Judge orders Oron to pay 550K to Corbin Fisher

[mikesouth]

from http://www.mikesouth.com

The 550K is peanuts compared to the 38 Million Corbin Fisher was asking for but the judge interpreted an offer to settle for 550K by Oron to be an enforceable contract. Thats the long and short of it. Oron got of VERY easy..

But they may not be coming back anytime soon, they have been down for almost a week and they lost their paypal but even more importantly word is they are losing their VISA/Mastercard certification, if that's the case any idea of a return is dreaming.

The judge did order that Orons accounts remain frozen, presumably until Fisher is paid.

[19teenporn]

550k. What a fucking joke...

[Mutt]

why did Corbin Fisher settle for peanuts? and yes when you sue a company making what Oron has made off their thieving ways, $500,000 is peanuts - especially when Corbin Fisher's legal fees are at least half of that if not more.

once again the only one who won in this were the lawyers, parasites.

[Mutt]

doh - doubt post

[JFK]

Originally Posted by Mutt

why did Corbin Fisher settle for peanuts? and yes when you sue a company making what Oron has made off their thieving ways, $500,000 is peanuts - especially when Corbin Fisher's legal fees are at least half of that if not more.

once again the only one who won in this were the lawyers, parasites.

because getting something at this point, is better than nothing !! It also sets a precedent for future cases

[DWB]

Maybe Theo will get Oron's owner to give the keynote at the show next year.

[Socks]

Originally Posted by DWB

Maybe Theo will get Oron's owner to give the keynote at the show next year.

*cymbal crash*

[epitome]

Xbiz email blast won by 58 minutes.

[LeRoy]

Hope they pay up

[Far-L]

It is not a small amount.

The damages they sought was 38 million. That doesn't mean that they would prevail if the case went to trial. 550k guaranteed is money you can bank on and most attorneys will advise taking the sure thing.

Settlements often work out like this - and good attorneys always know how to write terms to avoid "offers" from being interpreted as "agreements" on the parts of the parties involved.

Besides, they achieved a lot more than just a quick cash settlement so not sure why people think it is so lame.

[Mutt]

Because a judge making a ruling that how a file locker like Oron operates puts them beyond the DMCA's safe harbor protection is the ONLY thing that will put a real dent in them. $550K settlements won't deter any file locker making serious money. A judge can't make that finding unless a trial is fully argued and lands on his bench for a ruling/verdict to be made.

[RobertL]

But Oron is history, right? Like finished, gone, poof. So, isn't this all good news for everyone? One down, another thousand to go?

[johnnyloadproductions]

Setting up a file lockers is as easy as buying this script here (most starting out do)
http://sibsoft.net/xfilesharing.html

I've looked at the script in a test environment and with enough add-ons, out of the box this thing is ready to give incentives for uploaders.

It has APIs an integration for 10-20 major payment gateways.

That doesn't help anything!

[SplatterMaster]

Originally Posted by Robert-Kink

But Oron is history, right? Like finished, gone, poof. So, isn't this all good news for everyone? One down, another thousand to go?

Oron the name is probably gone. But with several millions left in the bank I?d wager they will be back just as strong under another name. And they wont make the same mistakes this time.

CF got what they wanted to begin with, a settlement. Who pays their lawyers fees is yet to be decided according to the ruling today.

[JimmyStephans]

Oron is done... because, even if they have dollars after this case - there will be more cases filed in next few days. There has been one more in the 6 weeks since the Liberty cases started and others will follow quickly - in particular with that money held-up.

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by Mutt

Because a judge making a ruling that how a file locker like Oron operates puts them beyond the DMCA's safe harbor protection is the ONLY thing that will put a real dent in them. $550K settlements won't deter any file locker making serious money. A judge can't make that finding unless a trial is fully argued and lands on his bench for a ruling/verdict to be made.

If you feel that way then why haven't you initiated a suit?

Sorry, but zero sympathy for those that expect others to pay for fighting their legal battles and get chafed when they don't.

Been there, done that, and paid the attorneys for it.

[Axeman]

Funds are still frozen, and further hearings will take place to get $ for Corbin's attorney fees.

[Mutt]

Originally Posted by Far-L

If you feel that way then why haven't you initiated a suit?

Sorry, but zero sympathy for those that expect others to pay for fighting their legal battles and get chafed when they don't.

