Why is the porn industry is so hard today?

[Paul Markham]

The simple answer is THE CUSTOMER IS REJECTING BUYING.

So the hard question is why is the customer rejecting buying?

When I first came into porn the quality of the product was abysmal and the profits were huge for the few who did produce. Over the next 3 decades quality rose and then fell. The reason was simple, as it became easier to produce more titles were published yet over all income did not match the rise in production. So the budgets for producing a porn movie were cut again and again. Soon the standard for what was sold was low. But the customer had no option, he had to buy or borrow from a friend.

Adult magazines were immune to this trend because the distributors and sales points limited the number of titles allowed.

Then the Internet came into peoples homes and within a very short time sales of porn videos started to fall.

The Adult Internet was a very easy place to make money for years. New people coming online everyday and for years it was easy. The main cry for years was TRAFFIC, TRAFFIC, TRAFFIC. Few sites were putting the customer first in their quest to get new webmasters to send traffic. The customer had no option, if he wanted to view a full scene he had to pay for it. Even though the amount of free porn was escalating sales were holding. New sites were going up daily and everything seemed rosy.

Again the Internet Porn industry was repeating the mistake of the Video Porn industry. Catering for the customer was the least important thing. Putting up more and more sites, giving more and more to traffic generation left little for the most important person. The customer. His main concern was the quality of the product of the product he was buying and content budgets were being cut to provide more scenes for less money. Look around and see if you can find any of the top porn shooters shooting for websites that don't own. The answer is none. Pierre Woodman, Gabi Pontello, Viv Thomas, Jack Harrison, PT Thomas, Steve Shields and many more have always been "Guns for hire" in the porn business. None work, to my knowledge, have been employed by a porn site on a constant basis. Was the content budget so small sponsors could not afford them? Even I made more money selling a scene non exclusive than any site would pay for it exclusive.

Websites lagged behind in what they were offering the customer in an ever changing world and earnings started to fall. This happened long before the Credit Crunch or Tubes. Both of these made a bad situation far worse.

So what's the solution?

Put the customers first. Look to his needs and fill them. Or lose them to people who do, what ever their business model is.

[DEA - banned for life]

_ _ _ _ _ _tube.com x infinity = 0

[Amputate Your Head]

So the hard question is why is the customer rejecting buying?

The answer is simple: Most of the country is broke. Those that aren't broke yet are busy working on ways to prevent going broke.

[erooup]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

The simple answer is THE CUSTOMER IS REJECTING BUYING.

No. The correct answer is THE CUSTOMER IS REJECTING TO BUY WHAT YOU OFFER THEM

It's not your customers fault your product dont appeal to them.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Amputate Your Head

The answer is simple: Most of the country is broke. Those that aren't broke yet are busy working on ways to prevent going broke.

You would be right if the decline in porn started 18 months ago. It did not so you're wrong.

Will we get back the customers lost because of the credit crunch? Don't bank on it.

[BV]

This thread is useless without pics.

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

You would be right if the decline in porn started 18 months ago. It did not so you're wrong.

Will we get back the customers lost because of the credit crunch? Don't bank on it.

Why am I wrong? Porn is a vice, it's one of those things people give up last... like cigarettes, booze & drugs. So it would make sense that the porn decline didn't really kick into gear until people started really running out of money and had to focus on survival. Plus, like I was saying, those that aren't broke yet are no doubt trimming costs anywhere they can. I know I've been cutting costs for over a year. Nothing is untouchable. I cut when and where I need to, just like anyone else.... porn simply is no longer in a lot of people's budgets. Especially when there are tons of it available for free. That makes it an easy decision to not spend money on it. And you can thank the Republicans. Cutting off unemployment bennies severed the last likely disposable income people had to spend on vice.

[CHARGER]

times are hard i was reading few days ago that singers like cristina aguilera , lady gaga , rihanna and plenty more are canceling they concerts because tickets are not sellin well


if you think about it we sale entretaiment just like those singers do means that when the person have to choose between eating and watching some skinny girl getting naked over the internet that he will never meet personaly.... just guess what is going to happend ...

[Mistah Charlie]

Why has no one brought up the plethora of free content on the web today? Tube sites will do, especially if you're behind on your credit card bill. Remember also, enthusiasts account for over 80% of our business. These are the kind of people who download, who own dvds. They can go without new content when times are tough. Do not anticipate sales getting better any time soon. If our industry - and our customers - gave away less of our content for free, this would be a start.

[DEA - banned for life]

Originally Posted by Mistah Charlie

Why has no one brought up the plethora of free content on the web today? Tube sites will do, especially if you're behind on your credit card bill....

see post # 2

Originally Posted by BV

This thread is useless without pics.

you are correct





Times have changed

[will76]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Put the customers first. Look to his needs and fill them. Or lose them to people who do, what ever their business model is.

