You can really tell porn is dead by reading this forum...

[dropped9]

You can really tell that a good # of people are gone. This board moves at a snails pace as compared to years past.

[stocktrader23]

I miss 2003 / 2004, even though we stayed in a forum war for months on end. Talk shit, make money. Good days.

[Loki]

ehhh, I'd ALMOST agree with you BUT, I see LOTS of activity on the super secret adult webmaster facebook groups, I just think a lot of the talk has moved to a more 'social structure" but what do I know? my job is to shut the lights off once the last program has closed and the last webmaster has left lol

-Loki-

[dropped9]

Originally Posted by Loki

ehhh, I'd ALMOST agree with you BUT, I see LOTS of activity on the super secret adult webmaster facebook groups, I just think a lot of the talk has moved to a more 'social structure" but what do I know? my job is to shut the lights off once the last program has closed and the last webmaster has left lol

-Loki-

But what always bothered me about facebook... was mixing that shit with biz... i use fb for more recreation than anything...

[stocktrader23]

Originally Posted by dropped9

But what always bothered me about facebook... was mixing that shit with biz... i use fb for more recreation than anything...

No doubt. I know you can hide certain things but my nutty ass family reads my post and I might forget one day. Can't be bothered to start a whole new account in hopes that business is done.

[papill0n]

thanks captain fucking obvious

[candyflip]

I knew that porn was dead as soon as NotAnotherDesigner.com went offline.

[Yngwie]

might not necessarily mean that many people left the industry. It's very possible that many people have decided to focus all of their time on work and find ways to increase/improve their earnings and said "fuck the boards". Might not be the case, but it's a possibility.

[Dirty F]

My stats tell me something else.

[adendreams]

Interesting how many affiliates talk about declining income and porn being "dead" while I see huge income and INCREASING income from the premium member sites I work with...

Surfer scams and selling crap sites made from a single CD of non-exclusive content don't work as well anymore thats all... it's a move to quality, which is historically the natural progression of a new biz.

A more savvy and more specific customer base requires a move to quality or you're left behind.

[BIGTYMER]

Porn is dead yet I'm making more money then ever. Keep leaving people!

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by Loki

my job is to shut the lights off once the last program has closed and the last webmaster has left lol

You know, J, that's really my job description, so it'll be nice to have company

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by adendreams

Interesting how many affiliates talk about declining income and porn being "dead" while I see huge income and INCREASING income from the premium member sites I work with...

Surfer scams and selling crap sites made from a single CD of non-exclusive content don't work as well anymore thats all... it's a move to quality, which is historically the natural progression of a new biz.

A more savvy and more specific customer base requires a move to quality or you're left behind.

This is generally the deal agreed. Most stuff in porn (the old progs) are in the junkyard, relics that no longer sell at a remotely decent ratio.

A very few progs on the cutting edge who offer something extra, still sell but only if everything else is hitting on all cyls.

Maybe 10 progs total sell in porn and dating. 2 I know of, 8 I dont.

Those mid month lulls (for me) are still a bitch too.

Facebook Of Cams

Whose got the balls to bring this program around?

[Vjo]

I see someone is sending facebookofcams.com to My Free Cams.

Damn what a killer domain if the right affiliate minded folks owned it.

[Vjo]

Facebook of X

Someone needs to exploit FB. That is where all the money and easy sales are for anyone willing to run with it.

Maybe a broke ass (like me) who is basicly untouchable. LOL

I laugh but I am half serious about that. FB of X. Go for it. It is easy money waiting to happen.

Fuckem let em sue you. You are broke remember. First $1890 a month is legally (state law) untouchable in my State, technically county. Higher if you are married and/or have kids. (and yes, I have verified proof of that) Go for it.

And yeah, you can live fine on $1850 a month if you know what you are doing.

Questions?

Did you know even in my broke ass county the median income is $3300/month.

Many of us are broke asses in 2012 and don't even know it.

[adendreams]

Didn't the poo poo guy currently sober say he has the facebook cam thing going, and that its still up and doing well despite all the naysayers?

[Paul Markham]

Been saying it for a while. Offline porn is a very very hard business these days, a few shop chains still make great money just look up Beate Uhse and Ann Summers for the sort of money in offline porn today. Imagine what it was before the Internet. Then multiply it by every shop in those countries, then carry those across to other major countries and you get an idea of what porn was worth. People looking at "Privates" DVD sales as a guide are idiots. It's like looking at Aden's turn over and saying this is the size of porn.