Been there, done that, and paid the attorneys for it.

i don't have the money to take on an Oron - we're talking six figure legal fees and probably mid six figures to take the case the distance, with no certainty in the end you'll win.

it would be nice if somebody with deep pockets and the conviction to see one of these lawsuits through to the end is all I'm saying. Steve Lightspeed has taken a ton of flack for doing the same thing it appears Corbin Fisher is doing - if they really thought Oron was doing something illegal they wouldn't settle, the damages would be huge if they won.

[bhcash]

Another file locker is down thanks to Corbin. Those guys did a great job

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by Mutt

i don't have the money to take on an Oron - we're talking six figure legal fees and probably mid six figures to take the case the distance, with no certainty in the end you'll win.

it would be nice if somebody with deep pockets and the conviction to see one of these lawsuits through to the end is all I'm saying. Steve Lightspeed has taken a ton of flack for doing the same thing it appears Corbin Fisher is doing - if they really thought Oron was doing something illegal they wouldn't settle, the damages would be huge if they won.

We fought a Patent litigation (typically one of the most expensive types of litigation) with Acacia and an Arbitration with CE at the same time and couldn't afford either while they were both 100 million per year companies. But we managed to pull off wins in both situations, by hook or by crook, working hard, fighting for principles so that is why I see it the way I do, not trying to be harsh.

Hoping someone else will deal with it is not doing anything. What CF did was take a major crack at them and pulled off shutting them down, freezing assets, getting cash settlements, etc., and most importantly, providing a road map for others to follow suit.

The word "if" in law is never good to rest a case on.

[kane]

Originally Posted by Far-L

We fought a Patent litigation (typically one of the most expensive types of litigation) with Acacia and an Arbitration with CE at the same time and couldn't afford either while they were both 100 million per year companies. But we managed to pull off wins in both situations, by hook or by crook, working hard, fighting for principles so that is why I see it the way I do, not trying to be harsh.

Hoping someone else will deal with it is not doing anything. What CF did was take a major crack at them and pulled off shutting them down, freezing assets, getting cash settlements, etc., and most importantly, providing a road map for others to follow suit.

The word "if" in law is never good to rest a case on.

The road map is the biggest part of all of this. With each victory like this it makes more legal precedence and will show other people how to do this in order to protect their content. It also gives future judges a guide that they can follow.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by SplatterMaster

Oron the name is probably gone. But with several millions left in the bank I?d wager they will be back just as strong under another name. And they wont make the same mistakes this time.

The Oron surfers have gone to a new site. So as a win against piracy it's nothing much.

CF got what they wanted to begin with, a settlement. Who pays their lawyers fees is yet to be decided according to the ruling today.

They have put people on notice to not fuck them or they will fuck you back harder. At the moment this is the best route for individual companies.

Originally Posted by Mutt

i don't have the money to take on an Oron - we're talking six figure legal fees and probably mid six figures to take the case the distance, with no certainty in the end you'll win.

Few do, still if you listened to some of the talk here it's surprising they haven't wrapped some knuckles.

it would be nice if somebody with deep pockets and the conviction to see one of these lawsuits through to the end is all I'm saying. Steve Lightspeed has taken a ton of flack for doing the same thing it appears Corbin Fisher is doing - if they really thought Oron was doing something illegal they wouldn't settle, the damages would be huge if they won.

Today the best route is the one Steve is doing, buy going to a higher level.

Sue to get the IP's. Send out letters asking for an admission and advising they get a lawyer or asking for the reason it wasn't them and then investigating the reason. It it turns out to be BS, see who the IP holder is, is he worth suing and if so hand serving him with a writ and saying if they can check the computer and find nothing, the writ will be torn up.

If they refuse access, log the refusal, if pirated material is found tell them to get a lawyer. Don't ask for settlement at any time. That's blackmail, let them open that door. Different countries doing this is different countries would make it world wide.

There is another option, sit back and wait for the tide to turn, while it creeps up around your waist.

Me I'm retired and have nothing than hatred for parasites.

[SteveLightspeed]

Standing up for the rights of the adult industry and adult content providers will never be appreciated by those who benefit the most. No one gives a fuck anymore. Only scumbags, scammers, and thieves will survive.

LS

[tony286]

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed

Standing up for the rights of the adult industry and adult content providers will never be appreciated by those who benefit the most. No one gives a fuck anymore. Only scumbags, scammers, and thieves will survive.

LS

Good points but back in the good old days everyone was making so much money. That was the time to care when the money flowed like water and no one gave a fuck. I hope you are doing well, havent seen on here in a long time.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed

Standing up for the rights of the adult industry and adult content providers will never be appreciated by those who benefit the most. No one gives a fuck anymore. Only scumbags, scammers, and thieves will survive.