It's hard to fill his needs when his needs consist of him being horny and wanting to jerk off to a good video. He goes to youporn and browses 1000's of videos finds the one he wants, watches it for 10 minutes and busts a nut. How are you suppose to get him to pay to see your same type of videos on your pay site ?

Customers are being lost to people who do fill their needs... their need is decent quality, full length porn videos for free. The business model is free porn and tube sites, being used to upsell people through ads to cams and dating.

Originally Posted by CHARGER

times are hard i was reading few days ago that singers like cristina aguilera , lady gaga , rihanna and plenty more are canceling they concerts because tickets are not sellin well


if you think about it we sale entretaiment just like those singers do means that when the person have to choose between eating and watching some skinny girl getting naked over the internet that he will never meet personaly.... just guess what is going to happend ...

I always disagreed that porn is entertainment. Jerking off is not entertainment, it's a need. Can't compare going to the movies or to a concert with watching porn. If anything porn is more comparable with smoking and buying cigs than it is to going to a concert.

[Barefootsies]

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by paul markham

the simple answer is ....

viagra!!!!

[Johnnyv]

I love this thread, and I hope to hijack it!

You are all correct. The times have changed. A porn buyer will be a porn buyer and a porn surfer will watch free tubes. Easy. For the porn buyer, you need to do everything this thread states. Adapt. Be creative. Hustle.

Most importantly you need to give the surfer what they want and what they are looking for from you. I have been in this space for years (1997) and have heard every rant about "the end user" you can think of; including but not limited to "those fuckin' card holders" when talking about charge-backs at a billing company. Look, the end user / surfer / card holder whatever you want to call them are actually customers, clients, consumers, and we should treat them that way.

The space is not dead it is adapting. I have been talking about a new technology since XBiz in L.A. that can give the surfer exactly (literally) exactly what they look for. I am adapting and so should you.

Look, take me up on it, call my bluff. If you respond to me at [email protected] before the 15th I will half price the set up for you. Best case, you change the way you are doing business to better adapt to your environment, and take advantage of the newest technology. Worst case....we have an interesting phone call / icq chat / e-mail exchange about where the Industry is headed.

I dare ya!


Johnny V

[Stef.]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

that guy speak the truth...

[Johnnyv]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Put the customers first. Look to his needs and fill them. Or lose them to people who do, what ever their business model is.

Undeniably, absolutely, obviously, unquestionably, indisputably, incontrovertibly, certainly, without-a-doubt true!

In a word.....Yup!

[fatfoo]

Originally Posted by DEA

The computer is very small.

That's fine.

[Cyandin]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

+1

[Huggles]

Why would anyone pay for porn? It's easy for people to get off on the 10,000+ hours of porn you can find on tubes, torrents, forums...

[Johnnyv]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

You speak the truth. Given the choices, I would rather evolve...........or die trying.

[Raf1]

after all the bullshit customers have gone through in the past it's going to be hard to get them back into a paying cycle. They have more good free porn now than on all the paysites they signed up to in the past. Oh, and blame the tubes, hehe

[Agent 488]

broken record.

does it ever get tiring?

[Agent 488]

if the customer has no $ the best product in the world can't be afforded.

get your head out of your ass. the only business thriving are pawn shops, cash advances and prisons in depression 2.0

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally Posted by Agent 488

if the customer has no $ the best product in the world can't be afforded.

get your head out of your ass. the only business thriving are pawn shops, cash advances and prisons in depression 2.0

It's been really clean around here lately... apparently the aluminum can collecting business is thriving also.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by erooup

No. The correct answer is THE CUSTOMER IS REJECTING TO BUY WHAT YOU OFFER THEM

It's not your customers fault your product dont appeal to them.

Wrong.

The correct answer is THE CUSTOMER IS REJECTING TO BUY WHAT WE OFFER THEM

It's our fault our product does not appeal to them.

This has not just sprung up on us over night, the trend has been clear to see. The industry did not adapt when it had the time and cash to do so. Even now which sites offer more than a place to download videos the kind that can be found for free?

[Amputate Your Head]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

It's our customers fault our product dont appeal to them.

Really? The customer's fault?

[Agent 488]

people don't even have the money to reject a product.

real unemployment in the US is nearing 20%.

those are hard facts.

[quiet]

ah paul, everything couple of months you come out with the same thread. you silly guy you :gluglug

[Barefootsies]

You are wrong.

