Could Porn Monopolies Mean The Death Of The Affiliate Model?

[AdultPornMasta]

Now I may be perhaps rambling but I am speculating that the recent acquisitions of various porn companies by Manwin could additionally be heralding the death of the affiliate model. I also have not done a lot of homework on this, so my thoughts on the matter may just be bullshit but you never know.

Think about it.

GFY has for the most part gone to shit with infighting, Ad Hominem attacks and little real discussion of business matters and how to promote the industry.

Lots of "Join My Program" but not a lot after that.

Think about it.

WTF does a company like Manwin need with a bunch of fuckers like those who hang around here? A few hundred in-house people could do anything and everything that the affiliates are currently doing and the cost of paying affiliates would be eliminated. A real accessory benefit would be that the bullshit of the kind seen here on GFY as well as on other sites would be eliminated. Manwin could exercise total control over its marketing methods, not have to fuck around with every Tom, Dick and Harry who imagines himself an adult webmaster.

Were I an aff manager for Manwin I would look at applications and upon finding that the applicant was a GFY memeber, write back, "Thank you for your application. Denied. Have a nice day!"

Why would any aff manager want to put up with people who engage in the kind of bullshit that goes on aroudn here?

Much easier to hire in-house people on a salary-plus-commission basis to do the same job! In-house merchant account, in-house promotional software, in-house people.

In short, total and complete control with ALL of the money moving through the parent company's merchant account.

As I wrote at the beginning of this tome, these are sort of random thoughts, I haven't finished thinking about it and am only looking for your input.

[Due]

It will go back to how it was in the 90s.

Do you want a banner ? No problem, you can make as many banners as you like and use to promote us.
Do you need content ? Sure you can buy as much content as you like and use to promote our sites.
Need blog posts ? What the heck is that
Can I promote your program ? Sure, just make sure you are not promoting anyone else on the same page. Also please do not use target NEW, BLANK, etc etc.

[AdultPornMasta]

Originally Posted by Due

It will go back to how it was in the 90s.

Do you want a banner ? No problem, you can make as many banners as you like and use to promote us.
Do you need content ? Sure you can buy as much content as you like and use to promote our sites.
Need blog posts ? What the heck is that
Can I promote your program ? Sure, just make sure you are not promoting anyone else on the same page. Also please do not use target NEW, BLANK, etc etc.

Thank you for you kind and insightful reply.

This is the kind of thing that I am looking for. We gotz storms here with rain, hail and high winds, so I had to bring in my laptop, my drink and can't smoke inside, dammit.



Speaking of my drink, it is a very large screwdriver made in one of those insulated mugs with a straw. I'm only having ONE drink which I "refresh" periodically with both new vodka and orange juice.

Also I know that I have some typos in my OP but that sort of thing goes along with the Unending Screwdriver.

Deal with it people.

[Roald]

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

[AdultPornMasta]

Originally Posted by Roald

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

Thank you for your kind and insightful reply.

[mospunk]

I hope not. Just getting started here and looking to get into being an affiliate lol.

[ravo]

Almost any Internet biz (and especially adult) has such a low barrier to entry that there will never be a monopoly (or even close to it). There will always be new aggressive companies looking for affiliates, traffic, and sales.

Frankly, the affiliate model, especially revshare, is low capital cost way to generate sales.

[halfpint]

No need for affiliates anymore when you can put a tube up, buy some content or emebed them from other tubes and make bank on selling adspace, popups and mobile redirects. Its so much easier

[Emil]

Originally Posted by Roald

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

Then I will be the one starting up a free-for-all affiliate program and make some serious money. Imagine having 30k affiliates pushing your stuff only.

[notinmybackyard]

It's going to go back to the way it used to be. Just give it time. Web 3.0 is going to be all small hand held consumer gadgets and anyone that's a serious masturbator will come looking for the higher quality stuff.