Online has been in decline for years, the number of shooters who were giving up shows that. Then sites closing, then problems getting paid, etc. You simply can't keep giving away free porn and leap frogging each other in the race to give away the most, without effecting over all sales.

In a famine, the strong can grab food from the weak, so the weak die first. If the famine continues, the strong eventually feed off each other. Then they die. The only thing that saves them is food and an end to the famine.

Aden that approach hasn't made money, except for those selling 1,000s of the CDs since 1999. Ask Z masters what they made from their discs. Ask me what I made from selling non exclusive, it will shock you. Your route leaves the shooter with nothing to live off, my route allows me to stop working and still take money over 3 years later.

However I totally agree with you about a more savvy customer requires better quality. This has been something I've said for years. Problem was getting sites to pay the price. There were porn markets who out paid online by a factor of 10 times.

[adendreams]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Been saying it for a while. Offline porn is a very very hard business these days, a few shop chains still make great money just look up Beate Uhse and Ann Summers for the sort of money in offline porn today. Imagine what it was before the Internet. Then multiply it by every shop in those countries, then carry those across to other major countries and you get an idea of what porn was worth. People looking at "Privates" DVD sales as a guide are idiots. It's like looking at Aden's turn over and saying this is the size of porn.

Online has been in decline for years, the number of shooters who were giving up shows that. Then sites closing, then problems getting paid, etc. You simply can't keep giving away free porn and leap frogging each other in the race to give away the most, without effecting over all sales.

In a famine, the strong can grab food from the weak, so the weak die first. If the famine continues, the strong eventually feed off each other. Then they die. The only thing that saves them is food and an end to the famine.

Aden that approach hasn't made money, except for those selling 1,000s of the CDs since 1999. Ask Z masters what they made from their discs. Ask me what I made from selling non exclusive, it will shock you. Your route leaves the shooter with nothing to live off, my route allows me to stop working and still take money over 3 years later.

However I totally agree with you about a more savvy customer requires better quality. This has been something I've said for years. Problem was getting sites to pay the price. There were porn markets who out paid online by a factor of 10 times.

Paul I have nothing against you. I don't hate you like almost everyone else here. But I am intimately familiar with stats and sales of the people I do biz with and they are making a LOT of money and sales are going up not down, which means you have no fucking clue what you are talking about.

My route? CD's? HUH? You're not embalmed already are you?

[adendreams]

Originally Posted by Vjo

Facebook of X

Someone needs to exploit FB. That is where all the money and easy sales are for anyone willing to run with it.

Maybe a broke ass (like me) who is basicly untouchable. LOL

I laugh but I am half serious about that. FB of X. Go for it. It is easy money waiting to happen.

Fuckem let em sue you. You are broke remember. First $1890 a month is legally (state law) untouchable in my State, technically county. Higher if you are married and/or have kids. (and yes, I have verified proof of that) Go for it.

And yeah, you can live fine on $1850 a month if you know what you are doing.

Questions?

Did you know even in my broke ass county the median income is $3300/month.

Many of us are broke asses in 2012 and don't even know it.

The poo guy is doing it....

https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1054695

[Vjo]

And it is $1890 ONLY in my state far as i know. Most other states are at about $1000 (30 times the federal min wage/month) exempt from lawsuit.

My state is normally 40 times (the only one) or about $1280 exempt.

A lil known clause (actually it is well known here I am sure) raises it to $1890 exempt. 100% exempt. But I must have dialogue or you will never know.



Hint: It is cold up here. Real cold. Real dangerous. State must protect the poor in cold.

Move here and lets start FB of X.

State law. Only state in the nation (no not even you Texas) that takes better care of the poor and protects their measly income from all crediters and lawsuits. Barring taxes, student loans and child support which are not exempt.

But FB is def shit out of luck if they come after some broke ass maybe like me. LOL

Desperate times.. desperate measures..

[Vjo]

I just gave every dirtball (like me ) in the audience big ideas

That is why I am here. Only to help my fellow man.

That calls for a good tune. Something that is RIGHT NOW illegal on YT but they havnt found it yet..

this vid



jenny jenny who can i turn too

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by adendreams

Didn't the poo poo guy currently sober say he has the facebook cam thing going, and that its still up and doing well despite all the naysayers?

