Amongst the dead how many Resistance Fighters and weapons were found?

Sort of shoots your theory out the water.

normally i am against us invasions but i can understand them shooting

if you were there risking your life 24/7 with the fear behind you that you could be shot every minitue you would react different.


we can talk easy sittin behind our desks on our asses.

but if you are afraid you react in other ways.

so if there are cars coming fast you are afraid its another suicide killer wanting to kill you


on the other hand i respect the italian security gard very much
he saved the life of the hostage with his own life


to put it in a nutshell i can understand both sides


you cant only blame the us soldiers

Im sure thats only partly true.

The brits most likely would have done the same thing, So would italians.

A car ramming at you is alot more dangerous than a guy with a gun.. I cant see them not being allowed to shoot a vehicle thats coming straight for them.

Daily these crazy fucks drive up in cars full of bombs. If i was at a checkpoint i would unload on any car that was going faster than walking pace..

I mean think about it. If you were out for a drive in iraq , would you simply drive past a checkpoint at "normal speed" ? I think not. I would be driving very slowly anywhere there was guns

exactly. The nly one to blame is the driver and/or the general chaos.

The height of Saddams weapons technolagy during the Gulf War were some SCUD missiles, which were all destroyed along with a major part of his military.

The US goverment told us that in the 11 years since then he had rebuilt his weapons to such an extent that he was now a major threat to the West.

During those 11 years there was an arms and oil embargo. The people were starving and the infrastructure of the counrty was being held together by luck and sweat.

However Saddam and his cronies were builiding beautiful palaces and living at a level that cost billions. Where was the money coming from to build this vast array of WMD in such a secret manner?

The US intelligence services were telling everyone they were convinced Saddam had built this powerful arsenal, though they had no actual proof.

With hindsight you are left with three answers, they were lying or the biggest bunch of fools to ever advise a President or they told the President what he wanted to hear to keep their funding.

Also one list of locations of WMDs, given to Special Services in Iraq prior to the invasion was a list of unusable, decrepit and non existent weapons. So much for the intelligence coming from the ground prior ro the war.

So how come ALL the journalists in the hotel claimed that the US version was not possible. There were no Iraqi troops even near the hotel.
Another US cover up for killing non-embedded (journalists that don't just write what the US wants then to write) journalists.

If you add the US prison scandals in Afghanistan, Guantanamo and Iraq it seems like USA is the new USSR.

They didnt claim that. You saw one slanted journalist and extrapolated it to fit whatever you wanted

Smokeythewanker, you are SO much full of shit :upsidedow :
Central command in Qatar said its troops had been responding in self-defence to enemy fire but witnesses dismissed that claim as false. [..]

The statement added: "Sadly a Reuters and Tele 5 journalist were killed in this exchange. These tragic incidents appear to be the latest example of the Iraqi regime's continued strategy of using civilian facilities for military purposes."

But journalists in the hotel insisted there had been no Iraqi fire.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story...932809,00.html

Wanna bet she's going to do her story (about all the things she "knows") in a book real soon? Wanna bet its going to be a bestseller? Wanna bet there will be nothing new in this book?

Like i said you exagerated the report to fit your needs..

You said and i quote "So how come ALL the journalists in the hotel claimed that the US version was not possible. There were no Iraqi troops even near the hotel"

Both from the link you provided and what i personally heard from the reporters themselves when this incident took place on tv, they didnt "ALL" claim the u.s. version was not possible as you stated. Most didnt know what happened at all so your plain wrong.

Secondly , there WAS iraqi troops nearby i watched them firing rockets from apartment blocks on video shortly before.

This case is another OBVIOUS one, you dont make up facts because you dont like someone or their presence.

The tanks were being fired upon by rockets , they most likely looked up saw a camerman on a balcony and thought it was a rocket launcher, they asked for permission to fire, they got it and fired back.

Clearly an error in the command portion not the tank. Clearly a u.s. error , but nothing to suggest it was deliberate, absolutley no reason just like the italian case.

If she has something so important they would try to kill her " and fail " then why doesnt she just tell us.

