Fitty tests..............

If I like what's on the tour, that new video you're pushing... and I sign up for the trial and get some joke of 3 or 4 videos... or unable to see the content you were pushing on the tour, I don't think I'd convert to a full join. I might find another site that has it, or maybe just surf the tube sites instead.

Oh... I think fraud is basically when you bill a customer without them knowing about it. Or they purchase something and didn't get any product, no support, etc. What fraud actually is.

I have been to taste testing places, $1 for samples - I really don't expect an entire plate full of food, I expected a sample and got that. At that, the flyer didn't say you only get 3 chips to taste salsa with, it said come try different flavors of salsa.

That's what a $1 trial gets you... in the door, heated up to try a few things, so maybe you buy more.

I agree, as a surfer if I saw fresh updates and didn't get that, I would be gone...

I really can't explain why more people upgrade the less you give and the less people upgrade the more you give. Unless people really are trying to leech content that much.

Did you get what I was saying though, the site price is 24.95 but when they try to crosssale the same site they charge 39.99?

isnt this illegal

Nope, didn't catch that... are you referring to the xsale as the upgrade? Cause you can't xsale to the same site if it's a more expensive xoffer, it's not fraud - it's just stupid. Upgrade wise though, it's normal for the trials upgrade monthly rate to be higher than if he took the standard monthly package at first. With the price points though, those are stated at the bottom of the join page.

This is ridiculous. Talk about selective reasoning. Perhaps chargebacks and refund requests dont go through the roof because we're talking about a fucking BUCK! Who the hell is going to take the time and do a chargeback or call customer service for a dollar. They just cancel and move on (to a tube).

Well, being that trial, full month and 3 month chargebacks all happen about the same rate, it's safe to assume people will cb/refund a trial just as fast as any other membership. And you get a 30-40+ increase in trial conversions with aggressive upgrades.

The numbers are screaming it's not fraud....


However the people without trial upgrades doing 20% trial to converts are getting ripped first, then 80% cancel to go watch tubes. Who is getting frauded?

Do you even read what you are typing? Are you telling me you read through every terms of service on something you purchase? Puhlease.

To go back to the NetFlix example. When someone signs up for a month trial to NetFlix they get access to every movie available, not 100 trailers or for that matter 10% of their inventory. Why? Because Netflix believes in their company and feels that if you experience their service for a month you will be hooked and stay a long term member. That's what a "trial" should be. A way for a potential customer to try out a service or product at a limited price and see if works for them. Not a chance to trick them in the door and then screw em.

When you get a trial with netflix, you can browse everything but you only get a limited amount of movies at once to view... that's how a trial works.

I find it incredibly hard to believe that $1 chargebacks happen at the same rate as $120 chargebacks. Common sense would dictate otherwise. It's like walking down the street and seeing a dollar on the ground or a penny. What do you stop to pick up? You're basically saying an equal amount would pick up both. I call bullshit.

I don't bill people for $120, 99% of programs don't and in this post, nobody is.

Why don't we just make up some random example, like you purchased a car and you got a goat?

LOL, no I never read the TOS which is how I get screwed with my cell phone bill.

No actually thats not how it works. You pick your plan and then get a month free trial for that plan. If you dont like it, you cancel it within the month and are charged nothing, if you like it, do nothing and you're billed for the plan you chose each month.

oh sweet.. but I was correct, you can't rent everything you want, it's limited. Might not be limited exactly like ours, but then again...

That's mainstream business which sends you something in the mail... we can't do what they do.

You said 3 month chargebacks happen at the same rate as trial memberships. I took creative liberty and went with $39.95 x 3 months versus the OP $1 Brazzers trial. So sorry if that isnt exact. Lets go with $30 versus $1. I still call bullshit.

aren't you supposed to have no less than 400 characters per post now?

i don't want to have to hit eric up on icq and tell on you... :thumbsup









.

WTF are you talking about? No you werent correct and you basically just made up a Netflix trial offer to suit your needs. The point is (and the point of the original thread) the trial NetFlix offers is the exact offer of their actual service. The trial isnt limited in any way compared to their actual service. You just get 1 month free to try it.

Huh? Once you remove affiliate fraud, if one price point got higher cb/refunds than others, people would drop them.

It's not rocket science.

I 100% agree with limited access trial members areas, I give some videos and they aren't hidden or anything, and of the 1000's of trials I get I get maybe 2 complaints a year, and am more than happy to give em the $1 they spent back, but I first offer full access for a cheaper rate and to date only 1 person wanted that $1.

I don't care how much content you have, if you do trials (all the math I've done says you will make more if you do) you 100% need to limit the access to content unless they upgrade or you will be out of biz very soon. Some give zero video I give 4 or 5 and some pics, and a taste of the feeds. I might give zero videos in the near future, the less content, the more upgrades you get.

No it's limited, if you purchase the unlimited package, you don't get unlimited dvd's your first month with your free trial.

As I have already said, they run it differently, it's a mainstream business that sends products, again we can't do that, thus our billing rules are greatly different.

You know what.. screw NetFlix, we were doing trial upgrades like this before NetFlix was around... in my opinion, they're ones doing it wrong.

absolutely the rule of thumb on trials. good post :thumbsup

Seems the better way to handle trials would be to limit the download & streaming amounts.

Trial gets say 400MB per day
Upgrade to full and get 5 gigs a day or unlimited

This way a trial can see the entire site. Just can't download all the content during the trial.