Plus there is the "social" element to consider for many porn consumers. As an example I've been contacted twice in the last 3 months to consulte on opening up new porn cinemas and acccess to theatre quality videos. Regardless of your personal opinions, men like to sit next to other men and masturbate to heterosexuel porn. And low grade gonzo films just are not sufficient for this sort of activity.

[oppoten]

Google is the death of the affiliate model. Because the affiliate model, unlike the tubes, is not the same as Google's model. Too many affiliates still don't understand the difference between content and advertising.

[SpicyM]

They own the majority of adult traffic already.

[helterskelter808]

You can't have monopolies in a particular market, like porn, for the rather obvious reason.

BTW, well done on criticizing "infighting" and "ad hominem" attacks here, while simultaneously bitching about and insulting everyone yourself throughout your post.

Good to see you're doing your part to keep this place civil.

[signupdamnit]

The rise of Manwin means less opportunity for your average affiliate. Especially since this business has a strong history of being of the copycat type. But there is always going to be demand for people with traffic which buys. If Manwin doesn't want to bother with a small affiliate then someone else will. Probably a small sponsor.

The real question is whether the rise of the pirate model means the demise of the average small affiliate and pay site owner. Like I said there are still plenty who want to do business with affiliates but it is getting harder to convert. Can the average affiliate stay in the business when their average conversions are 1:7,000? Is a pay site a sustainable business model for a small time owner?

[topnotch, standup guy]

Originally Posted by halfpint

No need for affiliates anymore when you can put a tube up, buy some content or emebed them from other tubes and make bank on selling adspace, popups and mobile redirects. Its so much easier

Oh look.. it's GFY's new tube boy supremo again.

Why don't you sit down and give your Manwin cheerleading act a fucking rest already? It's getting old.

Very old.
.

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by AdultPornMasta

Now I may be perhaps rambling but I am speculating that the recent acquisitions of various porn companies by Manwin could additionally be heralding the death of the affiliate model. I also have not done a lot of homework on this, so my thoughts on the matter may just be bullshit but you never know.

Think about it.

GFY has for the most part gone to shit with infighting, Ad Hominem attacks and little real discussion of business matters and how to promote the industry.

Lots of "Join My Program" but not a lot after that.

Think about it.

WTF does a company like Manwin need with a bunch of fuckers like those who hang around here? A few hundred in-house people could do anything and everything that the affiliates are currently doing and the cost of paying affiliates would be eliminated. A real accessory benefit would be that the bullshit of the kind seen here on GFY as well as on other sites would be eliminated. Manwin could exercise total control over its marketing methods, not have to fuck around with every Tom, Dick and Harry who imagines himself an adult webmaster.

Were I an aff manager for Manwin I would look at applications and upon finding that the applicant was a GFY memeber, write back, "Thank you for your application. Denied. Have a nice day!"

Why would any aff manager want to put up with people who engage in the kind of bullshit that goes on aroudn here?

Much easier to hire in-house people on a salary-plus-commission basis to do the same job! In-house merchant account, in-house promotional software, in-house people.

In short, total and complete control with ALL of the money moving through the parent company's merchant account.

As I wrote at the beginning of this tome, these are sort of random thoughts, I haven't finished thinking about it and am only looking for your input.

pretty sure the jerk offs here at gfy aren't making any money for themselves or anybody

[MrCain]

Ravo nailed it

[adultmobile]

Originally Posted by Roald

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

And Roald's freeones is one of the few sites under alexa #1000 which still got affiliate links in it!

Most sites with the biggest traffic are selling such a traffic exclusively as prepay spots or via brokers based on bids, they do not risk selling their traffic as affiliates for revshare or pps or else. In the past years as a program I contacted 100's of the top alexa #5000 adult sites and 95% of them reply something such as: "We sell spots as prepay only, or you can buy ads via broker X, we are no affiliates.".

It seems to me, that only who gets too few traffic to get any program interested in buying spots in pre-pay, it will put affiliate links. And anyway most of them got one of those traffic brokers in spots so a program can buy via "run whole network" banners order, it includes all those small sites together... but this is not an affiliate really.

