Fiddy fight the good fight, Paul . . .

I never said no girls were making $100,000 a year. It's only $2,000 a week so not great money for a girl with all the right things.

Also how do you know what they make are you in charge of their accountants or the one who pays them the money?

I never said no girls were making $100,000 a year. It's only $2,000 a week so not great money for a girl with all the right things.

Also how do you know what they make are you in charge of their accountants or the one who pays them the money?

Are you making $100,000 a year with your white label?

this hits home for me, except only 15 almost 16 years. 100% true. :thumbsup

The problem we have is with all the bullshit that has occupied this industry for decades. The large egos of everyone "knowing" someone who has to remain anonymous, the high rollers who want to keep what they do a secret, the guys with crap sites saying they make a fortune from, etc.

The biggest bullshit is that the internet is a global market you can make money from selling porn to countries that never had porn. Where are those countries and how many sales do they bring in? We sold porn before the internet in mainly US and Europe, with some sales in Japan, Australia, South Africa and a few S. American countries bringing up the rear. So what country now supplies a major part of your income?

Compared to 15 years ago it's dog shit. It has 100% without a doubt shrunken.

nobody doubts that it shrunk for you...why do you think you can speak for others?

Realistic, i think it shrinked for like 90% of people, regardless is cause change of cake share or just general decline.

i agree that 90% did not get the curve when things changed.
this is why the other 10% have a good life now.

but it does not mean that only this 10% are left in the biz. there are a lot of new people in this biz today and as they did not start in paradise they learned from the start that money will not come alone.

Yes but those new people i think more belong to performer side of business.

Everyone is screaming that the industry has lost people like me, content producers. The amount of money content producers took from online porn was minimal. The biggest change is the loss of affiliates from the process.

Taking 50% + all the help they asked for was too expensive and frankly not needed. Affiliates don't create surfers they merely directed people already looking for porn to suggested sites.

Now girls can earn $100,000 annually if they're good. They can also do all their own promotion and deliver the product to the customer without someone else's paysite. But girls now getting what affiliates and sponsors got doesn't indicate a growth or shrinkage. It only indicates a change.

What few girls can do is find a pornographer to shape and mould them into something more than amateur or even a self shot product.

Our little business was finding 20 new girls a week who would do porn. We selected the best 10%.

Multiply that with the rest of the industry and you can only wonder if the number is the same.

Models are making more money by taking the very big chunk of cash affiliates and sponsors took.

Meanwhile, her very first week:

https://i.imgur.com/jalrN86.png

paul will call it fake news

When an industry declines for 90% of it's people it's only common sense that the remaining 10% see a big increase in business.

So any "evidence" of an increase of the industry has to be backed up with solid reasons. Because with 90% suffering a decrease the over all picture has to be the industry is shrinking.

But let's not common sense and basic business acumen get in the way of self delusion and dreaming.

Paul, we get it. You fell off. It happens. The only reason is because you failed to adapt. Theres no secret formula, you just failed to adapt.

I know it probably sucks for you seeing these models doing their own thing getting rich easy af with no help while you had to put a lot of effort into your old stuff nobody wants to buy, but that's life now.

this industry did not decline 90% - actually it tripled up - what gets hurt are 90% of the old 100% what leaves us with 210% successful people.

https://i.imgur.com/HoKiCLq.gif

https://i.imgur.com/lY5wWx8.gif

https://i.imgur.com/XqyVjeQ.gif

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh Best response to him ever! I love Adam Sandler movies!

You gotta give it to Paul that he isnt going down without a fight (whichever his fight actually is) . . .

In June of 2007 my wife had a near fatal car accident. I spent the next six months looking after her, the business and our daughter. Then it was discovered I had stage 4 cancer and my wife spent the next two years looking after me. This is well known by those who were here then.

In January of 2008 we retired from porn.

If you think girls can shoot Met Art, Brazzers, Fake Taxi or my style of content, you're a fucking idiot. What girls are capable of is promoting themselves so it does suck for you seeing these models doing their own thing getting rich easy.

Cutting out the expensive part of the process, affiliates will make them far richer and quicker than hiring a pornographer to shoot them.

Please explain why.

The 90% who are doing less now than 10 years ago has to include a lot of people who have dropped out completely and a lot who now concentrate on doing other things and some who have sites on auto pilot. So any main player has to be getting more traffic.

