Agree completely.
:thumbsup

:2 cents::thumbsup

If they paid taxes in the past, they have nothing to be shamed of. That's what taxes are for, they are not dependant on others but the money they already paid.
Becoming criminal or sacrifice family welfare because of "luxury problems" instead, is nothing to be proud of. I'd rather join the line of weekly check than the line in court.

I would avoid it all costs, it's one step above filing for bankruptcy, kinda a sign you've hit rock bottom... but I guess if it really came down to it, would beat begging for food on the streets... :2 cents:

There's a big difference between circumstances forcing you to rely on the system for a time, and someone who is content to rely on the system ALL the time. Nothing at all wrong with going on welfare for a time, as long as you also have the drive and determination to get yourself off of it and back in the workforce at some point. There are government programs in most cities that are designed to help people to regroup, get retrained if needed, and eventually get back to being a productive member of society.

Fact is I was in such a situation myself. Back in '97 I injured my back at work and could no longer do the job I was doing. Went on Worker's Comp, then joined a gov't sponsored Job Re-entry program which was geared mostly for people on wellfare. They accepted me anyway, it's where I got all my initial computer training as a matter of fact.


Anyone saying you're automatically a "leach" for going on welfare is an idiot. Too proud? (yes, the word you're looking for Footsies is "too", not "to") I'd be too proud to move home and burden my parents further, personally.

What about having to go on gov't disability? Something happens to you, you develop a debilitating condition or have an accident and it prevents you from functioning well enough to earn a living. Too proud then? Ridiculous.

BF, I had trouble believing that someone could look and not find a damn job in 2 years. Pump gas, work at a movie rental place, be a sandwich artist at Subway for christ sake. Something. There are always low-end jobs to be had, and plenty of owners of those businesses would love to have an older person that really needs the job rather than some irresponsible kid that may or may not show up for work Saturday morning.

Hard core. I bar backed for about 5 hours a night 3 nights a week and worked the door at a titty bar a couple of nights a week. Funny, I always had money for beer but could never afford food. :1orglaugh

I agree. He claims he has only had a dozen interviews, or call backs, in all that time.

:thumbsup

Well, luckily the college fed me back then. So you just had to make sure to grab your breakfast, lunch and din. It was awesome. Like Old Country Buffet, but a shade or two better.

Then you were free to spend all your extra money on booze.
:winkwink:

Automatically no, but:

1) I don't think it's the government's job to take care of me.

2) Anyone who is not working because they can not find a job they like or that pays them enough money and would rather go on welfare instead is a leech.

This is the new normal folks and it is not going to change anytime soon. In a few years it will not be strange to see someone with an MBA working at McDonald's or Wal Mart or someone with a Master's degree cutting grass for a living.

People raised to think the government will be there to help them when they really need it are going to be in for a shock.

"can find work"

Look deeper into this... Have you ever tried to find work that you can not only do, but pays enough to actually go and do it if you have kids that require care? Take my wife for example, She took a job as an office manager, and they paid 10 bucks an hour, which is shit pay but they best she can get around here. After paying daycare for 2 kids while she worked and covering just the gas in the car to pick the kids up and get to work she was actually negative 10-15 bucks a week. This is not even including wear and tear on the car, insurance, food, or any other bills that a working parent should be able to cover like electric etc.

So the whole "you could get a job at McDonalds" and make it is bullshit. I actually make more money having her NOT work and stay home with the kids.

Here we pay so much tax, 60%, that everyone working depend on welfare. :1orglaugh

Fiddy Government Hand Out Programs.

I have heard that one as well. It makes sense to some degree.

I do not have children, nor been in that situation. However, I can imagine with the day care expense alone it could be a losing battle depending on the number of kids you have to pay for. It seems around here day care is like $125-180.00 per week, per child.

Move into a cheaper home. Take the bus to work. Cancel cable TV. You are living beyond your means and it will come back to fuck you in the ass if you do not do something about it.

I assume you mean you make more from the government if your wife stays at home than if she works, yes? If that is the case you are a leech :2 cents:

If you do not live within your means you will be fucked and hard in the not so distant future. The economy is going to get much worse before it gets any better.

