Really? How many bankers went to jail ? None. They change the credit rules but give the banks 12 months to fuck the people some more. Gives the banks tons of money no fucking rules at all.
The market is at 13k
Please explain how its the end of capitalism because he wants to put the taxes back what they were under clinton.
Also why didnt Bush make the the tax cuts permanent he had the congress and senate.If they were so so important to the future?
Capitalism worked just fine when the tax rate was 90 percent. Now many didnt pay that but they paid more than they pay now. Thats why we had the finest public schools in the world, built amazing highway systems.

And to think the USA used to be a nation that celebrated success. Now everyone's babbling about "your fair share", which is not only a highly subjective notion (ironically, much like "Hope" and "Change") but also remains conspicuously undefined as that is of course, to the benefit of those who'd prefer to point fingers rather than accept any personal accountability.

The USA used to be a place where people would only think "i need to make more", "i need to do better" and so on, and is now a place where everyone is standing alone in a self important fog of narcissism completely confused as to why no one is making their lives better for them.

How much money went to banks from Obama in the form of bailouts with EXACTLY NO RULES AT ALL? How many billions?

Yep thats when workers made a living wage they could support their families with and their jobs werent shipped in bulk to overseas for shareholder value

how can you say he wants to end capitalism if he was giving money to the banks?

Not surprisingly, you missed my point. This nation was never about "a living wage" - it was about a dream, about more, about being better, about building companies and industries about everyone striving to better themselves financially. You think like an employee, which is why you'll always be trying to "make a living wage"

Again, dodging the point. Obama gave BILLIONS to banks with no rules... you know, the same thing you were suggesting was the problem under Bush. In fact, those fucking clowns drafted a 1000 page bill and voted on it the next morning, with Obama letting everyone know they don't have time to read it and the vote happened without anyone even knowing what its contents were.

If you want to speak and debate like adults Im all for it. You want to get nasty. I stop chatting.

Ask the same question to the guys buying in the shops.

Capitalism is fine, until you spend yourself into debt. See the debt of Western countries to understand how it's bad. Also it ONLY if you're not importing much of the goods you're buying.

That was back in the days when success was things being made in the US, people paying their share, people not hiding money in tax havens, outsourcing jobs. Their are different kinds of success, much of it is hated. Think before you answer that one.

I remember the deductions that were available back then. We could deduct everything even remotely business related. 90% rate was not even close to that. If you made $200k, 20 years ago you kept more of it then than you do today.

It doesn't make the system bad. Weak people will screw up in any system they find themselves living in.

good points Paul and you are right. When this country was great and did great things. It wasnt I got mine fuck you.
Also its nonsense that success isnt celebrated. Steve Jobs is treated like a god, bill gates interviewed all the time. Donald Trump has best sellers and tv shows that are hits.

But they spent more on education , you had public college and road systems were built and we had a bunch of wars. So everyone wasnt paying 12 percent. They also had a war tax.

off topic have a safe flight Minte.

Vietnam dragged on for a long time. There was terrible unemployment in the 1970's.
When I bought my first house the interest rate was 16%. And I had to put 10% into it.
Inflation was out of control.

Every generation has their cross to bear. This era isn't any different from the ones your parents and grandparents lived in. All that has changed is that there are better toys and gizmos.

In the words of Mr Dickens, "these are the best of times ,these are the worst of times. "

Thankyou, We hired a fellow this year that flys blackhawks for the Army Reserve. He is also IFR rated in twins so this trip I am taking the right seat.

Whats to debate?

Your views are pretty clear and consistent.

Democrats can do no wrong. Republicans can do no right. Companies are evil. Unions are awesome. Rich people are only rich because they unfairly took it from poor people. Times are changing, this time its different... workers of the world unite! etc etc etc.

You'd have a much different attitude about business people and success if YOU were the one who risked everything you had, put your home and property on the line, spent years working 80 hr work weeks, getting by on almost nothing, paying 10-100-500 employees competitive salaries, great benefits, if you were the one who's business depended on deadlines, production schedules, quotas, 5 and 6 figure leases for property, fleets of vehicles, massive marketing budgets etc etc etc etc etc. With 80% of them grumbling every single day about how unfair everything is, what a crook you are, how you take from the poor to buy your new car and so on.

It's not a shocker that no one can define "fair share" - why subject yourself to strong counterpoints and a reality check? Class warfare at its finest. You don't know what you want and how you're going to get it... you just know you want to take it from those who have more than you.

Not true at all. Also a fyi Ive had my own business since 2000. I Know the people that buy memberships to sites are middle class people for the most part. So if that keeps shrinking it hurts sales. Got to look at the big picture. Chinese dont buy porn memberships. Also Obama isnt a liberal at all, he is a Rockefeller republican. I was called a right wing plant on the daily kos because I disagree. Ive voted for two republican gov's and a republican insurance commissioner every time he ran. The first political campaign I ever worked on was a republican. I voted for Bush the first time. lol Reagan was my first ballot cast. Having a business I have to worry are purchasers of my product are going to have work thats above min wage.

Oh... I didn't realize you were really just concerned about the middle class because it affects porn sales. Definitely big picture thinking.

"the rich are getting richer... the poor are getting poorer". Same thing has been said since the dawn of civilization, yet strangely enough... here we all are... same arguments, same complaints, same blame game, same finger pointing.