The bulk of that traffic now goes to Tube sites, which make money from selling ads to people who will buy porn. The big change is the ratio that will now buy porn. In the days of TGPs the ratio was 1-200 on average. Clicks are now sold for $5 a 1,000 and everyone knows you need 5,000 to 10,000 plus to get one sale.

this is nearly 12 years ago - do you think the biz slept in this time ?

actually I like the metart content but it was always a niche to very special customers (even in the good old days).
to shoot pics like metart today is not hard. but i am sure that you do not even know what a lightfield camera is - so I will not waste time on explaining that.

why should an affiliate go on this 2 or 3% of the whole pot ?

I think you still believe that affiliates are webmasters that are building sites.
IF an affiliate is building pages today then they are landingpages that are fed with purchased traffic. and on this landingpages he can sell every day whatever he wants within 5 minutes. and if the market change he jumps in another 5 minutes on another product.

I think I explained you around 5 times alone in this thread that you are talking bullshit about clickprices and conversion rates.

it shows again and again that you just ignore the facts and keep on disputing on your knowledge level.

Maybe all you bright know all guys can point to sites or content from a girl shooting herself or her boyfriend shooting her that is as popular as Met Art, Brazzers, Fake Taxi or any of these https://www.pornhub.com/video?o=mv&cc=gb.

The trend now is moving towards more amateur level porn because it's becoming too expensive to spend $500 for a solo girl scene or $5,000 for a B/G if 50%, or more, of the turnover is going to marketing.

Today it's becoming far better for models to shoot themselves for a cheap product they can market themselves, cutting out affiliates and sponsors. The amount of money it would cost to hire someone who can shoot good porn of them is minimal when compared to the other costs. But few can afford it.

Anyone who thinks amateur is an excuse for self shot or boyfriend shot porn is an idiot and knows nothing about porn production. Amateur means a real performance in a real setting, not an excuse for shit porn.

:thumbsup

I'd disagree with that. There's new affiliates coming in on the cams & dating side pretty strongly and even the pay sites side. I know of one guy who creates Snapchat accounts based around sponsor content, watermarks with his own domain (redirects to his aff link) and does very well for example.

I always use the transition from horse and buggy to gas-powered vehicle analogy. Transportation industry grew quite a lot after that switch - both market-size and industry size. I am sure a lot of the well known horse and buggy builders missed the train then, too, and bitched to their wife about how things used to be before that asshole Henry Ford came along and out-smarted + out-worked all of them. The smart ones transitioned and the younger generation moved in on the "new" side.


I would also note that companies like AdultForce and CrakRevenue focus quite a lot on inbound marketing for affiliate acquisition - whether at trade-shows (both adult & mainstream) or online.

Tons of small affiliate programs shut down over the last 10 years and most of the ones left don't open new sites anymore and just leave their old sites on auto pilot.

That affected lots of people providing services.. Like content providers.. programmers.. designers....

The difference between him vs you and I is that we can log in to any number of advertiser accounts and see current rates. He's never done one media buy.

In other words, he's talking out of his ass.

5 years ago, Apple was in the news for a whole fucking cinematic style movie being shot strictly on an iPhone. Few months ago they announced a new iPhone that has a camera system that puts that iPhone camera to shame... You're out of your fucking mind to think that your special snowflake skill and equipment 12 fucking plus years ago is the only thing that can shoot high quality content.

Sit down, Paul. Seriously. You don't even know what you're talking about anymore.

paul does not understand the world and he thinks what happend to him happend only to the porn producers.

I have another example of a good friends of mine who makes his live as a papararazzi photographer.

he is in the biz since 30 years. the prices he receives today for his photos are less than 5% of what he got for the same pictures 20/25 years ago.
when he goes to a big event to take photos and comes home - there are already 10.000
pictures published in the internet from people with smartphone cams.

magazines are buying them from amateurs for 20,30 or 50 euro when he got 1000 or even much more for his pics in that time.

so if he would someone like paul, he would possibly blame the smartphone industry and tell them that they don´t make money. but fortunately he is not such a fool. he opened a picture agency - buys rights cheap from amateurs and resells them cheap. he sells per month around 5.000-6000 pictures for small money instead of 10 pictures for big money and can stay at home.

Say hi to Andy! :winkwink: :thumbsup

I just picked up my iPhone 11 Pro Max that I ordered, turned the camera on, flipped it directly at myself, and snapped the stupidest picture ever. Still better quality than Paul's best work.