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

THE CUSTOMER IS REJECTING TO BUY WHAT WE OFFER THEM

It's our customers fault our product dont appeal to them.

If the customer can't afford what we offer them, or have no credit card to buy it any longer that is OUR problem champ? What about all those millions where were burned by industry cross sales and card banging to the point they no longer trust them?

Sorry toots. There is not a nice little neat scape goat boogie man in the closet to blame the world, or adult industry's, whoas on. I listed 10 issues, and there are plenty more.

[2012]

what is the definition of insanity ?

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by 2012

what is the definition of insanity ?

This thread, and the others like it.

[Agent 488]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

You are wrong.



If the customer can't afford what we offer them, or have no credit card to buy it any longer that is OUR problem champ? What about all those millions where were burned by your cross sales and card banging to the point they no longer trust them?

Sorry toots. There is not a nice little neat scape goat boogie man in the closet to blame the world, or adult industry's, whoas on. I listed 10 issues, and there are plenty more.

over half a million people are giving up the work force every month and are not added to unemployment statistics anymore.

might want to look at that first before saying the consumer will buy again with a better price point or video delivery system or whatever.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_razor

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by Agent 488

might want to look at that first before saying the consumer will buy again with a better price point or video delivery system or whatever.

Yet Clips4Sale thriving selling on a PER CLIP basis.
I still can get people to buy subscriptions to membership sites after watching a 20 sec. clip.
I still have members, and patrons emailing me asking for custom shoots and sending scripts.
Clients launching new tube sites in the past few months are getting members just fine.


Yep. Sounds like the ground crumbling beneath our feet.

[Agent 488]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Yet Clips4Sale thriving selling on a PER CLIP basis.
I still can get people to buy subscriptions to membership sites after watching a 20 sec. clip.
I still have members, and patrons emailing me asking for custom shoots and sending scripts.
Clients launching new tube sites in the past few months are getting members just fine.


Yep. Sounds like the ground crumbling beneath our feet.

that was aimed to paul sorry.

just my point is if sales are down it's pretty simple to find out why - the economy is crap.

no point getting all esoteric.

[cambaby]

Ya know Barefootsies Ive been watching you, locally and on the boards, I gotta hand it to you man you really are adapting well to the market. Sold off what you could on models that werent making much money, looking locally for partnerships etc. Kudos man kudos, regardless of the shit you get on the boards I am taking some lessons from some of your posts.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by Agent 488

that was aimed to paul sorry.

just my point is if sales are down it's pretty simple to find out why - the economy is crap.

No offense taken. Sorry about that my friend.

My apologies to you.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by cambaby

Ya know Barefootsies Ive been watching you, locally and on the boards, I gotta hand it to you man you really are adapting well to the market. Sold off what you could on models that werent making much money, looking locally for partnerships etc. Kudos man kudos, regardless of the shit you get on the boards I am taking some lessons from some of your posts.

Thank you for the kind words friend. I appreciate it.

[BogY_KinG]

tube sites killing business

http://www.gfy.com/showthread.php?t=977807

[BogY_KinG]

tube sites killing business

[bjlover]

Just what gfy needs another "what is better content or traffic" thread by PM

Want to know whats wrong with the industry? This thread will explain it all http://www.gfy.com/showthread.php?t=977779

[notime]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

That sums up most cliffnotes from GFY the last 2 years

[maxpower]

Calling all of this a "industry" any longer is a joke.

Its just a string of dead and dieing company's, that for the most part can not afford to create marketable content, and or flat-out rip off viewers just to make a few bucks.

This "industry" will not exist in only a few years and join the buggy whip industry in the history books.........

But ya the studios and the Gov itself spent too much time trying to get their dicks sucked and throwing parties than thinking about the future or controlling their products.

Its too late to even try to fix it now, its Over so my advice is to Get The Fuck Out

Maybe in a decade or two you guys can try to restart it, but until then fuck off.............



>







.

[digitaldivas]

Originally Posted by Amputate Your Head

The answer is simple: Most of the country is broke. Those that aren't broke yet are busy working on ways to prevent going broke.

I agree this has alot to do with it, people. Thought that was a "no brainer". Other shit does affect this, but by far and large, the economy has a ton to do with it imho...

[digitaldivas]

Originally Posted by Agent 488

if the customer has no $ the best product in the world can't be afforded.

get your head out of your ass. the only business thriving are pawn shops, cash advances and prisons in depression 2.0

...again, spoken for truth imho to a large extent. Things are bad out there, especially since the central bank has decided to start dumping the dollar. And I would guess that 98 percent of you don't even follow money markets, much less know what they are...