Price is the same around here. Daycare is expensive. add 2 + kids to that and your just not going to cut it on 10 bucks and hour.

Course they have "head start" which is kind of like welfare free daycare. Try actually getting into that. There is a waiting list.

Now, also add to the equation that is my example my wife is a collage grad with a decree in accounting and business. Yet, she still can not find better that 10 bucks an hour for a job here.

There are jobs around here that pay 17 bucks an hour. If you have hazmat certs and are willing to go on toxic spill clean ups... 17 bucks an hour to take your life into your own hand and risk everything... great pay eh?

you even read? he never said his wife was taking government assistance.

In his case, add in three kids.

That is same as him. He has degree in both, and was some sort of corporate controller at his last job making $60k or something per year. Last year, when the casino opened up here, he could not even get hired in there as a dealer, mop job, etc..

Again, said was told he is over qualified.

Can you read? I said, "If that is the case you are a leech."

welfare is basically social slavery.

There is a certain % of people who just won't work period, probably like 5-10% of people who are on welfare actually need it , the rest are just slaves , paid not to be criminals, thats a huge chunk of people who could be paying taxes if we used them correctly. Train them and put them in the workforce at a lower pay than what the gov spends on existing services they either overpay for or outsource

Interesting perspective.
:2 cents:

Welfare is forever.

You manage to get on that shit and you stay on that shit forever. Your kids too.

It's like doing heroin, or a bitch going black.

You don't come back.

That's why your friends don't want to do it. Can you blame them?

LOL! quit being a total fuck tard. My house is paid for. My cars, all 4 of them, are paid for. We live 35 miles from the nearest major city, Bus? LOL. I Raise my own chickens, grow a very nice garden for extra veggies, I even have Solar powered hot water. Trust me... none of this was done on some crappy 10 buck and hour job. If you can show me your magic math where a person with 2 kids can work for 10 bucks an put the kids in day care I would love to see it.

Are you or your wife getting government money now?

Why don't you just help your friends out with some porn gigs? Either shooting, or setting up a site. Teach 'em the biz! Make money! :)

Been there done that. No thank you.

Nope. Should we be? As it is the site I have ran for the last 10 years supports us all just fine and shows not reason why it shouldn't continue to do so.

But your avoiding the return question about your math and 10 bucks a hour supporting someone with 2 kids. I'm waiting.

i don't think he comprehended what you were trying to stay. still doesn't.

I'm not avoiding anything. If you are getting by fine without your wife working then there is no problem. As for your wife only being able to find $10 an hour jobs that should tell you something. That is all she is worth in today's market. That it is not even worth her time is immaterial. People are not worth, to an employer, what it takes to pay for their debts, obligations and lifestyle. People are worth the value they bring to the people that are paying their paycheck. If that it is $10 an hour then that is what it is.

I'm tending to agree. His too wrapped up in trying to go off on some soap box about how in his perfect world you should be able to actually live off a little more than minimum wage. lol.

I think if someone has worked all their life and the economy has knocked them on their ass momentarily they should take whatever is offered until they can find another gig as quite a few people are struggling right now and no sense losing what ya own if programs are in place to help until you get back on your feet again. My dad was making $20+ an hour and immediately took another job at $10 and is struggling but is keeping his eyes open until something closer to what he used to make comes along. Personally I have been working since I was 13 and the only times I drew unemployment was with seasonal jobs where getting laid off for 2-3 months was okay as during the regular season I worked 50-60 hours a week so I could afford it and a little break in the winter was nice. If I became unemployed today I would draw unemployment until something came up but going past a few months not working it would drive me nuts. I only have issues with people trying to milk the system and not looking for work, for those that do work and fall on hard times take what they give you until you get back on your feet.

Does seem to be like that.

Kids born to parents that don't work who will never work in their whole life and then their kids too.

I understand his point just fine and apparently comprehend the reality of it all much better than the both of you.

Sigh... You just are not on the same page what so ever in this thread are you.

Step back, and re read everything. THEN come back and redeem yourself.

Ok, attack me personally. That will make your case.

You and your wife are in denial. That is the problem.

