Fat and poor. Chicken and egg?

Sly is completely right, there is no reason why someone can't live off of <$100/month, I've done it for years while I was in college... it wasn't even that hard, it just takes some getting used to....

No argument there. Would be curious to see how it plays out for them. :)

In college I lived on chicken breast, canned tuna, potatoes, and rice. Could not stand Ramen. I probably spent less and ate better than all of my friends.

Impressive! :thumbsup

Yeah, i've seen the error of my ways and in my thinking.

I like your way.

I need to start to appreciate the fact that I have to stand in line behind 20 broke fucking idiots buying lottery tickets instead of groceries, every time I walk into a gas station to get something to drink.

Of course, we all agree that people need help... except no one seems to mind taking a poor persons money by encouraging them to gamble against impossible odds with government lotteries... then encourage that behavior with 8 figure marketing campaigns. I like your world. It makes perfect sense. Start taking 80% of their money, then give them back 20% in social services. Brilliant stuff. After all, the cornerstone of Liberal thinking is that people need to be protected from themselves.. so its consistent.

I've often asked myself...

When is being poor the poor persons fault?

Never? Really? There aren't any low life douchebags that make shitty decisions? There aren't any young women having 6 kids before 25 years old and raising them as a single mother? There aren't any drug dealers that just like being drug dealers? There aren't any people drawing state/federal funds just because they can? Interesting. I always assumed the situation was more complex than it is.

According to most, anyone who rents 24" wheels for their 1500.00 car is just a victim of circumstance... .not a fucking retard. I always assumed the opposite. I see how I was wrong.

I am 100% for helping people that can be helped.

I am 100% opposed to the idea that everyone can be helped if you just throw money at them.

Sly is one frugal motherfucker, good for you.

LOL @ Sly. Good stuff. :)

Nobody minds? I'm surprised you do, I thought objecting to the lottery rackets would be considered "socialist". I would have them banned outright, like ponzi schemes and other scams are.

It's not a case of never, obviously there are exceptions, but it's also not a case of "always", which seems to be the right-wing stance. And is it really the fault of the person bringing up the kid, rather than the deadbeat who abandons both of them?

If not, then instead of scapegoating single-moms, it should be recognized what an important job it is they're doing, for society. And if they can't do it adequately, because no father is there to help them, then everything should be done by the rest of society to help them, because helping them helps their child become a normal, functioning member of that society.

If the society stops giving a shit about people, abandons them because - for whatever reason - they're in a mess or need help, then how do you expect them to behave? What incentive is there for them to contribute to a society that doesn't give a shit about them?

If you think it's more complex why are you attempting to simplify it to a few basic strawmen arguments that I haven't made? I'm sure there are people who like being dealers, because there is always going to be a criminal element in society. However we can also look at what things should and should not be crimes. If drugs were legalized, and the supply controlled, then how many people would be out there dealing?

There's no problem admitting that a tiny minority of people are 'bad' in a society, but unless that's all you're saying why bother mentioning it? Problem is many people cite the tiny minority of bad apples and use it as evidence that everyone they have an axe to grind about is the same.

Again, I seriously doubt that accounts for more than a tiny minority of poor people. And if people are being led to believe that what they own (or can show off) equals 'success' then it's not 100% their fault if they feel pressured or influenced into buying shit like that.

I'm 100% opposed to using a tiny minority of people to draw conclusions about the majority.

Let them eat cake

http://threesaparty.files.wordpress....cake.jpg?w=500

Obviously we aren't going to agree. I'm not going to continue as i'm also working. I believe in helping people but I believe in the need for society to start holding people accountable for their behaviors and decisions. There needs to be standards and expectations. It's not OK with me for someone to pump out 6 kids by 25 as a single parent and expect me to pay for them.

Solving poverty in the USA is a two way street. It requires the active participation of society and the individual who is poor. You can't make an addict sober by throwing money at him. He has to understand he has a problem, he has to understand what the problem is. He has to understand what the solution is. He has to understand he needs to change and then want to make that change.

Walk down any street in the USA and tell a broke 25 year old that they don't need a new Iphone, expensive shoes, gold chains or nice wheels on their piece of shit car and see how far you get in changing people and their behaviors.

The US has created a society of increasingly self entitled, irresponsible and unaccountable people that have dramatically shifted in their thinking which built the nation in the last 40 years or so from "i'm going to live the american dream, work hard, sacrifice and build a better life for me and my family" to "hey man, you owe me".

....

By the way,,, yeah, I object to lotteries and gambling made easy. I don't object to gambling when someone has to have a job, save money, buy a plane ticket, hotel rent a car to do it. I object to gambling when someone with kids to feed, who is broke, unemployed or on welfare can walk into a gas station and blow their money because they are too dumb to do the very simple math and because the state is telling them its OK, because its for a good cause.

I don't support that either. For one thing the population of the US is mushrooming; doubling about every 50 years. I just don't believe there are actually that many people having 6 kids by 25. Ann Romney certainly knows how pump them out though.

I don't know who you think is disagreeing with that.

Companies spend billions brainwashing people into thinking they need shit they don't. Of course, right-wingers have no problem with that. That's what America is all about, right? No, it's about (or should be about) looking out for each other; not trying to screw the last possible cent from everyone.

I agree. And the man responsible for that disease of individualism, selfishness and sheer greed, Uncle Ronnie, is a hero to Republicans.

My objection is that gambling generally targets (rips off) people who can least afford it, the poor and the desperate.

Yes, Ronald Reagan had the idea to give every child a participation trophy no matter how bad they suck, lowered educational standards and produced tons of children's programming where the only message is "you're special" all while making sure black families have no fathers so both kids and fathers can reunite and spend quality time together in the worlds largest prison system which we all pay dearly for.

This nation had values. Today it has no values. Ronald Reagan's message was never "its not your fault".

Believing societal problems are either the fault of, or will be solved by a political party is silly.

Though I am pretty conservative in my thinking, I hardly think republicans are going to solve anything. Nor do I think the democrats are the cause of everything. In the grand scheme of things, we are talking about generational problems and when involving politics, trying to look at them in 4 year increments. The problems and root causes of the decline of an empire are never going to be found in the White House. The USA was founded and grown by people who were hungry for success. That was the national identity. Success was what it meant to be American. Today, that idea is dead. That hunger is gone and all that is left is people holding one hand out for donations as they use the other hand to point at anything and everything besides themselves for their position.

Go read the article and see the video. http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/05/news...html?hpt=hp_t3

They could of found better examples.

Sly that's terrific! :)

party time is coming

the old madness will end

and a new madness will begin

You have aroused me....

a dream..

:thumbsup:thumbsup

poetic indeed