I will - but I did not mean andy - andy is not in this biz that long but he also lives quite well as kind of a newbie.

Not just small sponsors have gone. Look at all the big sponsors who have left the business. Some sold at to Manwin/Mindgeek because they saw the future. Some sold to anyone who would buy them. Some couldn't even do that.

The big change is we now give more away more and more. No one is saying how much they earn from selling 1,000 clicks to a middle man who then sell it to a site. What it's not priced at is what we used to get from TGPs traffic.

Now try to shoot a set with an iPhone and sell it for $5,000 non exclusive.

How many of your famous $5000 sets have you shot per month on average?

As someone who never attained film school or Photography Academy, you were always being higly overpayed.

this is getting as silly as as the last night's democratic debate....iPhone, schmai phone...who cares. It is ALL about the quality of the content and how is it lit and shot.

we use 10 year old cameras and shoot in 2K ( HD)

here is the " Grandma" :

http://www.cinerent.net/image/cache/...03-800x591.jpg



..and we will use them for another 10 years....:thumbsup

nevermind......

How many non-exclusive sets did you sell for $5k? Not many if you failed. :2 cents:

$3,000 for UK and US license for one year, $600 for various EU license, $1,400 for online sales. This is for a solo girl image set, PRO paid more for the video that went with the set, Seventeen paid $600 for a set and a video. Roald has said they have most of our content.

Lesbian and B/G paid even more in all markets.

You came into the market not under the illusion that online was the best place to sell content. Experienced shooters were aware of far better markets, which is why I'm the only offline content provider who sold online via his own stores. People like DDF and Viv Thomas found webmasters who could run their sites for them.

The problem was all the people I approached wanted me to give them all my content on a 50/50 split of the profits and no control over the back end of the site. So I turned them down as that was a recipe for con men. If a webmaster had built and run a site for me he could of made a fortune and we would have shot what the online market desired.

Please quantify "failed". Because If selling sets for $5.000 is a failure then we failed and so did you and other people.

you dident answer the question

It illustrates how little these guys know about porn.

The most important thing about porn content is getting the right model for the style and niche. Then how the content is shot, this takes the real skill. Models need directing to suit them and the content, too blase they need to be coaxed, too nervous they need reassuring, etc. The right poses and angles are important. Today lighting is pretty easy if you know what you're doing. Back in the day of film all we had were light meters, special Polaroid cameras and experience.

Try shooting anything indoors without light and see what a mess it is. People who claim to shoot pictures on an iPhone have never owned a phone or they would know they're talking stupid. :1orglaugh

Your own thread where you said you failed.

The answer is the majority. Some like the lesbian sets and boy/girl sold for far more. What made our sales so high was getting the online sales. If you knew anything about this business you would know why the earnings were so high offline.

Imagine all the porn customers in the US/UK having only 12 major companies to buy magazines from. Penthouse, Playboy, PRO, Galaxy, etc. The only way to compete is by customer loyalty, men buying the same mag year in and year out. To get that they had to pay the best price, something online failed miserably at.

Magazine shooters like Suze Randall, Viv Thomas, Steve Colby, Steve Hicks, etc without a huge budget. Similar happened with the video market. Do you think companies like Vivid, Private were spending $3,000 per scene?

What I've used is the production side of the industry to give you an idea of it's size. Now treble it to see the size of the retail end and Europe and the rest of the world. All online did wad combine the two retail and production to discover the vast wealth in porn. Then split it with 10,000+ sites selling porn and 10.000 giving it away for.

Now people see the high traffic numbers and believe few were buying porn before online gave it to them. Imagine 12 companies like Mindgeek in the business. Fabian Thylmann only put lots of companies together by giving away more than anybody else.

So when I see stupid people saying we failed, then think what must of happened to StefanG, Trainwreck content, etc. And the majority of paysites, affiliates and others desperate to keep secret what they do?

Hahaha, Paul, you are a riot!

And you still did not answer the question - how many sets at $5000 a piece did you sell per month?

I'll help - a valid answer would be for example 5.

And not a wall of text trying to deflect. ;)

But keep in mind: your company records are public.

And I know my content business has no future. But I knew this years ago and that's why I left and do totally different stuff today.

Now I could tell you too about all the other things you are wrong about, but since you will as always completely ignore what I say, I'll save my time and effort.

But for the love of God - it's must HAVE and not must of...

Nah man.... that's correct Medieval Phonetic Englisch....