[OTerror]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

I agree with this post. I still think that the FLOOD OF FREE PORN is the main issue. I know a guy who paid for porn and then he told me about 'REDTUBE' he said he would never pay for porn again with these tube sites.

[will76]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Jesus Fucking Christ people, go buy a beer with the last of your online adult industry money and cry in it already. No matter how many threads you make, and days you whine, it's not going to change anything.

1. Processing Rules Changed.
2. The Global Economy.
3. Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. Flood of Free Porn.
5. Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Either do something about your situation, or move on to your paper hat. This is not a job match. The genie is out of the bottle, cat out of the bag, or whatever other cliche you'd like to use. Either evolve, or die.

I'll give some %'s of IMO how each of the above affected everyone:

Picture and Membership sites:

1. (mainly affected the cross sale junkies) Processing Rules Changed.
2. (really can be combined with #3) The Global Economy.
3. (60% - main problem, kills new sales and especially rebills) Credit Card Limits Dropped, Card Closed, People Bankrupt.
4. (35%) Flood of Free Porn.
5. (5%) Lack of Updates, Original Content, Innovation.
6. (goes hand and hand with #4) Failure to Lock Down Content.
7. (not a cause but a result) Most People Never Knew How to SELL in the First Place.
8. (not really relivent - but you can add here the younger generation is more inclined to look for free porn than the older users and combine that with #4) Internet Users are Aging, and Becoming Desensitized to Same Ole Tricks.
9. (less than 1%) Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.
10. (not a cause but a result) Apathy & Laziness. Being a BRO is no longer enough to make money online...

Originally Posted by OTerror

I agree with this post. I still think that the FLOOD OF FREE PORN is the main issue. I know a guy who paid for porn and then he told me about 'REDTUBE' he said he would never pay for porn again with these tube sites.

for everyone like him you know there is 10000s of people like that every day finding out about a tube site for the first time and saying the same thing.

But the biggest problem is that the majority of the people who do want to pay can't and are getting declined and rebills are getting killed not because they are cancelling but because of insufficient funds.

[sinclair]

because the crazies are running the show.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by will76

9. (less than 1%) Competition for Their Attention & Online Time with Social Networks.

Really? Only 1% eh? Well at least you had an IHO disclaimer.

That is not the feedback I get from my own forum members, and patrons. Nor the models, and others people in the under 30 age bracket I have talked to, nor what I read on other forums in my niches.

[georgeyw]

Originally Posted by CHARGER

times are hard i was reading few days ago that singers like cristina aguilera , lady gaga , rihanna and plenty more are canceling they concerts because tickets are not sellin well


if you think about it we sale entretaiment just like those singers do means that when the person have to choose between eating and watching some skinny girl getting naked over the internet that he will never meet personaly.... just guess what is going to happend ...

You just listed 3 or 4 of the shittiest *entertainers* on the planet. How they managed to make a living out of peddling their shitty music is amazing.

The fact they are having to cancel concerts due their music sucking nuts isn't really anything to do with people falling on hard times.

With RE to the OP :

Like always - key is to have unique content. I personally find that solo girl sites are what converts the best still. The lesser known the better (usually the type of stuff that isn't on tubes yet).

When people can't get it free - they will pay............................

[will76]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

Really? Only 1% eh? Well at least you had an IHO disclaimer.

That is not the feedback I get from my own forum members, and patrons. Nor the models, and others people in the under 30 age bracket I have talked to, nor what I read on other forums in my niches.

I never said that a lot of people under 30 weren't spending a LOT of time on facebook, myspace, youtube. When I said 1%, I am saying that there is a 1% loss of income because of people spending more time on those type of sites.

Time on facebook (increase) does NOT mean porn sales (decreases). It just means that they are are spending less time doing something. Maybe less time playing Xbox, watching reality TV, studing, playing outside, playing second life, or whatever.

Do you really think that everyone under 30 has suddenly stopped jerking off less because of facebook, that is ridicules. People still jerk off as much, and it is hard to jerk off to facebook's content. If anything them seeing their chick friends in a bathing suit might get them horny and they go look for porn to yank it to.

Here lies the problem, when the under 30 crowd goes to look for porn to yank it to, where do they go? To your membership site to buy or to youporn?

People automatically see "OMG time spent on social networking sites has gone up a lot, that is where all of our customers are on facebook, not my site." It's not thinking the problem through and just looking at the surface. When you can stop for a second and realize that they are not jerking off less, then you realize while the time spent on those sites have gone up, it doesn't mean that the time on porn sites have gone down. It just means that those people are going to another porn site and not yours to spend their time on.

(btw, the 1% I gave it is because there may be a real small portion of the people who can actually jerk off to a girl in a baiting suit on facebook vs going to a porn site to do it.)