That is actually what gave me the idea. But I think he was just BSing. No way he owns that domain.

[Vjo]

Anyhow, BEST converter the last ten years for me (even better than ND in their best) was Facebook of S@x.

That is why the company that took the gamble will always have my respect. They just should have had it reg in my name. LOL

We would ALL still be killing it. And that is a natural fact.

I have balls of brass. LOL Not really I just can live fine on $1850 a month.

Of course the money I made (make) in excess of $1850.. that is where it gets tricky.

[Vjo]

Domain and biz only in my name. $1850 salary. I sell or dispense of all other (meager) income producing assets.

We'll leave all the grimey details to our (yours, Im [legally, not technically] broke remember ) lawyers.



Deal? Lets roll..

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Been saying it for a while. Offline porn is a very very hard business these days, a few shop chains still make great money just look up Beate Uhse and Ann Summers for the sort of money in offline porn today. Imagine what it was before the Internet. Then multiply it by every shop in those countries, then carry those across to other major countries and you get an idea of what porn was worth. People looking at "Privates" DVD sales as a guide are idiots. It's like looking at Aden's turn over and saying this is the size of porn.

Online has been in decline for years, the number of shooters who were giving up shows that. Then sites closing, then problems getting paid, etc. You simply can't keep giving away free porn and leap frogging each other in the race to give away the most, without effecting over all sales.

In a famine, the strong can grab food from the weak, so the weak die first. If the famine continues, the strong eventually feed off each other. Then they die. The only thing that saves them is food and an end to the famine.

Aden that approach hasn't made money, except for those selling 1,000s of the CDs since 1999. Ask Z masters what they made from their discs. Ask me what I made from selling non exclusive, it will shock you. Your route leaves the shooter with nothing to live off, my route allows me to stop working and still take money over 3 years later.

However I totally agree with you about a more savvy customer requires better quality. This has been something I've said for years. Problem was getting sites to pay the price. There were porn markets who out paid online by a factor of 10 times.

Paul you are right and they are right. Here's how.

You are right. Tubes and giving away content leveraged traffic and pretty much threw every small mom and popper out with their 500 hits/day unless they could work/learn/buy time. They (and forums maybe more) DID hurt ratios no doubt and many had to leave.

Part of the blame is on the paysite too if not more. They sold the same junk for a long time.

I joined a fetish paysite promoted on this board onetime. It had 100 to 150 vids AND it was a recurring prog I belonged to. And yes *I* did not recur.

They are right. Cause they either own tubes and/or are smart enuf to have consolidated down to progs that are still successful and/or build sites successfully (this is still where the money is) and/or buy traffic and have somehow managed to take the higher ratios and make them still work profitably.

So you are both essentially right. But I admire you more Paul being one of my few elders around here who posts more than one line.

Yeah triple.

good song that somehow fits..

[adendreams]

Sorry but as I also admire Paul as an elder statesman, a lot of the stuff he says is just fundamentally wrong.

There is MORE money being spent on online porn now than ever - each year more credit cards are taken out of wallets and entered into porn sites NOT LESS - this is Pauls major flaw that he cant seem to understand this.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

In a famine, the strong can grab food from the weak, so the weak die first. If the famine continues, the strong eventually feed off each other. Then they die. The only thing that saves them is food and an end to the famine.

Interesting analogy. Porn is definitely going downhill as a whole.

You just have to get a shitload of traffic and then sales still come.

But as your analogy says, without fresh content, new content delivery methods, better payment systems (as Jakez mentioned, good point Jakez) paysite saturation or worse surfer saturation on porn videos as a whole as they have tons archived, have seen it all, prefer Youporn as Howard Stern does, would rather jerk to HD celebrity on YT since HD porn is not well produced or all free on tubes, ect ect.

Porn paysite model is slowly dieing as a whole tho it seems. This January was worse than Last Jan for sales on tours I worked on all year. Could just be a bad month tho.

Better lately but the mid month lull was extra hard this month.

Saturation looms over you to swoop down QUICK as soon as you think you got a good thing in this biz as an affil or paysite owner.

We are all going to have to start building mainstream sites eventually which maybe in the end wont be so bad.

I think if you can build good sites that serve the populace and survive in the meantime till they are successful maybe there is a light.

