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Getting shit traffic is eas6y, traffic guys will sell tons of it. Getting average traffic isn't hard, getting great traffic is hard, still can be done. The problem is the amount of traffic required to get a person interested in porn to buy porn. And to make a living. Made it bold so you can get it. After 12-13 years of feeding surfers with free porn, the vast majority have learned not to buy. That's the biggest success online porn can claim. Quote:
Trolls keep my threads going with their pointless posts. We're on the third page now. |
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Don't you read how hard it is to get 1,000s of surfers (TRAFFIC) so 1 will buy. :1orglaugh Or is it so easy you can troll here? |
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What do you know about traffic anyway? |
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paul markham = broke troll
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Paul, what you come up with makes sense to producers, but your preaching to the wrong audience here because most are webmasters who don't produce their content but get it from their sponsors. (or they just grab it from other sites).
If you are a producer you need to make relatively more profit because you have higher costs. Webmasters hardly have any costs. They need a server and the book html for dummies and that's about it. Us producers need a studio, models, flights, equipment, etc etc. For a webmaster to get proper sales, he needs traffic and good material. For us producers to get proper sales, we need traffic, and we need to PRODUCE good material. A webmaster can be happy with 10,000 hits per day, and 2 sign-ups. He'll be making profit that day. A producer needs at least 10 sign-ups a day to keep going and 20 sign-ups a day to continue growing. The way I see it is, that producers don't only need traffic, but also quality, unique material. As for the rapidshare problem: Producers need to protect their content. The following things are already done by some of us: 1) Stop the sharing of passwords completely using proper scripts. Most content theft is done through shared passwords, because content thieves make it a sport not to pay for anything. They will hardly ever pull their credit cards, download your content, and upload it to Rapidshare. It happens but not a large scale. I'm now using scripts that make sharing of passwords by two or more people impossible. (anything interested in this message me) 2) Embed user-ID in downloaded file and/or use watermarking technology to put user ID inside video-footage. If you find your footage on Rapidshare you download it, then you know which of your members is uploading your content, and you ban him to avoid further damage. 3) Use a service like removeyourcontent.com to have your content removed from Rapidshare, torrents etc 4) Some ban access to their sites from countries like Russia and Ukraine and proxy servers completely. I'm not doing this because I get a few Russian paying members from time to time and haven't caught them uploading my content yet. In my member sections usage of proxy servers is not possible though. If all producers would start using these methods today, things would get very difficult for the Rapidshare, PayPal and torrent mafia. |
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Is this "the industry"? That's pretty sad then. If you dislike Paul so much then why do you read them? Don't you have a production company to run? |
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maybe you think that whining pom paul is the industry? maybe you think someone gives a fuck ? in future address your questions to paul, he's the oracle of gfy |
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No wonder you think PM is a god. |
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its nice paul has a new little friend though, im kinda aroused
can i suggest a three way reach around to celebrate ?! |
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:2 cents: |
:1orglaugh Oh man this is rich. Markham TRUMPS all of you people feverishly posting to diss the guy...