LS

DirtyWhiteBoy -

"Since when did an industry full of felons, crooks, thieves, scammers and other criminals start worrying about the rules? "

[Nautilus]

http://torrentfreak.com/judge-orders...s-case-120808/

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

DirtyWhiteBoy -

"Since when did an industry full of felons, crooks, thieves, scammers and other criminals start worrying about the rules? "

When the rules are too weak to protect their asses.

Sorry BF, it had to be said.

[Gozarian]

Originally Posted by kane

The road map is the biggest part of all of this. With each victory like this it makes more legal precedence and will show other people how to do this in order to protect their content. It also gives future judges a guide that they can follow.

Precedent constitutes the starting-point of judges' reasoning. Most of the time, judges look closely to precedent for purposes of legal certainty and for fear that their decisions might be challenged before higher instances. In international law, the stare decisis rule has been excluded since 1922, but permanent jurisdictions constantly refer to their previous decisions.

However the doctrine of stare decisis, to my knowledge, has nothing to do with out of court settlements.

[Gozarian]

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed

Standing up for the rights of the adult industry and adult content providers will never be appreciated by those who benefit the most. No one gives a fuck anymore. Only scumbags, scammers, and thieves will survive.

LS

sad but oh so true.

[pornguy]

Originally Posted by johnnyloadproductions

Setting up a file lockers is as easy as buying this script here (most starting out do)
http://sibsoft.net/xfilesharing.html

I've looked at the script in a test environment and with enough add-ons, out of the box this thing is ready to give incentives for uploaders.

It has APIs an integration for 10-20 major payment gateways.

That doesn't help anything!

and ohhh goodie they are verified by Visa.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by kane

The road map is the biggest part of all of this. With each victory like this it makes more legal precedence and will show other people how to do this in order to protect their content. It also gives future judges a guide that they can follow.

Great point. Can lawyers start to rinse and repeat?

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by Nautilus

http://torrentfreak.com/judge-orders...s-case-120808/

Agrees that ORON follows DMCA requirements.

12. Liberty agree to announce publicly that after a careful review of the facts they
believe Oron is protected by the DMCA safe harbor and that a review of the actual files
shows that there never was any child porn on Oron?s site.

Agrees to concede ORON does not host child porn.

14. Liberty will immediately, once the terms of the agreement are agreed to issue a letter asking that the HK bank accounts be unfrozen allowing the payment to the
Randazza Trust and then to [former Oron webhosting provider] Leaseweb as well as send a letter to Leaseweb asking them to allow Oron ten (10) days to pay as the settlement of the matter is imminent.

Allowing them to pay their hosting bill, and go back live.

[DWB]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Agrees that ORON follows DMCA requirements.

Agrees to concede ORON does not host child porn.

12. Liberty agree to announce publicly that after a careful review of the facts they believe Oron is protected by the DMCA safe harbor and that a review of the actual files shows that there never was any child porn on Oron?s site.

As I stated a while back as soon as the proposed settlement terms were being tossed around, it was then and is still a scum bag move to lie for Oron and say they are DMCA complaint and do not have child porn hosted there.

IMHO it throws Fisher's credibility right out the window knowing he will flat out lie for one of the biggest pirates online, and perpetuate the abuse of children by also lying that there is no child porn on Oron, when everyone knows it was full of CP and will be again.

And how exactly would Mr. Fisher know if there is CP on Oron or not? Was he also tracking child porn or was he only tracking Liberty Media's content? That means either he has no clue if CP is hosted at Oron or not and is going to lie about it, or he is willing to allow CP to continue to be hosted at Oron and say it's not for the sake getting a percentage of $550k. So he's either a liar or a scum bag.

I could care less how much money he got, that is his business, but agreeing to lie for these shit stains who have been massively fucking the entire industry AND are involved in child porn, just put him on the same level as them.

[Quentin]

Originally Posted by Far-L

It is not a small amount.

The damages they sought was 38 million. That doesn't mean that they would prevail if the case went to trial. 550k guaranteed is money you can bank on and most attorneys will advise taking the sure thing.

Settlements often work out like this - and good attorneys always know how to write terms to avoid "offers" from being interpreted as "agreements" on the parts of the parties involved.

Besides, they achieved a lot more than just a quick cash settlement so not sure why people think it is so lame.

I think the main reason some people think the settlement is lame is that it includes stipulations under which CF arguably becomes part of of Oron's public relations team. ;-)

To wit, quoting from the pertinent parts of the settlement letter cited in the judge's decision:

12. Liberty agree to announce publically that after a careful review of the facts they believe Oron is protected by the DMCA safe harbor and that a review of the actual files shows that there never was any child porn on Oron?s site.