Oh, and I live in the middle of butt fuck nowhere, it's not a matter of "worth in todays market" it's there are no jobs. There are no businesses therefore no jobs... get it? The one place that is near us, makes so little that 10 and hour is all they can AFFORD to pay and keep the doors open. Hell, the owner of that company has not drawn a pay from it in over 2 years.

Now, If we drive 10 miles there is a little town of about 2k... another 20 miles and your in a small city. But point is the jobs around here are few and far between.

If your feeling like putting together some numbers heres a list to help start with... It's all the relevant information about the county I live in.

http://www.city-data.com/county/Dade_County-GA.html

We need more people who are too proud for welfare.

The best thing for our economy would eliminate all government based social programs, which are inherently unworkable, budget busting, and fraudulent.

OMG LOL! I'm in denial? I'm attacking YOU?

I gave a perfectly good example of why in these peoples situation, finding just any job might not make sense.

How in your mind is going out and working 40 hours a week to just pay for the daycare and gas yet still come up short 10 to 15 bucks make sense? I'm just wondering?

Save the 10 bucks a week and NOT work, have the kids at home and have your 40 hours otherwise spent in a futile effort to do more productive things at home. (Provided like us you have the primary income to support yourself in the first place)

No, The best thing to do would be to bring back the works programs. The programs that actually build out country. (Roads bridges and all the other public works we enjoy today)

Take people in need, teach them a trade, pick them up in bussing and make them apply that trade in order to receive "welfare" What your doing is giving a person pride. Giving them something to point at and know they helped accomplish. Your also give them life skills that hopefully can be used for the rest of their lives and the country is getting something in return in the form of repaired infrastructure.

man he seriously just can't comprehend what you are trying to say. really quite sad.

Maybe you should move out of "butt fuck nowhere"?

I never said it did make sense for you. Did you miss where I said this: "If you are getting by fine without your wife working then there is no problem."

Troll on...

Let me get this straight. Lets hypothetically say that I didn't have the primary income to support my family, and was required to depend on finding one of these 10 buck an hour jobs.

Your solution (and I'm using me cause he seems to be stuck on this) Would be to sell off my paid for house, and my paid for land that requires almost no monthly upkeep. Sell off my paid for cars. Move into the city next to a bus stop and somehow find a place that cost me less that what I'm currently having to pay now. (Since my house and cars are paid for that means electric/water) So we are talking about 200 a month place for rent... if it includes electric and water. All this so that I would be able to work 40 hours a week to make 400 bucks a week before taxes. Take home about 280 a week. Minus 250 a weeks cause now your paying for that daycare for 2 kids again leaving you 30 bucks to spare, wait you have to now buy a bus pass for yourself and your kids, and also find a daycare that happens to be on that bus route, and also can take you to this great 10 dollar an hour job. Then repeat this twice a day.

Ok so you have what left at this point... 10 bucks a week clear. Party on dude, cause you still have not paid for food, clothing, medicine, the list goes on..

Even in your math your negative before you even started.

Now, take all these people in this situation right now, for real. Explain to me how they are going to magically make this work using your solutions and no welfare. I really wonder if your have really been paying attention the last few years cause the people in this situation RIGHT NOW are not your high school drop outs anymore, but actual skilled labor. Guess what else comes from that skill... education repayment. Opps... so now not only can't they make a living of that skill but they are also paying back the loans it took to get it.

So all these skilled works out there flooding the job markets and taking "anything" they can get... what do you think thats doing in return for the "unskilled" labor force thats always been there in the first place... making things better for them?

You are right about one thing, it is going to to get a LOT worse before it gets better and if your not prepared somehow for it your SOL.

Personally, I have been working toward being able to function off grid. Hence the solar water heat, I have city water, but I also have my own well. Soon I'll be adding solar electric to the system one panel at a time until I can run totally from it. When the shit hits the fan, I want to make sure mines still running.

Where I live people can live off the land. I can fish, hunt, grow food. people out here all watch each others backs. Welfare here is the guy next to you giving you an extra deer he killed cause he doesn't have enough room left in the deep freeze for the meat.

But in your solution you would want everyone in the city next to that bus stop... and thats the last place I would want to be if and when our system collapses.

i feel sorry for you. :2 cents: