears there's some confusion amongst law makers and they don't even all agree on your point. Probably just best to go with the people that interact with animals on a full time basis. Errr wait, that isn't you is it?

OK, I can't really write this any slower for you, I wasn't rambling, you should just put away the pipe when reading what I post

Why can't your produce a single Veterinary source on the subject?

Do you take your dog to the US Marines for check ups?

Seeing a pattern yet?

Kinda like our congress, they have very little degrees in economics, but will control our economy.

Good posts, information is what's needed. Most that are afraid of dogs are going to jump on any bandwagon that comes along.

It's not the dog, PBT's have been around for a long time.

vets are just too biased emotionally to make a clear decision about the matter. like pit bull owners themselves.

i put my trust in the the clear headed objective rationality of the law.

Personally I don't care to argue about it because it doesn't really matter to me. I don't have pittbulls. I do have one 10 year old Rottweiler left, who is currently waiting for my mom's yellow lab to drop the bone he stole from him so he can have it back (instead of just savaging him and taking it) in the backyard. Yes Rottweilers tend to make the same breed ban lists and it's a shame.

Ultimately BSL doesn't work, period.

Pit bulls are different; they’re like wild animals,” says Alan Beck, director for the Center for the Human Animal Bond School of Veterinary Medicine, West Lafayette, IN.

All the professionals are wrong, only judges (and only the ones that agree with you) are right. Some lawmakers (again the ones that you agree with and by far the minority) are also right. All Veterninarians are just emotional people that can't think straight.

I'm going to take this as you admitting defeat. That's really what it looks like. Thank you for making my point.

Anyway I've done what I intented to do and pointed out the opinions of the vast majority of medical professionals.

I quite literally don't have a dog in this fight as I don't want a pitbull because the breed doesn't appeal to me. You guys can go ahead and argue until the end of time on the matter.

So we trust this one Vet even if he's clearly in the minority? He's the one non-emotional authority on the subject?

Surely you're just trolling. You win this round good sir.

Sorry, but I may have to back hand this vet if I ever see him. Try to ask any other vet what they think, A real vet, not some joke who makes public statements.

you can't even spell.

dismissed.

really? are you serious?

You clearly put your trust in the wrong place then. Doesn't being so stupid hurt? What I love is that reading your posts only reinforces the fact that my dog (pit bull) is smarter than you are

take the blinders off buddy, it seems that everyone that doesn't share your opinion is biased or wrong.

Here are a few facts about the breed from the United Kennel Club website
http://www.ukcdogs.com/WebSite.nsf/B...dNovember12008
APBTs make excellent family companions and have always been noted for their love of children. The APBT is not the best choice for a guard dog since they are extremely friendly, even with strangers. Aggressive behavior toward humans is uncharacteristic of the breed and highly undesirable.

is the UKC biased in some way as well?

which job is that?
killing children? because thats what shows up the most in pitbull attacks.
scared maimed and dead children.

which job is that again?

again, opinions are irrelevant to facts and statistics.

no vets are going to speak up and say exterminate a breed of dog

ridiculous that anyone would use that as basis for their argument

i went to school with a bunch of future Vets, and they were all the same...they love all animals, which is why they choose to study for years and years to help them have the best lives possible...so it isn't surprising to me at all that you wont find many vets speaking up for the ban/extermination of a breed of dog..lol

this place is making me stupid, just by showing up and reading from here

Dogs don't look particularly interested in showing how strong their jaws are.

Yeah bad news on that front. You're already well in to the stupid category.

My neighbors labs would have eaten this things for a snack.

whatever you say joe rockhead

go pump some iron or something

So are you the one that left a child in the care of a 80 lb dog?

When I was a kid, I knew better than to pet a dog in a fenced area or one on a chain.

Pit Bulls are known to be good around kids, have been for a long time

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_18XkaPdQZu...le-rascals.jpg

While I am whole heartidly against breed ban legislation, I am completely for owner responsibility.

If your large dog gets out of your control and hurts or worse kills a person (child OR adult) you SHOULD absolutely be liable for any damage they do. I'm good with criminal charges too. We should be held responsible for what our animals do.

I've had Rottweilers for the better part of 10 years now. I'm down to just the one and he's easily the most gentle dog I've ever had. Would I leave him outside alone though? Absolutely not. Would I leave him alone with a child? Never! Why? Because he's a dog. He has never been aggressive to anything in his whole life but that doesn't change the fact that *IF* something happened he could do a whole lot of damage.

Your loaded gun might not ever go off by accident, but if it does, the potential for damage is pretty big. Same holds true for any type of powerful animal.

Punish the people not the breed and you'll put an end to these kinds of problems a whole lot faster.

Sigh.