He's got another 3 page 1000 plus view post mainly because are you are all magically drawn into his rants about the biz just waiting to blast him at every turn :1orglaugh If i really gave two shits i would sponsor a clinicial study of "The Markham Effect" because there sure as hell is one :1orglaugh Wait a second, I'm posting in this thread WTF...can't stop...from...hitting..enter... |
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What do you know about the product, content of a site? If my content is crappy, how come it's saturated. To saturate content, we need to sell it, especially in a main stream niche like Teens. So are loads of sponsors buying it, to saturates it? Which makes Squealers posts stupid, well more stupid. Or is it not selling to anyone and getting saturated. :upsidedow And the quality of the product applies more than many think and that's what this thread is about. When a surfer hits a site the product can often make crap traffic good traffic. You must see differences in conversion ratios, you're sending much the same traffic to different sponsors who convert very differently. When they sign up you see different sites retain longer than others. This is what makes traffic worth 3 cents per click or 6 cents per click. Numbers to illustrate the point. This thread is entirely about turning your traffic from being worth 6 cents per hit to 12 cents a hit. It's about offering something on the tour that 1,000 other sites in the same niche and style offer, offering something inside the site 1,000 others don't. Is that of some interest to you? It's about the product and as a producer of product that over the years has made me enough money to employ others and stay in business for 34 years it's something I know a little about. The truth is while sponsors spend a lot of thought, money on affiliates and traffic, also giving them everything and all possible assistance. They spend very little on the product. If you want every banner click to be worth more, sponsors are the ones who can make that happen. This is the problem. Quote:
That applies to 100s of good/great content producers, they simply were not and still not interested in working for online porn. Because of the money offered. In fact the good ones go the other way. So his restaurant ends up selling moldy crap potatoes. And eventually patrons stop buying. Cutting the quality of the product with so many potential buyers walking by, is madness. What I do know about traffic is how to sell to it and keep it buying. I leave the collecting of it to others. |
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His analogy works perfectly if there's only one grocer in town. When every other shop is a grocer, who do you buy from? If they're all selling much the same, price becomes the most important factor. If 99 of the grocers care little about the product and ones cares a lot to get a great product, then quality becomes an important issue. In online porn there's 1,000s of places to buy from and 1,000s of places to get it for free. So what's left other than just sending more/better traffic to a site? Is the only option to offer a better quality quality product. To care about the farmer, meet his needs, give him the tools and money he needs to produce a better product and instead of just stacking the potatoes in a big bin. Offer something more to the shopper. Like advice how to cook the potatoes or recipes. Or a real live person who will talk to shoppers. When buying potatoes, convenience is paramount for many. so we shop at a supermarket. Nothing is more convenient than getting free porn from a Tube site. We need to up our game in a different area than just better/more traffic. We've been doing that for years and if we aren't at the peak of our abilities today, we never will be. It's time to apply the thinking to another angle. |
god shut up man there are dozens of high quality websites that are loved by surfers and make loads of sales every day.
example http://hegre-art.com/galleries even at your best you couldn't touch the worst of that they produce. please just stop. |
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i know you will say the site is worthless because a foot was cut off in one photo but really man you just have no clue. |
i could go on and list a few dozen amazing websites off the top of my head which do killer sales even in the age of tubes.
sure sites that were built around a flashy tour and 20 paul markham bargain basement content videos have died, but that's good. that model was substandard and has been eliminated by the market. adapt or die. |
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ps This is a very fast moving board, and it's easy for people to rack up their post count, so I wouldn't take too much in the way of high counts being a sign of complete time-wasting. |
TheSquealer for President :thumbsup
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God please, don't shut up I enjoy your humor. Quote:
Met-Art are good photographers. Maybe we should see more of the whole sets and videos before making an assumption on the package. But they prove my theory works. If you have a great product, you sell much better. Stopping at just that is 1998. We need to up our game. Is it time to turn the dozens of loved sites into 1,000s and figure out how to do it to convert more of your traffic? The problem for 95% of this industry is they were never willing or able to spend what Met Art do all the time. Actually at my average I sold to magazines, a market that paid up to 10 times what 95% of this market will pay. Met-Art to my knowledge didn't sell in the market we sold to. Comparing 2 different fields. Compare Met-Art with Suze Randall and you have something comparable. http://hegre-art.com/films Here's a scene that was created by people who were on a lot more than $500 a solo girl scene and told to shoot 5 in a day. Why not apply the professional good budget Met-Art model of creating a product to the more popular forms of porn. Not the glamor style, all styles. Most of the porn today is created on a much different model and why ratios suck. Quote:
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dozens "off the top of my head" idiot. sites that i deal with and promote.
yes there are 10,000 shitty poor selling websites. as there are 10,000 shitty selling books, movies, restaurants etc. so what? |
no one gives a fuck about Suze Randall. people care about met-art, yes. no one even knows or cares about Suze Randall or all the other dinosaurs of the magazine age.
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On the subject of Paul Markham I am afraid you will find that what is said about him is true. If you say anything he disagrees with he will insult you and rant on of for page after page of the same rubbish until you lose the will to live. It is a great shame because it prevents interesting discussions that could happen here. |
Good post.
