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its a fucking chicken. whether YOU want to believe it or not animals can't look at themselves and reflect about their day. they don't have that. yes, they are zombies. exactly, that's what an animal is. it might be hard for you to think that some tiny little dog thats oh so cute is just crying because he misses his mom, but in reality he has no choice - he has to cry because thats what evolution has put in him as a stay alive mechanism. sure an animal KNOWS it in a cage but an animal doesn't think to itself 'fuck, this is a fucking horrible cage' it just does whatever it can in that cage. But it doesnt get upset or anything as long as its essential needs aren't covered in which case it will react through instinct, not feelings. What about spiders, do they have feelings too? And ants? And bacteria? We shouldn't throw out food because there might be bacteria on it!! We can't have walls because we will trap mold and make it sad!! Give me a fucking break dude. There is only one creature on earth with feelings and that is humans. Anything else is instinct. |
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Are you high? Dogs does realize when they are in pain. I have a German Shepherd with Arthritis and believe me, she knows what pain is. How do dogs and children not have feelings like adults? Children are very self aware and they do reflect on themselves. |
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I agree its fucking lame and unfair that prop 8 didn't get passed, but giving animals rights doesn't take away from human rights at all.. which is why like when someone on here tries to do a compassionate thing and try to save a poor suffering dog and people jump all over her with "people are starving in africa and you try to save a stupid dog" comments, they end up looking just unnecessarily mean and ignorant. Dontcha think? |
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Nice post. :thumbsup |
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My dog gets very sad if I ignore him or don't walk him enough and he tears my shit apart to show me that.. and he gets very happy when I bring him to the dogpark and he gets to sniff a buncha dog's asses and play in the mud.. Pigs are very intelligent and you can train them to do tricks n stuff just like a dog.. http://blog.peta.org/archives/chickens/ yep I linked to PETA on GFY. go ahead, flame me, I don't care LOL |
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In case you think that was a typo, a chicken that is raised to be slaughtered does not have feelings and it should not be treated with compassion. It should be fed, killed, plucked, washed, packed and sold. That's it. It's sole purpose on this earth is to be eaten. Nothing more. And personally, I am glad they are there because I really would not have to run around chasing them if they were wild. http://www.juliablue.com/2buddy1.jpg Quote:
He greets me with the same enthusiasm he greets his buddies at the park. I don't think he loves them . . . . does he? |
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you must be pretty cold hearted (or I really think you might be in denial) if you say you do not love your dog nor he loves you, but regardless in the context of this discussion, this shouldn't be a yardstick to decide whether cruelty should be fine or not... but anyways, alluding to another off-base point made in this thread about animals being robots, your dog is not a robot... anyone that has spent time raising a family of puppies will see the individuality of the dogs, each puppy has it's own personality, some shy, some brave, but they are definitely individuals and not robots |
as far as the entire issue as a whole goes, I believe the bottom line is that sometimes death is necessary in this world, even for humans, but added cruelty and torture should never be condoned :2 cents:
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I'm all for cheaper chicken and meat. Although the guys who pushed that cow in that was sick should get introuble. not for harming the animal but for selling meat that could be bad.
They are ANIMALS, they have no rights, they don't need rights... |
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and dogs do know what pain is but they dont self reflect on it like we do, like its pain at the instinct level not at the emotional level and about the purpose thing: when you are bred and brought onto earth for consumption, that is your purpose...pretty simple...and if you want to argue if we have the right to breed animals strictly for the purpose of eating them then make the argument with nature and the food chain, because thats just how things are. stop fucking around people you cant seriously believe that animals have feelings, you give humans no fucking credit. we are vastly superior to animals. sure some animals can do some things better than us, but no other animal can feel and self reflect, plan things out and communicate like us. if you show a hyena its picture in a mirror its not going to see itself, its going to see another hyena, and it will react accordingly and thats the same with every animal even humans at a very early age to say that a chicken clucking about like a little chicken is pissed that it is in a small cage assumes that the chicken knows that its a chicken and knows that somewhere else there is something better and knows that things would be better if it got out, and i assure you it has no fucking clue about any of those things. after all, its just a chicken. same with dogs, cats, donkeys, horses, chimps, pigs, ants, rats and mice, all of them they just live to reproduce, at a very basic level of existence, but nowhere near to what humans have |
some animals may even have some stronger emotions than humans, but I would agree wth you that humans do have the strongest intellect.... still no reasons to condone unnecessary suffering in all but humans, that is arrogance :2 cents:
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And the statement that we are the only creature on the Earth with feelings is a complete lack of understanding of biology. The limbic system which handles emotions in our brains has been found in species all the way back to tetrapods. The booby is a bird that only has one partner it's entire life. Hens have hierarchy in their roosts. Lions battle each other for power. Fish have been shown to have their own personalities. These emotions from trust, to love, to respect are all in animals. We all have fight or flight receptors that determine our level of fear. And you can try and dumb it down by saying it's only their instinct, but the same can be said for us. Feelings and emotions are all just biological aspects of our bodies that were put in place for some evolutionary benefit. We are all living off instinct. We all share many of the same neurotransmitters. So while our understanding of our emotions is much more profound than other animals, it doesn't mean they don't share many of the same ones we do. But none of this is really relevant to the conversation. This isn't about giving voting rights to Chickens. It's showing common decency toward another animal. It's about not torturing an animal by subjecting it to unnecessary pain. Pain is an emotion all animals feel and try to avoid. If a chicken was just some mindless zombie, they wouldn't run away and screech when you pluck out one of their feathers. All people are saying is show some level of compassion toward another species. We have evolved to a level where we don't need to resort to this kind of stuff to survive. |
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Fuck anyone who is ok with cruelty to animals. :disgust |
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Have you ever had a farm animal as a pet? When I was a kid, we had goats. I swear, the baby goats are just like puppies. In fact I thought it was cooler because we got to bottle feed them. I know we are at the top of the food chain, I appreciate that. But really, these animals do have feelings and are very intelligent. Then one day the goat ate my dad's pot plant behind the garage, and ended up getting sent off to a farm sanctuary. We found her passed out by the garage all stoned. Dad was ready to butcher her up for dinner, mom said no way. and yes, this was in So Cal too. :1orglaugh |
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Hell yes, everyone on this board is entirely clueless except for you:1orglaugh:1orglaugh |
i wonder how baddog's vegan daughter feels about the issue.