10 pages of the usual (pit)bull shit. Whatever. The fact is yes, there are good responsible owners and there are also a lot of dipshits who shouldn't have a dog period much less a pitbull.

The other fact is that the bad owners are going to ruin it for the good owners. Seems more and more provinces and states and even a few countries out there are talking lately about possibly banning the breed. And quite frankly if they bring that kind of law into my province I really can't say I would disagree with it, at least not enough to fight it. Because the last fact is that people in general are sick to death of hearing on the news or reading in the paper about yet another pitbull attack, yet another kid maimed or killed, etc.

And for every pic or vid of a nice tame friendly pitbull there is no doubt quite a few floating around out there of vicious ones in action that could be posted as well. (did I just give this thread legs to go 20 pages?)

Argue the why's or where's or anything else you want, but the simple fact is that like most other fun or enjoyable things in life, it is the idiots who are going to ruin it for the rest of you. I almost said "us" instead of "you" there, but although I've been a dog owner for much of my life I've never owned a pitbull. It's never been a breed that particularly appealed to me, but that's not to say they can't be good trainable loveable pets. They can.

Maybe they're a breed that prospective owners should need to earn some sort of dog training credentials before being allowed to get one? Just a thought, it would certainly weed out most of the lowlifes out there who seem to gravitate towards owning a pitbull. And it would negate the need for an all-out ban on the entire breed.

It's the stigma that surrounds the breed that makes them a better candidate for the role of guard dog. People are afraid of them. That's why more are used for that job. Thats why there are more attacks. It's not like there are packs of them running around. There isn't.

you would assume other breeds have bad owners as well and as such those breeds should be attacking people as well. but they don't at the same levels. why is that? there is just something genetically defective about the breed and as such to dangerous and unstable to be around human society despite the capabilities of the owners and training.

does repeating something thats not true over and over magically make it true for you?
because here are the facts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...ported_in_2011

dog attack deaths

2006-
death by pitbull- 15
all other breeds- 15

2007-
death by pitbull- 18
all other breeds- 16

2008-
death by pitbull- 15
all other breeds- 9

2009-
death by pitbull- 14
all other breeds- 15

2010-
death by pitbull- 22
all other breeds- 11

lets pull 2010's pitbull fatalities:

victim's age and circumstances
5 years Killed by neighbor's two pit bulls
3 years Killed by his family's dog
6 years Killed while walking to a friend's home
5 days Killed by her family's dog
7 days Killed by his family's dog
2 years Killed by his family's dog
9 years Killed in her home while opening the door to let the dog outside
2 years Killed by three of his step-grandfather's dogs.
7 years Killed by a neighbor's three pit bull-type dogs and a mixed breed dog while staying at the neighbor's residence.
3 days Killed by his family's dog
2 years Killed by his grandfather's dog
56 years Killed by his daughter's four dogs
38 years Killed by her mother's dog
71 years Suffered a fatal heart attack when attacked by two of his neighbor's dogs
46 years Killed by a pack of pit bull-type dogs that had been abandoned by their owner.
65 years Killed while defending her husband against an attack by her nephew's dog
69 years Killed by 2 pit bulls a tenant was keeping on his land.
85 years Killed by her daughter's 9-year-old dog
84 years Killed by his son's pack of 17 dogs
67 years Died of complications of his injuries inflicted by his family's dog.
53 years Killed in her own yard by her neighbor's two dogs
25 years Killed by his family's dog



yup, they're great with kids.

looks like they're great for the elderly as well.

I'll bet you each one of these owners explained how safe and friendly their dogs were too.

not to mention the daily bites and maimings pit bulls do.

odd then that none of my listed fatality circumstances listed "killed by dog guarding property.

most say,"killed by family's dog"

odd that stigma thing......

today's pit bull news.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2...-city-heights/

The victim said he was on 39th Street near Thorn Street when he was bitten on the arm by a pit bull that was running loose.

Sure, right, they were killed by a dog they used for guard duty tied up with a chain.
I would expect you to be the first to realize the fault in that reporting

Most dog attacks are off site according to all the stats, which means bad ownership to me, not bad breed. I've never owned a small breed dog and have always made sure my dogs didn't roam the streets.

http://atts.org/breed-statistics/statistics-page1/ they have a normal tempermant.

It nearly always seems to be family that is eaten by any dog.

odd then that only one of the children killed by pitbulls were out in the street when it happened.

I'm sure those days old kids were up to no good out in the street when they were killed.:thumbsup
I'll bet their parents were busy telling everyone how good their god was with kids as they were driving the baby home from the hospital.
wonder if they're posting pics of The Little Rascals now.

right, and it always seems to be the pitbull that accounts for at least 50% of dog related killings.