The above it confirms that "in house traffic", as well as traffic buy for fixed price (then it is the program issue to convert this), it is where most of the business goes.
In fact as a program, we get 5% of sales from affiliates, and 95% of sales from traffic buys and in house traffic. This is especially brutal ratio since we opened the affiliate program only in 2012 while we was only doing traffic buy and got only few selected deals with pay site member areas for previous years, we did not started with an affiliate program at all.

And, specifically to manwin, we tried a traffic buy of $10,000 from trafficjunky for pornhub, tube8 etc. flash animated banners in mid 2011, and got decent signups, even if we did not buy again as we had not unlimited budget to spend and other sources was better with same price (including skimmed and popunders etc. elsewhere). However if we had bigger budget, we had no choice than buy more from manwin too, after having purchased all the non-manwin decent available traffic elsewhere.

I would like to add, that since we opened the affiliate program, about 70% of the new active "webmasters" are frauds. We pay for free leads which attracted a number of people using different proxies to signup themselves. Plus, the PPS $80 option it is a preferred destination for carders; and, we learned from chat traffic people, so these people esp. filipino contact real westerns asking them to deposit $10 to get back $25 or so, like a money multiplication schema. We catch most of them quick enough, but to babysit those fraudsters it is a big time waste for our organisation. Even more than manage traffic buys as these are limited and we just check stats and decide what links to keep and what to drop, it is not dozens of new fraudsters every week using creative ways to scam us. I understand if we offered rev share, we would get more real affiliates, but possibly they would bang cards with higher amounts simply.

So as a program what I say about the traffic monopolies? Is that the death of the affiliate model? I think the monopolies are just a consolidation answer to some other factors, such as you no more do that much money by run a tgp with ccbill galleries and banners. When something no more produce enough money, people stop doing it, and whatever else does money it is being made. Hosting full videos in tubes it brings more traffic to sell, but this cost a lot in hosting every month so you can't risk to sell traffic as affiliate and miss to pay the next hosting bill, so bigger companies and prepaid spots make this more stable.

Imagine a mid tube must pay $50,000 a month of hosting, theyh try a new sponsor and it does not convert, so the next month you can't pay the hosting bill?
The answer it is bigger company, rely on sell traffic not by % of sales results of such a traffic, and so on. If you ask me will those people who buy traffic get back the investment? I think no, and this is where the tubes do income. In the fail of a % of who buy its traffic. The tubes move the fail of no conversion to a third part who buy to them

[AdultPornMasta]

Thank you all for your replies!

Keep'em coming please!

[epitome]

See, I read threads like this and think "everybody so worried about it could have made a blog post in the time they spent in this thread."

Then you could become one of those affiliates Roald mentioned.

[adultmobile]

Originally Posted by epitome

See, I read threads like this and think "everybody so worried about it could have made a blog post in the time they spent in this thread."

Then you could become one of those affiliates Roald mentioned.

I wanted to add most of those biggest traffic sites within alexa #5k are not posting in GFY.

[AdultPornMasta]

Originally Posted by epitome

See, I read threads like this and think "everybody so worried about it could have made a blog post in the time they spent in this thread."

Then you could become one of those affiliates Roald mentioned.

I think you have missed the point of my original post but thanks for your input.

[xXXtesy10]

Originally Posted by topnotch, standup guy

Oh look.. it's GFY's new tube boy supremo again.

Why don't you sit down and give your Manwin cheerleading act a fucking rest already? It's getting old.

Very old.
.

He's a fucking moron, please give the dunce a break.

[AdultPornMasta]

Originally Posted by xXXtesy10

He's a fucking moron, please give the dunce a break.

You are doing a damn good job of proving my idea that GFY is no longer about business but rather about Ad Hominem attacks, infighting, trolling and general Hell raising but thank you for your reply to my thread.