For those who believe the contrary is/was true with respect to Oron where either safe harbor or CP is concerned, I can certainly see why they would be disappointed in that particular term being included in the settlement.

To clarify something that I think didn't really come through in Mike's post that started this thread, Corbin Fisher filed a motion asking the court to enforce the settlement agreement; the judge didn't just get a wild hair up her ass and decide to interpret an "offer" as an "agreement" -- she did exactly what the plaintiff asked her to do.

In the end, all Judge Navarro did here was evaluate whether case law supported Corbin Fisher's position as to the finality and enforceability of the settlement agreement, and come to the conclusion that Corbin Fisher's attorneys were correct.

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by Gozarian

Precedent constitutes the starting-point of judges' reasoning. Most of the time, judges look closely to precedent for purposes of legal certainty and for fear that their decisions might be challenged before higher instances. In international law, the stare decisis rule has been excluded since 1922, but permanent jurisdictions constantly refer to their previous decisions.

However the doctrine of stare decisis, to my knowledge, has nothing to do with out of court settlements.

All true, I am not referring to the road map as legal precedent, because you are correct a settlement sets none, but more as a guide for other attorneys on how to go after companies and get results.

[DWB]

Originally Posted by Quentin

I think the main reason some people think the settlement is lame is that it includes stipulations under which CF arguably becomes part of of Oron's public relations team. ;-)

It's not only lame, but it shows how big of a scum bag Fisher is. What respectable human being in their right mind would stick up for a site that hosts child porn?

[DWB]

Originally Posted by Far-L

All true, I am not referring to the road map as legal precedent, because you are correct a settlement sets none, but more as a guide for other attorneys on how to go after companies and get results.

That's all fine and dandy, but would you put your name on the line as well as your company, to say a pirate site is DMCA compliant and does not host child porn, even though you know it was a huge bold face lie?

That part just doesn't make sense.

[Mutt]

12. Liberty agree to announce publicly that after a careful review of the facts they
believe Oron is protected by the DMCA safe harbor

This is an absolute kick in the nuts to the industry. If Oron, the worst actor in the file sharing scene, in Corbin Fisher and Mark Randazza's opinion, are legally protected by the DMCA's safe harbor provision then one of 2 things 1)they are correct and we are all in the wrong industry now and should busy ourselves making money off the work of others or 2) Corbin Fisher and Mark Randazza are cock sucking traitors and should be ostracized by the industry as such.

[Far-L]

Originally Posted by DWB

That's all fine and dandy, but would you put your name on the line as well as your company, to say a pirate site is DMCA compliant and does not host child porn, even though you know it was a huge bold face lie?

That part just doesn't make sense.

I agree. That is crap, but set me straight... was that term put in there by Oron or by CF? Because if that wasn't supposed to be the final agreement of settlement then how do we know if they would've agreed to it in the final deal?

[DWB]

Originally Posted by Far-L

I agree. That is crap, but set me straight... was that term put in there by Oron or by CF? Because if that wasn't supposed to be the final agreement of settlement then how do we know if they would've agreed to it in the final deal?

We know from previous documents that it came from Oron's team in their counter offer. Then we found out a deal was made after the counter offer, but then Oron backed out of it. That's where this ruling comes from. The torrentfreak story then lists it as part of the final agreement.

As far as I see it, it doesn't matter which side came up with it, it's a really shitty thing to agree to. Fucking the industry in the ass aside, what that says is, "hey, I know you are involved in child abuse of the worst kind, but if you cash me out, I'll look the other way and tell everyone in my industry that you're an honest guy who isn't involved in such things."

[Gozarian]

Providing cover for sucmbags is oh so typical of most in this industry. Not all are like Far-L and fight for what is right AND principles

[kane]

Originally Posted by Gozarian

Precedent constitutes the starting-point of judges' reasoning. Most of the time, judges look closely to precedent for purposes of legal certainty and for fear that their decisions might be challenged before higher instances. In international law, the stare decisis rule has been excluded since 1922, but permanent jurisdictions constantly refer to their previous decisions.

However the doctrine of stare decisis, to my knowledge, has nothing to do with out of court settlements.

I guess I didn't really clarify what I meant. It was late

Since it is a settlement and therefore not really a legal precedent it doesn't have a lot of legal standing so much as it is a blueprint for future lawyers to use as a way go after these big file lockers.