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and if you think 5 generations makes you native californian, then your knowledge of the history of california needs updating 5 gens puts that 1st baddog in california ~150ish years ago, that makes the baddogs arriving in cali in the 1850s. that was during the time of THE biggest influx of non-californians to california (the gold rush) in the history of the state and the main event for wiping out the #s of true native californians also, anyone who has spent time around a rescued abused animal has witnessed the lingering effects that animal has from the abusive environment. + no need to mention that i just moved here, i was born in long beach and educated in nocal and have spent more than 1/2 my life in california |
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Do you think the booby has one partner for life because they are "in love" with each other? Do you think salmon swim upstream because they are homesick? Lions battle for power because it is survival of the fittest and the ability to fuck any lioness in the pride. It isn't an emotional thing, it is instinct and survival. The maternal instinct is just that, an instinct. |
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Sorry I disagree
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Animals do have feelings. It is crazy for you to claim that they do not. Animals do more then just reproduce. I am shocked at the amount of studity in this thread. Now I know why people join PETA. |
Aside from the whole animal rights issue, doesn't the farm-raised, happy chicken taste better than its counterpart occupying position x:323,y:56 of some warehouse?
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Everyone sounds more up in arms about the chickens than the gays.
Now that's funny. |
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Was it breast fed? Did the mother eat well while pregnant? It hasn't reached the "children" state, has it? I've got a Hungarian chef who makes a mean veal and figured she could do something special with "baby". |
I'm sure chickens can be processed cost-effectively without the use of unnecessary cruelty. Whether they "feel things" the same way we do or not is immaterial, it's really about common decency and compassion. I'll eat the damn thing, but I'm not down with some of the methods I've heard some companies use to handle their stock.
I'm sure somewhere in the world there's a well-run chicken operation that doesn't employ what most would describe as torturous methods and still turn a profit. Has to be, and if so surely the rest can likewise get their shit together. That said, I am strangely craving a large feed of KFC right now. |
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i thought i recalled a time when you said she ate mostly natural foods, you asked me what natural foods restaurant it was where i had gone in rb since she had been to most. no biggie, i was just loaded up on coffee this morning and fucking back with you. now if you will excuse me, i am off to have 4 fried chickens and a coke. |
Oh well just kiss them farms good bye will probbly just pack up and do business in another state.
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thats foul
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Prop 2 is mainly centered around egg producing birds, not meat producers. Beaks are trimmed due to the fact that chickens are canabalistic, they will peck to death and eat other chickens given the chance The space requirements from prop 2 will reduce the amount of egg laying hens that a rancher can keep in a certain amount of space. This will result in the price of eggs raising. The best cure for vegetarian hippies is to bbq them for 25 min per side, serve with a red wine. |
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Now-a-days, it's almost terrible to watch what "crate training" has turned into. Now you have people with the earnest belief that animals belong in cages and don't need to run around. Lots of people just get up and go to work for 9 hours and leave their dog in a small crate. My favorite are the people that tell you dogs have no sense of space. It's unreal. Your post is absolutely dead on, well-stated, and is, seemingly, obvious. My thoughts. |
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Commercial egg farms in CA will be a thing of the past. |
Prop 2 had absolutely nothing to do with free range or cage free. It makes the cages bigger. Period. Nothing will happen to help the animals - the egg/chicken/veal/pig farmers will just leave CA for a state where they don't have to spend $$$ to add a few inches to a cage.
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When I was a kid and chicken still came in a bucket my dad had us believing the little pieces of crust or whatever in the bottom were chicken beaks. Now your telling me they don't have beaks? I need therapy!! Besides, free range chickens have more muscle from moving around so they are not as tender. Thank god there's still veal. |
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You'd think if people were worried about the chicken's feelings they wouldn't feel good about stealing their future babies out from under the hens and eating them ;)
In my grocery store the "cage free" happy chicken eggs are $5 for a dozen and the regular unhappy chicken eggs are $2.50. For shits and grins I went crazy and spent the extra on the happy eggs a few weeks ago. They tasted exactly the same as the unhappy eggs. I like organic chicken, but I'm pretty sure they're raised in cages too. Having a grandfather with a cattle ranch I'm pretty much of the "they are raised for food" mind. Gordon Ramsay had some good shows on his F-Word series where he raised turkeys and pigs in his back yard for food to show his kids that the meat on their table didn't magically come from the grocery store. |
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