Now what about a reply to my thoughts on the demise of the affiliate model?

[xXXtesy10]

Originally Posted by AdultPornMasta

You are doing a damn good job of proving my idea that GFY is no longer about business but rather about Ad Hominem attacks, infighting, trolling and general Hell raising but thank you for your reply to my thread.

Now what about a reply to my thoughts on the demise of the affiliate model?

Fuckin a bro. If it bothers you so much then get the fuck out of here

[AdultPornMasta]

Originally Posted by xXXtesy10

Fuckin a bro. If it bothers you so much then get the fuck out of here

You "bother" me not in the least but as I earlier wrote, you go a long way in terms of proving my idea that this forum is no longer about business and you have yet to come up with any sort of reply to my OP which is relevant and which makes sense.

[xXXtesy10]

Originally Posted by AdultPornMasta

You "bother" me not in the least but as I earlier wrote, you go a long way in terms of proving my idea that this forum is no longer about business and you have yet to come up with any sort of reply to my OP which is relevant and which makes sense.

fall for it every time board is great

[JuicyBunny]

Originally Posted by Roald

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

You must have gotten a massage at the Temple of the Golden Dawn. That massage clinic always works the truth out of one.

[Paul Markham]

People can't be controlled, directed or owned. They're people at a keyboard with a mouse. They always did and always will follow content. Big porn semi monopolies don't need 100s or 1,000s of affiliates demanding everything and payment.

Cut the free content and the affiliate dies very fast and the surfers who used to be going to him, go elsewhere. Affiliates create nothing for the industry as a whole. Only for individual sites. The only reason today for affiliates is loads of sponsors fighting each other to get affiliates to send the people. Take away them fighting for people to come and look at their samples. You remove the need for affiliates.

Even Roald will find it hard if the sponsors stop paying him. That's all they have to do to grab the people on his site. Unless he can find other places to send them, he's gone. ALL affiliates are reliant on the man with the money. Lots of them, the affiliates can switch sponsors, to few. The options are gone.

So the answer to the question is I'm afraid to say for all the affiliates out there is YES.

What it won't mean is the death of the shooters.

So those with a lot of content, set up a site and see if you can feed it with the people coming to your affiliate site. Traffic = people.

[DamianJ]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Traffic = people.

That's deep.

[ravo]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Cut the free content and .....

This will never happen, so the rest of your argument is moot.

[Barry-xlovecam]

Google has killed the smaller affiliate and the tubes have replaced a lot of the old affiliate traffic.

We are always interested in Affiliates that have ways to refer productive traffic.

However, affiliate marketing is costly in the long term as we continue to pay lifetime rev-shares, develop new marketing tools, and bear the costs in support of the ACWM Affiliate Program. Continuing and expanding our Affiliate Program is part of our overall marketing strategy but only part of that strategy -- it is a part of the whole.

Bottom line, the ACWM Affiliate Program for Xlovecam.com makes us money so why would we not continue it?

[SGS]

Originally Posted by Roald

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by ravo

This will never happen, so the rest of your argument is moot.

I meant cut the free content to affiliates. Didn't mke that clear and obvious to you. You're right that the sponsors left can't cut it out. Or another door opens for surfers to go through. All you need to draw surfers is CONTENT.

Big sponsors can grab all the surfers by giving them more free porn. Than the next man, then someone else will give them more free content. And then ..........

What's to stop a big company giving tons of free porn away and selling just surfers clicking on adverts?

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

Google has killed the smaller affiliate and the tubes have replaced a lot of the old affiliate traffic.

We are always interested in Affiliates that have ways to refer productive traffic.

However, affiliate marketing is costly in the long term as we continue to pay lifetime rev-shares, develop new marketing tools, and bear the costs in support of the ACWM Affiliate Program. Continuing and expanding our Affiliate Program is part of our overall marketing strategy but only part of that strategy -- it is a part of the whole.