But in porn as I see it now. It is pretty sad really as a whole.

Yes I make money but will I make money in five years or even two years or will it be dead or dieing still.

Will it be further leveraged down to 100 big sites who give away the whole farm.

I guess it already is. Just a matter of time till noone buys porn or it will take 10,000 unique hits to get a sale and rising..

Actually since I convert at 1 in 1000 to 1 in 1500 still on some stuff, maybe I am just being negative. But that took 15 years of savvy to accomplish. Still i sense the pie went elsewhere (tubes? forums? traffic leveraging required?)

Generally the money does not come easy for most newbs that is for sure.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by adendreams

Sorry but as I also admire Paul as an elder statesman, a lot of the stuff he says is just fundamentally wrong.

There is MORE money being spent on online porn now than ever - each year more credit cards are taken out of wallets and entered into porn sites NOT LESS - this is Pauls major flaw that he cant seem to understand this.

I hear ya man. Altho I am not rich I AM doing better now than since about late 2007 when FUCKING Google canned me from Adwords.

And they WERE WRONG both ethicly and morally and with the BRO code. lol They were wrong and my income dropped NINTY PERCENT overnight) so hey it's been a battle and a lot of consolidation and really leaning on those who know more than me. Guys who are smart and I get to go along and keep riding on this glorious train I left on in 1996.

The ole guys know. I never was rich (OK for a while in 1999 LOL) but I always followed the smarts.. the money and.. they (you) many of you, were always kind.

There is ALWAYS new progs and new smarts that is making money. Just have to FIND what you think is a good prog and TRY. Some will fail. Some will succeed. How it works.

[Vjo]

feel the love

well it's the life that i choose

big wheel keep on turning
neon burning up above
and im just high on the world
cmon take a low ride with me girl



Sabby?

Sabby and I once rode the big wheel to this song right here on GFY

girl you look so pretty to me
just like you always did

it was real

The big train will keep on rocking altho you may have to bust a lil ass.

Literally, sitting all the time..

[CurrentlySober]

Originally Posted by Vjo

That is actually what gave me the idea. But I think he was just BSing. No way he owns that domain.

Yeah, I'm just fucking about... Its not my domain, and I'm amazed its lasted too...

You may ask why I am posting it here, cause its like I'm being a bit of a cunt, and in a way, I suppose I am, but the reason is simple...

I'm a big 'Big Brother' (The TV Show) fan, and the owner spammed a big brother forum with it repeatedly... That annoyed me, because porn is porn, and big brother is a family (ish) TV show, and theres no need o mix the two together.

I know for a fact that the forum it was posted on, has a lot of posters in the 13 to 17 age group, and I dont like the idea of the kids clicking a link thinking its something to do with facebook (Which is a official method of voting for big brother) and being greeted by a namek masturbating individual.

Call me old fashioned, but everything has its place, and as a grandfather myself, (im 43) although I know kids access tubes and cam sites, i didn't feel that forum was the proper place...

Anyway, I'm off to my Pinball League meeting for the rest of the day ! I play in the South West league... Wish me luck !

Laterzzz

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by CurrentlySober

Yeah, I'm just fucking about... Its not my domain, and I'm amazed its lasted too...

You may ask why I am posting it here, cause its like I'm being a bit of a cunt, and in a way, I suppose I am, but the reason is simple...

I'm a big 'Big Brother' (The TV Show) fan, and the owner spammed a big brother forum with it repeatedly... That annoyed me, because porn is porn, and big brother is a family (ish) TV show, and theres no need o mix the two together.

I know for a fact that the forum it was posted on, has a lot of posters in the 13 to 17 age group, and I dont like the idea of the kids clicking a link thinking its something to do with facebook (Which is a official method of voting for big brother) and being greeted by a namek masturbating individual.

Call me old fashioned, but everything has its place, and as a grandfather myself, (im 43) although I know kids access tubes and cam sites, i didn't feel that forum was the proper place...

Anyway, I'm off to my Pinball League meeting for the rest of the day ! I play in the South West league... Wish me luck !

Laterzzz

Hey man, I love your posts.

I go off on tangents all the time. Keeps it fun.

I like Julie Chen a lot LOL but not big on Big Brother.

Survivor tho Coming up in about 2 weeks.

Anyhow this is a thread to bemoan how much selling porn SUCKS even if it is still the easiest money around. hehe We all have our war stories and day to day battles. Early Sat am here. When things are mellow.