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I recently reviewed Twistys and found the image sets simply weren't good enough from many producers to sell to magazines. Too many duplicated shots, wrong poses, bad poses. Etc. Is the problem too little money after marketing costs or simply the lack of will. Because as PJ points out. Members love great content. The piracy problem isn't going anywhere. Unless there's massive Government control it stays where it is or grows. We have to live with it and adapt our model to a better one. Selling recorded porn is not easy, it's made harder when the content is much the same on 100s to 1,000s of sites. You protect your and the next guy doesn't. You still loses a sale. So we need to offer more than recorded porn. That's so logical it's amazing. Live sells. Adapting the live model to the paysite model more than we do is an option. The only examples I've seen were upsells to 1-1 which is every where. Would a site with live girls to chat to for the price of $30 a month and all the recorded porn sell better than one with just recorded porn? Would a site with live sex shows once twice a day, for the price of $30 a month and all the recorded porn sell better than one with just recorded porn? Would the cost of this be more than the benefits? At the moment I see a trend of more and more people going for the free option. We need to think of a new strategy than just piling in more traffic. It's probably just coming from someone else, who will up his game and take it back. |
Too bad Paul doesn't practice what he preaches....
I should go around and tell everyone here why they suck at being billionaires and how each of you are doing it wrong. No, I don't have a billion dollars, but I can act like I do.... and teach you why you don't, a double win for everyone! |
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Would upping the product game have a good effect on your stats? Would landing people on a site that was converting and retaining better make you more money? Are you scared of the possibility that other sites you don't promote will do it and this will cost you money? Are you scared the cost of it, might get taken out of your payments? So far no one has come up with any constructive debate against my ideas. Just the usual dribble of insults. We need more than insults to ideas of change. We need better ideas or people to think the ideas through and develop them. So far no one has done that, just the usual insults. PJ has shown very clearly there's a lack of truly great sites, compared with the saturation of poor ones. Alex pointed out we made more money by selling our content so much it was saturated. Alex also pointed out the problem isn't traffic, it's quality traffic. Same as tours and members areas, it's quality that sells. Then what's quality. 99-100 saying no on a tour. 499-500 saying no on a tour? |
1:3 ratios = fail, fact!
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No. Of course. No. No. Your theory is wrong because nobody converts 1:1, even people looking to buy - with an actual need, don't always buy. Quality is unique per site, project, product, etc... quality is in the eye of what the person wants or desires that is buying. Quality is not an equal standard set by you or anyone. Even the worst quality porn has value to some, and the best quality porn doesn't attract everyone. Now let's cover some of your posts in this thread. What is adapt or die? It's changing and moving and never sitting still, moving with porn, as it moves throughout various technologies, systems, etc... it's in places you and me and others, will never think of, ever... but it's waiting for us to find and monetize it either way. This is the history of porn, from as far back as history can track it, it has moved.... always! So, the "issue" I see with your logic is simple, you're focused on the 'internet porn on a pc', at that "free" internet porn on the pc. That's one bubble, one thing... one tinny ass, micro revenue stream, within a technology and is two-steps down within the system. Hello... McFly. If you want your ratios back, how about you start by not looking in the big pile of free loaders..... Huh? Logical eh? Btw, your ideas on content is flat wrong. You think all this crazy shit has to be done with content, all these rules... fact is, you have no idea what is good or bad in porn, because you are not everyone in the world. You telling these producers what they're doing right and wrong, is so laughable... You have no idea what "members" want.. I know sites that break every single rule you say that retain a 100x better than the sites you think are good. Oh and cross 'technology' wise, people don't give a shit... they just want the damn porn! I'm not cutting you down or being ass, but no bullshit - you have no idea wtf is going on in this Industry. You're not in it, accept the facts, why would you know this stuff? Other than people have been telling you it for like 2 years and you just ignore it. |
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You seem like a good guy ( I read a couple of posts from you ) Please, follow my advice: Don't waist too much time in here: 90% of GFY users are loosers and keyboard warriors. Il y a beaucoup mieux à faire que d'essayer de discuter avec des idiots qui, de toutes façons, ne veulent pas discuter mais plutôt te ridiculiser devant leurs cyber-copains qui les trouvent tellement drôle! |
Do you lot still not realise he is just fucking about?