Bottom line, the ACWM Affiliate Program for Xlovecam.com makes us money so why would we not continue it?

How do affiliates feed you lots of traffic without content sites providing them with the content?

Other than blogs and adwords.

Future might be you having to buy all your traffic.

[Roald]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

People can't be controlled, directed or owned. They're people at a keyboard with a mouse. They always did and always will follow content. Big porn semi monopolies don't need 100s or 1,000s of affiliates demanding everything and payment.

Cut the free content and the affiliate dies very fast and the surfers who used to be going to him, go elsewhere. Affiliates create nothing for the industry as a whole. Only for individual sites. The only reason today for affiliates is loads of sponsors fighting each other to get affiliates to send the people. Take away them fighting for people to come and look at their samples. You remove the need for affiliates.

Even Roald will find it hard if the sponsors stop paying him. That's all they have to do to grab the people on his site. Unless he can find other places to send them, he's gone. ALL affiliates are reliant on the man with the money. Lots of them, the affiliates can switch sponsors, to few. The options are gone.

So the answer to the question is I'm afraid to say for all the affiliates out there is YES.

What it won't mean is the death of the shooters.

So those with a lot of content, set up a site and see if you can feed it with the people coming to your affiliate site. Traffic = people.

.....

Wrote a whole alinea but the wifi fucked up and I don't feel like rewriting it.

You are correct of course.

[pornguy]

Originally Posted by Due

It will go back to how it was in the 90s.

Do you want a banner ? No problem, you can make as many banners as you like and use to promote us.
Do you need content ? Sure you can buy as much content as you like and use to promote our sites.
Need blog posts ? What the heck is that
Can I promote your program ? Sure, just make sure you are not promoting anyone else on the same page. Also please do not use target NEW, BLANK, etc etc.

This is a fair reply but it wont be like that any more. Similar but not the same.

Most of the companies realized that the affiliates making banners and using purchased content was not really good for the rebill business and thats the most important part ( or at least one of )of a paysite.

If the affiliate uses a girl thats not in the site or a scene thats not in the site that means a cancelled membership and often either a refund or a CB. That means no upsell to cams or pills or what ever and a loss to the site because the affiliate still got paid.

What programs will do is this

1. Seek to have the majority of sales from their own traffic
2. make banners for people
3. make hosted galleries and send them out
4. the programs will begin to Limit more and more what they give and to who.

Lots of programs are going to become invite only.

[Barry-xlovecam]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

How do affiliates feed you lots of traffic without content sites providing them with the content?

Other than blogs and adwords.

Future might be you having to buy all your traffic.

You answered your own question to some degree. But I will embellish a bit; Some Affiliates also know how to program and make use of our many XML feeds, updated in real-time, to make their own marketing displays. Some actually have websites that attract interested surfers in cams.

We provide our own webcam content free to our affiliates.

People interested in cams are not necessarily interested in porn video or images -- live cams is an interactive activity -- interactivity is not defined by you and your right hand on a tube site ...

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

You answered your own question to some degree. But I will embellish a bit; Some Affiliates also know how to program and make use of our many XML feeds, updated in real-time, to make their own marketing displays. Some actually have websites that attract interested surfers in cams.

We provide our own webcam content free to our affiliates.

People interested in cams are not necessarily interested in porn video or images -- live cams is an interactive activity -- interactivity is not defined by you and your right hand on a tube site ...

As I said I wasn't including the ones who don't rely on recorded porn in any way will be safe. Because it's business sense that if you can cut out the middle man, you get more.

[Barry-xlovecam]

In a greater sense; Google AdWords, Affiliates, and Traffic Brokers are all middlemen -- we prefer a diversified mix for stability -- it is really that simple. Our ROMI is on an averaged cost of these marketing methods with the cost of our overall traffic being averaged with the fourth factor -- our own organic search referrals and those are a large amount of the whole picture.

