Average public student across the country is around $11,500. We have to take the average because prices per area do change. Here are some stats: Fast Facts

Here are some stats on private schools: Private School Statistics | Statistic Brain

The nonsectarian schools are most likely your "Ivy League" style schools for kids that are more expensive. People with money will send their kids to those schools regardless of what other schools are available.

I went to private school for a few years and then public school (the best public high school in my area.) My brothers went to private school. They hands-down had a better education than I did. If I were to have kids, they would be sent to private school. No question.

So, what part supports what you said? Or even backs up any other number than tuition fees (that is not synonym to cost of education).

There is no doubt a ton of wasted money in the public school system, but there are real, legit reasons for the increased prices as well. For example, a private school can pick and choose how many students it lets in and which students it lets in. In a way this allows them to pick the cream of the crop. Of course there are going to be kids there that don't like school, but overall when parents are paying handsomely out of pocket they will be more engaged and overall there will be better kids that are easier to teach. Public schools don't get this luxury. They are often overcrowded and they have to handle every kid that comes to them. This means the troubled kids, the slow learners, those with special needs etc. When you are forced to deal with the masses you will have to spend money to deal with the variety of situations that are going to occur.

Certainly schools can do better with the money and could be run better, but to suggest that private school tend to cost less per kid and are better without qualifying why doesn't tell the entire story.

Sly turned me on to a book called Practice Perfect. It is actually about a consulting company that works with educators to improve their teaching... but the lessons of course apply to everything. Learning is learning. Teaching is teaching... regardless of what is being learned or taught, the core methods and how the brain itself learns is the same.

Reading it and understanding what it actually takes to be outstanding at anything, the personality traits that are required, the passion that is required and the dedication that is required and based on my life experience with teachers, I just can't imagine a a bright future for our public schools. Even those that actually want to teach or that have passion for it, are often mediocre at actually teaching... meaning, just showing up and going through lesson plans and liking kids, does not constitute effective teaching.

My view is that the education system needs to be radically changed in this nation, that unions need to be kept out of it and that children need to be put first. People need to stop acting like money makes for better education, when we are being crushed by a world spending far less... and most importantly, parents need to be involved and start demanding more from their kids as well, which is also missing.

Anyway, to me, education is like discussing the best chair placement on the deck of the Titanic, arguing which chairs are more comfortable... or where to place pencil sharpeners. The system has been failing for many many decades and not improving in spite of MASSIVE increases in spending.

Sure sounds like healthcare

So then you'd be paying for public school and private school too. Like my neighbors, kids are grown, but they still pay a large part of their property taxes to the elementary school even though their kids are long gone.

I'm an advocate of charter schools, I feel they tolerate less, teach much more...but if I had to be in an inner city again, I would likely choose catholic school. As far as teaching goes, at least in Philadelphia, they are second to none but expensive for most people. Especially when you have a few children.

Public school teachers teach for the test, not for the education anymore. It's sad. They can only do what they're told.

Our 5.8 million earned us the lowest test grades in the state of New Jersey I think. And there's ONLY 340 kids or less.

I completely agree that the number of actual, high quality, teachers is pretty low. I enjoy watching baseball. I like putting on the mitt and throwing the ball around in the back yard or going to a batting cage and taking a few swings. I even played baseball in grade school and high school. This doesn't mean I could ever in a million years play at the pro level. The same goes for teachers. Many like kids, have a passion for teaching and want to do well, but don't have the actual skills to do it. Not to mention a system that is in place that hinders them at every turn.

The Finnish lead the world in education and they do it in an interesting way. In that country teaching is considered a very noble profession. They only have a few schools that actually teach and train teachers. They accept one out of every 18-20 applicants to the school. After graduating you work as an assistant for a while before you ever actually teach a class. They want to make sure the best of the best are teaching their kids. By placing such high value on the job and demanding such high results they are able to get the cream of the crop as far as teachers go so every classroom is led by someone that really knows what they are doing.

Going back to my original point, I was just explaining some of the reasons public schools cost more per student than private schools. More money doesn't solve the problems. You can throw money at things all day and never fix them, but there are inherent costs that a public school has that most private schools do not.

its a great idea to do at all schools :thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup

The Finnish example is also used in that book and another - The Talent Code which is also a great book on excelling and learning.

I had a teacher in my gym that was pretty lazy. Actually very lazy. It was group classes - Crossfit type training and there was maybe 40 people in the group. I slowly shifted from playful banter and joking around to push her to just saying "look, if you aren't going to push yourself or make an effort, you can't be helped". She stopped and looked at me and said "everyone's best is different". I was floored. First, the superintendent of her school district was also in the same group working out. This woman is feared by all the teachers and we had a lot of them because of our location, referrals etc. I said something like "your best... are we seeing your best right now?" and she started explaining that everyone has different abilities and has to be treated differently etc etc etc and I told her "everyone rises to the expectations you set for them and demand of them" and she started arguing that I didn't know anything. I stopped the music and told her that I was deeply offended... not because she was lazy and didn't even pretend to try, because I saw that often, but because she was a teacher.

What baffled me most though was how she could be employed as a teacher with her attitude AND talk like this in front of the one person that has to ultimately decide whether or not she has a job in her school district or not.

She is correct in that everyone's best is different, however, the question is are those people actually doing their best and it sounds like that is not the case with her. Figuring out what someones best is and then pushing them to achieve it is a challenge and a talent.

I had a history teacher in high school that was terrible. Mon-Thurs he would sit and read the chapter from the book to us and let us take notes. On Friday there was a test about that chapter and you could use your notes. It took my buddy and I a few weeks and we figured out all he was doing on the test was hitting the sections in the book that were highlighted or in bold. So you could go through your book, make notes of those areas and ace the test and you could just zone out all week and not pay attention.