Good luck with your Pinball League meeting in the South West league.

LOL Can you say Diversication. All lifestyles here.

I actually used to play a pretty mean pinball.

Maybe if I have another drag off this... maybe I can get into..

a lil..

Roger and Pete for CS our own

Pinball Wizard

from Soho down to Brighten
i must have played them all
but i aint seen nothing like him



sure plays a mean pinball

all the best head banger shit comes out of Great Britain

great, great guitar work

[Vjo]

Ooops it's Sunday not Saturday. LOL

Noone in the US is awake.

I am hard to wake up to

Lots of good info there tho for those who will read. Lots of inspiration and life's tactics.

And when I come to GFY I am looking for life's tactics dammit. LOL

BF will prob tell me any sec that I have a firm grasp on the obvious LOL and my feelings will be hurt. LOL

Got any snow over there yet BF? Doing well over here so far. About 2 inches on the ground.

And the one guy who hates LOL's will not be happy with me.

Dam I cant win em all

heres to me, double nickles (couple weeks back)



tough one to swallow but with your help still on the train

still 21 in my mind

lets play boyz while the playing is good

one more (of course)

[adendreams]

Do you really like Poo? Or is it just comedy? I hope you like shit because if you are just doing it to be funny then the joke has gotten pretty stale dude haha

[12clicks]

A maturing business always squeezes out the weak and the dumb. Those of us still doing well can't be bothered spending much time chatting to a bunch of failures and part timers.
You're ideas about this business are wrong and we know it. We also know that if you challenge the bottom rung mentality of the group, you get every troll who's registered attacking you.
There's nothing unique going on here, the dumb are just being squeezed out.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by adendreams

Do you really like Poo? Or is it just comedy? I hope you like shit because if you are just doing it to be funny then the joke has gotten pretty stale dude haha

hehe I once gave him crap (parden the pun) about it but then I realized hey he is just doing his thing so now we are good buds who like good shit

I knew Ron was reading this. I did. I have a feeling who is reading like ESP.

Anyhow, I havent posted for a week so got carried away.

Whatever Ron says is OK with me. I havnt read it but I seen something about weeding out and yeah this is true. But we can all smile and have fun while we cut each other's neck. We dont have to be all serious all the time. OK Ill read it now..

NY btw has a policy where bank accounts can not be touched up to $2500 I think by creditors or anyone else Kudos hehe

This has been a tutorial for those a lil down on their luck.

If I really had balls I would start a thread and educate the masses.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

A maturing business always squeezes out the weak and the dumb. Those of us still doing well can't be bothered spending much time chatting to a bunch of failures and part timers.
You're ideas about this business are wrong and we know it. We also know that if you challenge the bottom rung mentality of the group, you get every troll who's registered attacking you.
There's nothing unique going on here, the dumb are just being squeezed out.

That may be true.

Listen 12 Clicks, there is nothing better than a betters thread and you belittling others and me, It is the BEST to read. Seriously the best Wanted to tell you.

They tell you your prog sucks. You tell them they suck.

It's great stuff man.

Feel the love. Listen sometimes the truth is hard to swallow and as a side note your progs always paid on time.

I do remember the Search Box prog (someone mentioned it) along with Raw Like Sushi, Mojo Money was it or MojoCash and the Story prog. Story Book Cash. That was a GOOD prog man. I used that about 4-5 years back.

So.. I have some love for 12 Clicks but I love when you all give him shit. hehe It is just fun.

BTW I am only about 1/2 mile from a Micky D's lol. You would all be my better then.

The always possible, ever hated, always dreaded "fry cook" in all of our futures

Why fry cook and not shelf stocker which is worse. Is it because we are all greasy with tatoos and made for fry cooking? lol j/k

Ya know the sleazy fry cook guy. Porn peddler - fry cook (equal on the social status level )

[BJ]

broke losers! LOL

[cherrylula]

Originally Posted by 12clicks

A maturing business always squeezes out the weak and the dumb. Those of us still doing well can't be bothered spending much time chatting to a bunch of failures and part timers.
You're ideas about this business are wrong and we know it. We also know that if you challenge the bottom rung mentality of the group, you get every troll who's registered attacking you.
There's nothing unique going on here, the dumb are just being squeezed out.

oh man, harsh, but yeah I'll actually say he is right.

links pulled

oh, if there is some personal attack in that post, I don't know what that is all about if I quoted that. lol

[CyberHustler]

As long as I can support my weed habit...