[AdultPornMasta]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I meant cut the free content to affiliates. Didn't mke that clear and obvious to you. You're right that the sponsors left can't cut it out. Or another door opens for surfers to go through. All you need to draw surfers is CONTENT.

Big sponsors can grab all the surfers by giving them more free porn. Than the next man, then someone else will give them more free content. And then ..........

What's to stop a big company giving tons of free porn away and selling just surfers clicking on adverts?

You know, Paul, I'm thinking that your suggestion may well indeed be a viable business model with tons of profit.

What is to stop a small company from doing the same?

I am going to research this and get back to you.

Thank you for you input.

[halfpint]

Originally Posted by topnotch, standup guy

Oh look.. it's GFY's new tube boy supremo again.

Why don't you sit down and give your Manwin cheerleading act a fucking rest already? It's getting old.

Very old.
.

[topnotch, standup guy]

Originally Posted by AdultPornMasta

You are doing a damn good job of proving my idea that GFY is no longer about business but rather about Ad Hominem attacks, infighting, trolling and general Hell raising but thank you for your reply to my thread.

Now what about a reply to my thoughts on the demise of the affiliate model?

Your "thoughts" have been getting the replies they deserve tube boy.

[MaDalton]

Originally Posted by Roald

In house traffic, private programs and a few select affiliates who are able to push joins. That's what's going to happen, fuck wasting time on demanding affiliates not holding up on their part of the deal. Generating sales.

what he said

[ravo]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I meant cut the free content to affiliates. Didn't mke that clear and obvious to you. You're right that the sponsors left can't cut it out. Or another door opens for surfers to go through. All you need to draw surfers is CONTENT.

Big sponsors can grab all the surfers by giving them more free porn. Than the next man, then someone else will give them more free content. And then ..........

What's to stop a big company giving tons of free porn away and selling just surfers clicking on adverts?

That's what I meant too. Paul, you're forgetting that there are free market forces at play here. For each one large company wants to take away "free content to affiliates" there will be dozens of smaller, hungrier companies willing to provide it. Once the "free content for traffic" model was introduced, there's no going back. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.

[Bill8]

I thought everyone already understood the affiliate model was collapsing.

It won't vanish completely, just stratify dramatically (much worse that it has already).

Most affiliateships as we know them now will be gone by 2020.

It's not quite clear how much of a bottomfeeder/boutique marketplace for porn will be left.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by AdultPornMasta

You know, Paul, I'm thinking that your suggestion may well indeed be a viable business model with tons of profit.

What is to stop a small company from doing the same?

I am going to research this and get back to you.

Thank you for you input.

The problem with a small company is the small money it can raise. Think of it like this.

A surfer can join a big Manwin site with 5,000 great scenes or a small site with 50. What amount of free content can a small company put out, how much traffic will they get, how great can their tour be, how much will they convert and retain and what will their % of profit be on each $30?

If the small company can get around this by producing something better than a big Manwin site, they have a chance. If not they are going to struggle.

This will always be the problem, can you afford to employ or team up with a top class shooter who wants $3,000 a solo girl scene, wants to shoot 250 a year and fund him for a year to kick the site off if you're starting from scratch? And that only gives you 5 updates a week, you would need 2 or 3 of these to go up against.

And this has been the problem for 95% of the sites for years. Now the competing and better paying markets are gone a few can afford to employ or commission top shooters. Small companies can't.

Originally Posted by ravo

That's what I meant too. Paul, you're forgetting that there are free market forces at play here. For each one large company wants to take away "free content to affiliates" there will be dozens of smaller, hungrier companies willing to provide it. Once the "free content for traffic" model was introduced, there's no going back. You can't put the genie back in the bottle.

And you're forgetting the bloody obvious, read the above. Surfers are people not sheep.

[sandman!]

wont happen

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by sandman!

wont happen

https://gfy.com/showthread.php?t=1085481

I just saw a 4K 84" television at an electronics shop. If I were an affiliate, I would either be gearing up for the next big wave or looking in to buying some physical gear and become a producer.