Somehow he had been teaching for 30 years. I can say honestly I don't remember one thing from that class that has anything to do with history.

That book you mention sounds interesting. I'll have to check it out.

education should be free for everyone

and with free I mean paid by all tax payers

Public school here is of course free - even illegal immigrants are admitted to public schools at tax payers expense, the issue is that the quality of public education in the US has been sliding downhill for the last 4 decades or more while spending as the solution continues to increase at a crazy pace... hence public debate about allowing tax payers to use that same money to send their kids to private schools which completely crush public schools in terms of performance and other solutions.

First and foremost, the problems with education are cultural where parents are increasingly absent from their child's education in the US and with unions, where bad teachers can't be fired and so on, the important issues won't be solved by government or spending.

its really bullshit

What kind of collage should they be getting for picking tomatoes?


Like this?

https://mhsartgallerymac.wikispaces....collage_11.jpg

Finally someone that society and the publlc school system has failed miserably weighs in with an expert opinion on the topic.

in the US my understanding is teachers standard have been lowered several times to accommodate 'the less gifted intellect' to teach

It can vary from state to state, but for the most part you have to get a teaching certificate, which basically means you took certain classes, passed them and passed a test. Getting a job can vary in degrees of difficulty as well. Good school tend to be harder to get into so the lesser experienced teachers tend to end up shitty schools.

In the end, being a teacher now (ever since No Child Left Behind) is more about teaching your kids to pass the standardized tests than anything else. The best teachers in the world aren't going to do very well if they are forced to teach a shitty curriculum.

In other countries (like Finland) the decisions about education and how it should be run are left to educators and people who have devoted their lives to education. Here it is in the hands of politicians.

Why doesn't state offer free education in private schools if those are so great and cheap?

We have a mixture if private and public schools around here. Both are free for students and it doesn't really matter who owns the school, and it isn't even a detail to pay attention to. You just apply to what you want and if you get in, you get in. You know, you get in based on your own performance, not based on your wallet.

I'm just guessing here, but I would guess because if the government starts giving money to something they want a say in how that money is spent. So if private schools were being paid for by the government the government would get involved and likely fuck it up.

Works just fine in here; and there are anyways standards for the teaching. You don't need to know the school name to tell how someone is educated in the school. You can't just put up few chairs in the park and call it university and start giving diplomas.

So, we have standards for the education, but it is up to school how they meet the standards.

That is one of our problems. We too have standards the schools must meet, but the problem is that these standards come in the form of test and graduation rates. If the school doesn't do well at the tests or has a low graduation rate they get less money. So the people running the schools do everything they can to get test scores and graduation rates up. This doesn't mean helping the students actually do better, but instead how to massage the numbers so they get paid.

An example. My nephew, when he was in 8th grade, failed every class except for PE. He was still allowed to graduate. In high school he got expelled early his junior year yet he was allowed to do a few packets of work and graduate. He can barely read or write yet he is a high school graduate.

It makes no sense to me that the way they punish the schools that are doing poorly by taking money from them. These are the schools that need help, but instead of trying to fix them it is more like everyone tries to figure out how to avoid it and just let it rot.

if you are discussing the US system, it fairs quite well against the rest ofthe world if you take out the underpriviledged school systems.

Hahs... get kids in the UK to clean up after themselves!!!? Joke right?

What about there human rights; It's not politically correct; Health & Safety says it's too dangerous. *saracasm* :1orglaugh

But yeah this should be he case in all schools!

But then again this should also happen in the workplace!

Equality is key to respect.

:2 cents:

Well, in our system we have to pass individual courses too. Though sometimes this doesn't make much sense. We have compulsory and somewhat hated Swedish lessons. I failed at starting exam and in prep-up exam. Despite of that, I did later on pass all the courses required to use Swedish in our administration (we have two languages), but they still made me to pass that starting exam years later (so that I could graduate), even though I had already passed the whole shit.

public schools are fucked up BECAUSE they are operated by civil servants... I.E. government employees... having government employees run private schools would defeat the purpose ...no?

one thing we have learned in the last few years is SEX is so dangerous you should wear a hazmat suit

not sure how it is in your country ... here in the states only 47% pay federal tax and schools are funded in cally are funded by property owners

Well, I don't generally agree with that kind of opinion about government workers, but the issue is that you got the whole idea wrong. The private schools are private, but government pays the students education. Just like if your parents pay your education, it doesn't meant that they operate the school. LOL. :)

I went to an expensive private high school where I was in the "Tuition Aid Program". We had to vacuum 2-3 class rooms after school for 2-3 months out of the year.

Meant I had to stay about 1 hour daily after school & by the time I'd get home on the bus it was dinner time. Total pain in the ass.

Also meant my tuition was cut in 1/2 :thumbsup

we don't have a property tax like yours - there is one, but much much lower. and it has nothing to do with the education system

here all public schools and universities are paid from the general taxes - there are private schools, even quite expensive ones, but only a small percentage of kids go there

Really? Once you remove all the failing kids and failing schools from standardized testing results, the scores improve?

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

i dont know really why gfy lets you even post here. everything you do is some krazy attacks shit. i guess the gfy clown 2.0 :2 cents::2 cents:

Haha.. thank you! For the first time ever you attempted to use punctuation and wrote a post without talking like a 1/2 retarded gangbanging jerk off. I'm sure i'm not the only one that appreciates it.

I really didn't think you had it in you.



(strongly suspect someone has hacked your account)

what is general tax? fed or state?

He probably meant that education is paid with taxes, and the taxes come from different sources. Opposite to you saying that in US property owners pay schools. You know, tax is a tax.

Here in Finland we have "state" (municipality) taxes and government taxes. Education is funded by both, by varying divide. Government gets the biggest share from all taxes (53 %), collecting wise I mean.