Hugs,
Danielle

Some programs do it that way... some limit total bw, some limit the amount of a video that streams or quality of video, some people turn off all the videos and only give you pictures. Some of the more technical stuff though, is just that tough to do...

Truly, I don't I could twist all the ways people use upgrades.

NO. Refer to this thread and maybe you wil get what I am saying. But the guy didnt so maybe I am explaining my point wrong lol

http://www.gfy.com/showthread.php?t=967114

Trial upgrades are one of the best things a paysite could ever do... :thumbsup

Quickly looking that over, I would say that's a program screwing up rather than someone trying to fraud surfers. That would bite him in the ass more than it helps, it's a total newb mistake... it happens a lot more than people know about.

Well, I'm gonna make this my 50th post in 6 or 8 years...
You don't have a clue about real member sites.
Our trials are 10 days access, and you get the full site.
There is no way in hell that anybody can download the full site in that short of a space of time.
Granted, we only allow 5 gigs at a time, but if you wait an hour or so, you can log in again and carry on.
A trial should be a trial. Ever heard of WYSIWYG?
Content is king, and real websites shouldn't have to resort to bullshit tactics.

I think that guy was purposely playing blind, deaf and dumb with me :1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Some people are skum.... but that doesn't mean trial upgrades are :thumbsup

Then you have a trial members area - it's limited to 5 GBs. You just allow them to pick any content up to 5 GBs. No difference in picking the content they can view.

And they are over in one hour, they won't need to log back in until the next day when they want to blow their load.

Oh no trails are good (for the most part) lol.

haha, I was about to post that.

I tried this for a while, limiting number of videos works better, they upgrade faster. Limiting to 500mb worked better than limiting to 1GB a day too.


The less you give, the faster they upgrade, period.

All this assumes you have a good CMS / Templates show enough to let em know you have the motherload of content waiting for them and all your thumbs are tempting.

AMEN sister.
ds

Welcome to 2004

Once again you're wrong. Even with the 1 DVD at a time trial they offer you can view unlimited streaming movies/shows.

The point is they offer a free month trial and the terms of that trial are clearly visible. You get to try their service for a month. If you like it, stay a member. If you dont, cancel. This was the point of the thread. Brazzers trial memberships are just a small sampling of what they offer and nowhere do they actually mention this. A trial should allow a customer to test out the product/service so they can determine if they want to continue and pay full price.

You just wrote out why I wasn't wrong... they give out 1 dvd at a time as a trial, it's limited, because it's a trial.

With a limited porn trial (online vs getting something in the mail) you get to see the members area, see what you would get, the update speeds, server speeds, loading times, and you get a limited amount of content to see what the features are actually like.

This trial more than allows them to see if they're getting and if they to continue with the service or not.

When you allow a porn trial to access everything, they rip you off... the member, frauds the paysite owner, then returns only buying trials, your piracy explodes, and so on.

Simply because you don't like the business model, doesn't make it fraud.

No it is not fraud unless that checked box is not visible or unclickable to change.

Last I checked " TRIAL" memberships didn't mean limited access, but limited amount of time. Like a 3 day trail.... meaning you pay for 3 days vs 30. Since when did the meaning of trail membership change to mean you only get limited access? And if it does mean that why is it not stated??

It was around 1999/00 range... and trial means "trying something to find out about it" - you can apply time, download limits, amount of content, it isn't bound to a number of days or any set thing when trying it out.

Brazzers should sue the thread starter no banning, no discussion I would sue.

The Doc and Kristin you guys can point out the truth of this over and over your numbers are dead on, and you just gave out great industry info that should help anyone with trials who isn't making as much as they could.

At Twistys we currently give full access full trial but will we for ever? I doubt it. I prefer the limited trial and it's effect on revenue.

20% conversion from trial to full? Damn, I feel pretty good about our 50-60% conversion now :pimp

No its not a limited trial. You obviously dont have NetFlix or have ever taken advantage of their trial.

You sign up for the 1 DVD a month (and unlimited streams) $8.99 plan. You get one free month. If you like the service you can stay a member and you will be charged $8.99 per month and you will receive THE EXACT SAME THING AS THE TRIAL. If during your full membership you want to upgrade to additional DVD's per month then you can do so.

This is an honest trial. Telling the customer the "trial" is $1 but not telling them the content is extremely limited and then auto rebilling for $40 after 24 hours if they want full access is not.

Whatever happend to offering a service that people actually want to continue their membership? All everyone in this thread is discussing is not allowing full trials because the user will download everything and then cancel. Shouldnt the real concern be that the site in question isnt offering any new content that makes the user want to continue their membership?

except that the exact same limit for the full membership

and they clearly state that limit on their tour

Not to be a douche, but you've said 'trail' like 20 times when you mean to say 'trial' and it really fucks up some of your sentences :pimp just fyi

Nono, you got it all wrong. you see a Trial membership is when you sign up for a site, watch a bunch of porn and charge it back.

What you bought was the 'diet membership' , as in, I only need 4 movies to beat off on for a dollar.

Anyone who offers a full trial memnbership is probably getting ripped off. People know how to cancel their membership.

I had to click to the terms to see it.. and again, even if they didn't say it was one in one out, it wouldn't be fraud.

why is the doc always wrong. like some malfunctioning bot.

Sweet....don't you guys have trial upgrades though? Cause a 50/60 natural would put you in the top 1% of any product in the world.