Same with this case , if the journalists had been targets why? And in neither case why did they not accomplish the supposed tin hat conspiracy plot against journalists

Heres a thought you might wanna think about..

Journalists KNOW they are playing russian roulette by even being in the middle of a war without a gun.

If you dont want your journalists killed , try not sending them into a war.

You said "ALL the journalists in the hotel claimed that the US version was not possible. How many journalists were in the hotel? How do you know what "ALL" the journalists said?

Who made the claim that "Iraqi troops"...which is indicative of uniformed troops...fired upon the troops on the ground. How could "ALL" or any of the journalists know if the troops on the ground were fired upon...since they were in the hotel and not with the troops on the ground. How could "ALL" of the journalists be in the same room that the troops received fire from...etc. etc. etc.

The boots on the ground said they received fire...and the tank commander was told to return the fire...no more than that...period.

What prison scandals are you referring to. The ones that the US military brought to the forefront in the first place. The ones where the majoritive of those that were prosecuted plead guilty and did not even claim that they were ordered to do what they were charged with...or the ones that could not present a single person that ordered them to do what they were charged with. Or are you referring to the ones where accusations have been made but no proof has been presented.

Buy a fucking clue.

Does anyone know what kind of newspaper the italian journalists works for?

True that.

Besides what is this like the 8th thread about the exact same thing? We have a bunch of people repeating themselves.

Communist newspaper

some shit about Fallujah, i'm sure what went down there would ruined some people high up

well duh... it's a war. Can't take it? Go and do some reporting from the local playground (although kids can be cruel to)

My best bet is that she has been informed by her kidnappers what the real reason behind 9/11 was and that bush and secret services knew it was comming. Seriously I'm 100% sure she will never open her mouth and if she does it will be a good laugh.

American journalism isn't the most objective one but most of European reporters aren't objective aswell. Almost every newschannel in the world tells what their audience wants. They need viewers to get the commercials sold to keep the channel going...

Obviously they were carrying weapons of mass destruction

ahahahaha, yeah. she was so dangerous we had to have her killed.

kids and their idiot logic. :1orglaugh

and we somehow managed to not kill her, instead treating her and releasing her from a military hospital totally fine.

her big news? Her kidnappers told her that the US governement didn't want to negotiate about her release or pay the ransom. Jeesh...who would have thought?

I guess thats why a coalition member was the one to break the news about the ransom , and not the italian commies.

Do you think this lady uses her brain from time to time. If the usa didnt want to let people know about the ransom , why were they the ones to tell them media. If she really felt that was the reason why did she not say that. She says it now AFTER we already know about the ransom..

See? That's the difference. Apperently US media are saying there was a ransom paid while European media are saying that the us will never agree with a ransom.
I must ad that she told this yesterday to a french newspaper. So maybe she said it before the coalition member? don't know, don't care. But paying a ransom in cases like this is the most stupid thing possible:
a/ you financially support terrortistic networks
b/ you bring crazy ideas to earn some money in deperate peoples heads (especially when they have just lost their house, job, everything they owed because of a war)

it was said in the early reports that ITALY paid a $1,000,000.00 ransom... not the US.

Shit, here we go again. These quotes are among the first that came out about the situation, and this version of events was toned down by Sgrena herself:

http://www.gofuckyourself.com/showthread.php?t=440878

And lets not forget that turkishpress.com is every bit as suspect as American press outlets, as they will side with Muslim interests. That's not an accusation, but it's at least as valid as your point.

In the future try to keep up, will you?

IL Manisfesto

English translation through Google

She's posted an English version of her story on their website
http://www.ilmanifesto.it/pag/sgrena/en/

Thats what I said: US didn't agree :winkwink:
but oh wait...pieces of the puzzle are all falling in place now....
Us didn't agree with Italy paying the ransom and to show Italy who's in charge they tried to kill her but messed up!

Crazy bitch thinks that her arse is the center of the universe.

She doesn't say anything here one way or another as to what they were approaching. Poor translation? I really want to hear a detailed account from her driver. He would be the only one alive who could state categorically whether or not they were approaching either a patrol or checkpoint. So far I haven't seen anything of the kind. Does anyone have a link to a detailed account of his story?