He won troll of the year for a reason. He posts shit he doesn't actually believe in order to wind you all up. And it works. Time and time again. He's a genius and you're all idiots for playing his game. |
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Took me long enough to realise. Just trying to save everyone else some time :) |
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Even in the adult industry and even on a board called "Go fuck yourself" we should try to be PROFESSIONAL. The things people write about each other in here have nothing to do with professionalism but everything with amateurism. And again, I know it's hard. I can do my share of name calling on forums and even in private mail as well, but am far of proud of it. I agree (again) that I know nothing about affiliation. I never used affiliation much, I mainly rely on Google AdWords (working great for me) and SEO (paying specialists in India for that, works great as well). I want to jump into affiliation soon though because there's money to be made. As for traffic, I know all about it from a self selling producer point of view, but not from an affiliate point of view. But like I wrote before, I want to learn. I came to this board to sort out my little problem with a payment processor and it's great to see that there is so much else to learn in here. I wouldn't think that there's a lot of dummies hanging out here but I really get the impression that there's a lot of folks hanging out here who are making maybe $500 a month or less and consider themselves part of "the industry", either accepting this pathetic income or not believing they can do any better than this. Then if they're spending all day arguing with someone they don't agree with or don't like, I wonder why they don't get their ass moving and stop with the negativity and start working on their sites again. Porn Muslim is right when he claims that there are still plenty of sites doing well despites the tubes and the Russian cunts and I think what Paul is trying to say is that if you want, and if you work hard enough for it, you can still make good money in this web porn industry. So when you don't see me posting in here anymore, you know why that is: I got back to work, trying to increase my sales a little again. I'm definitely not going to stick around in this arguing about nothing crap for a long time! |
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As for investing in productions: I shoot a lot of different things from very mild to very extreme and pay models up to 5000 euro per day, cash. I fly them in from all over the world, including the USA. Many people told me, and still tell me, I'm crazy. But when paying models that kind of crazy money, they'll do anything you ask them to do, they push their own limits, and they'll keep doing it till 4 in the morning if neccessary to get the shoot done. My customers love what I shoot, they see gorgeous girls doing the filthiest stuff, and this is what porn is all about, and should be about. Being a good pornographer means you have to have the guts and be willing and be capable of re-inventing porn. Nobody is interested in copy cats. Remember the first Andrew Blake movie? Great stuff. How long did it take before other producers copied his style (black and white shots, slow motion, pans and tilts?)? And it was all CRAP! I agree on the piracy problem but we have to continue trying fighting it, or else! We need to do the things I listed in my previous post about preventing piracy. I agree though that if your neigbor doesn't do anything against it, it still affects you. Why would people pay for YOUR porn if they can get your neigbors porn FOR FREE elsewhere? I also agree on the LIVE thing. It's something I want to add to my sites soon. Pirates can never steal that from you, and they can never duplicate it, because they don't have the skills to produce. That's why they became pirate parasites in the first place :-) Has there been any kind of parasite in recent history that humans weren't able to get rid off or at least control it? |
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I'll stick around and I'll learn which people are serious and worth chatting to and which ones are the pretenders and wannabes. I'll save my dirty underwear for them :-) |
EukerVoorn, affiliates never talk real biz on chatboards and prob rightly so. :) Always been that way. :)
Damian, I disagree. :) I think Paul believes every word. I just am not gonna read all that. 3 lines max per post is the old school rule. I try and do that, usually unsuccessfully. :) Folks just dont read more than that. :) |
Paul, you do do a good job of spacing your text and I usually read all your posts. If I start a post I read it.
But Euker, you are way over the top. lol :) Producers might read it but affils will never. Noone knows what you said. :) What you posted is like 200 posts around here :) |
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