[Barefootsies]

There are a lot of people in this industry who still read GFY on a daily basis, but just choose not to post anymore because of the trolls and bullshit. I've heard this from people directly at conferences. Especially program/business owners just do not have the time, patience, interest to deal with the negativity.

They admit they still check in daily to keep up on the happenings, just no longer post.

[cherrylula]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

There are a lot of people in this industry who still read GFY on a daily basis, but just choose not to post anymore because of the trolls and bullshit. I've heard this from people directly at conferences. Especially program/business owners just do not have the time, patience, interest to deal with the negativity.

They admit they still check in daily to keep up on the happenings, just no longer post.

It has always been that way. Soooooo many people out there who never post but read this board. Webmasters with business.

THEY LIVE

bet the trolls don't realize they are one big show over here ha ha

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by CyberHustler

As long as I can support my weed habit...

word brotha seriously

It is in this order of importance:

Basic Nut (and I mean basic) however always own your own nut. Get out of the apt for a double wide.
Weed
Beer
Butter or Smart Balance (you need a lot of that, you do
Potatoes (cheap as hell right now $4.65 for 15 LBs reds or russet)
Cat Food
Meat (what ever is on sale, great deal on chicken lately)
Pizza
Other Food
Cell Phone
Adult Entertainment Too high on Maslow's Scale of Heirarchy. I never get this far lol
Any unnecessary spending such as:
Paying for porn lol
Cable TV (who needs that, I am a wm remember, I know shit
Home Phone (fuck you, i hate calls)

[Vjo]

Just an outline for your ave adult wm who is a lil tight lately to gauge their own future budget Your needs may vary.

living on a prayer and a signup



Shouts to BF. My man.

We on the stage are all entertainers.

[Trolleater]

The board is pretty much useless compared to the good old days. If you ask a question on here for help with something, you're lucky to get an answer at all.

Most often people will just write something stupid for a sig spot.

[Vjo]

Originally Posted by Trolleater

The board is pretty much useless compared to the good old days. If you ask a question on here for help with something, you're lucky to get an answer at all.

Most often people will just write something stupid for a sig spot.

True and not true. If you are a true bro you will
get answers always or if you are a somewhat loved anon bro like me if the q is indeed something you cant do on your own.

Thing is times are tough and demanding for time. I worked hard for 6 days trying to get some sales going. Seen you post. Seen many post but I decided I would not post unless maybe an emergency or something.

But yeah many people let you hang. Just the way it is. Sometimes someone gives you what you want. Most times it is all a waste of time in the end if you spend too much time on any board unless you are just "fucking around".

I fuck around and answer a few threads whatever and other days I dont post or I dont get nothing done. Cant sit on my butt all day everyday living alone. But I love f'n posting shit.

I been in this thread like 6+ hours LOL

[Fletch XXX]

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

Talk shit, make money. Good days.

aint shit changed bruh.

still talking shit still making money

[Vjo]

Plus I guarantee only maybe two of the people who were with me all night read all my shit. Noone reads most everyones posts. I dont even read ALL of everyone's shit in this thread so how can I expect you to read mine.

I try and write so it is easy to scan but noone reads everyone's shit.

We all love to shoot our mouth off.

[Vjo]

We wms are good at one thing:

Talking shit. lol It's true.

Oh and I forgot potato and/or corn chips on the list. Just after cat food.

Food Club Chedder and Sour Cream (no msg) Best ever chip. 2 for $3.98 and 11.5 oz each.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by adendreams

Paul I have nothing against you. I don't hate you like almost everyone else here. But I am intimately familiar with stats and sales of the people I do biz with and they are making a LOT of money and sales are going up not down, which means you have no fucking clue what you are talking about.

My route? CD's? HUH? You're not embalmed already are you?

Aden I have nothing against you. I don't hate anyone like almost everyone else here. But I am intimately familiar with stats and sales of the people I do biz with and they are making a LOT LESS money and sales are going down, which means you have no fucking clue what you are talking about.

My route? Retirement on the money made from shooting non exclusive porn for 30 years.

So the people you shoot for having given you access to their stats.

[CaptainHowdy]

Aren't we all spectres anyways??