Those that can do... those that can't sit around laying out long winded arguments for why they can't while attacking those that do.

https://gfy.com/showpost.php?p=19213310&postcount=27
By the way minte you hire American workers, I think you should get huge tax breaks for doing that. Politically we may see everything different but I respect you for that.

doesnt look like attacking to me

Well this is an adult industry board.

:thumbsup

:1orglaugh
Nailed it
So, that is all that matters?

Yep if adult is how you making your living. Like it if was a bakery industry board,people buying bake goods would matter. You understand, I have faith in you. :)

Wow... I never know rates were that high!

Yeah , at that time my dad worked for a bank and one of the benefits they gave their employees were 3 percent mortgages. At the time mortgage rates were like credit card rates so it was a huge perk.

tony, how much have you given starving kids in africa, who look at you like you live like a king?


and if you dont care about them, how do you expect any american to help somebody out on the other side of the continent that cant figure out how to provide for themselves?

and i love how people talk about progreesive tax %'s on here

if i paid 100k in taxes into the pool and you paid 1k, why am i getting any criticism from you about not paying enough? get to work making $, whatever you have to, picking cotton if it comes down to it, to come up with the difference

So, you think Obama is pro-adult?

I appreciate that, and we are looking into some employee training funds that are being offered at a state level, 3 weeks ago Lt.Governor was at our new plant to raise the WI.flag. I was able to visit with her personally for nearly an hour and she brought me up to speed on several state funding programs for small businesses.

So the people overspending on credit cards, the Governments borrowing money to inject into the system were all weak people. Got you.

The bankers were successful in making themselves rich out of the weak people buying all their worthless paper. Apple and MS send jobs to the Third World.

Look at the root of the cause to see the problem and solution.

For decades Westerners have been living the dream, paid for by borrowed money. We got fat, weak and lazy. Now hungry Third Worlders are taking our old wealth. Well not quite true, people like Romney are giving it to them.

Is that you taking handouts from an overspending Government? </sarcasm>

This is what the Governments of the West have to do. Sadly they often didn't. They pumped it into non profit, high maintenance projects that will always cost money. The problem is switching the system.

At the moment many countries, including the UK and US, are on life style support. They have pumped money in to the system to make it all look great and to get votes.

YOU CAN'T SIMPLY STOP THE SPENDING. It will be like a family stop spending money on food, you can't stop pumping money into a system that depends on it. Without that system collapsing. Look at Greece, UK, Italy, Spain, Portugal for the proof, yes they went too far and had to put the brakes on and now have to suffer for a long time to get their standard of living to match their income, as a country.

STOP PAYING BENEFITS AND THE SHOPS IN THE AREA STOP TAKING MONEY. Then think how much of that budget goes to Government office workers and that infrastructure. Sack those guys, empty those offices? Then they join the poor who aren't spending. So a few get taxed less and the spending is level, except for the extra police budget to keep the lid on the millions pissed off as hell. And the borrowing stays at the same level. :upsidedow

Cut the borrowing and all that happens is he money flowing into the US economy, no longer flows in. And that hits your joins. So you will suffer.

Stop spending on Military and workers in arms factories get laid off, soldiers get laid off. Not the type of people you want rioting.

Stop food subsidies, your weekly shopping bill goes up.

Get any more cuts you would like to debate? Go figure the consequences out first.

Most of you are looking for easy fixes and there are none.

This is your best post ever!

Couldn't agree anymore with it! It basically shuts up Rochard and Tony on the subject.

Yes, Paul. People who fall into such obvious traps are weak. What part of strong and solid do you see in someone who goes out and spends far more than they can afford?

Saying too much is the same as saying nothing. Make a point. not 40 of them.

Paul lives by the broken record technique

I disagree with you one a simple fact.. Education. While in this era education can be gained from many more places but it is a somewhat recent development that kids are put 50-100k in debit just to go to school to get an education.

Kids used to get their student loans at affordable rates and were backed by the federal government. This is the backbone that allowed our country to develop at a very high rate after world war two.

It wasn't just that we no longer had serious competition from Europe, but that we invested in education. It was Republicans once again that we can blame for the soaring cost of college education that we see today and why kids with out jobs leave school owing on average $50-100k.

They pushed for the end of direct lend and to privatize the lending process (oh sound familiar?) they fell short but were able to make the govt loan process hard enough with extra layers of red tape that colleges simply went to the private sector.

We now start to reap the consequences of this action and it will continue to compound as time goes on. Obama has actually tried to reverse this and ironically was helped by the market disruptions, because schools had no choice but to switch back to direct govt loans, because they could no longer get funding for students from the private sector.

No question school has gotten too expensive.

However, what ever happened to saving for an education? I had most of my schooling paid for by the GI bill. Along with that I worked to help pay the bills.

Young people that have to borrow ever cent to go to school probably should consider technical schools. THey are a lot cheaper and the odds of getting a job is better. There are lots of ways to get through college.

Unfortunately, too many students are picking the worst one.

FINALLY! Tony has admitted that Obama is just another lying politician! It's about time you saw the light!

Now hang on Tony...you've championed the unions so many times on here.

Wasn't it back in the "good old days" that people in this country were doing great things AND were all about "I got mine, fuck you" that made the unions necessary in the first place?

It's ALWAYS been that way.

And if you're talking about WW2...that's just human nature to come together during an emergency. We did it 11 years ago on 9-11 too.

But leave those two things out...and it's ALWAYS been people trying to get ahead for themselves and their families. It's never been a big communistic country all holding hands and singing "kum ba yah" lol