is there no "next big thing" going on? - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

pimpmaster9000 · 02-04-2019, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

The work won't be done by creating a 3D model and then animating it.

The work will be done by filming a real person, then using deep learning to handle the animation, speech and interaction. Relatively speaking there are simple applications of this now in mainstream, such as virtual newsreader.

As massively multicore multiprocessor computing power becomes more affordable these things will be easier to do at scale and at lower cost.

I follow AI pretty closely, I've seen some of the proof of concept things being worked on now and I can tell you that virtual camgirls will be driven by AI not by 3D models and animation.

the first problem with this deep learning stuff is that cam girls get 100 strange requests per day...just from the last couple of days I have heard about guys who get of on girls flexing their traps, girls being asked to spank their chair, pucker their asshole and make farting sounds etc...

good luck pre-filming all the strange shit customers come up with and getting deep learning to make this in to a believable and realistic motion...all this for like 100$/day from one model...the method you mention is a chain with some very strong and some very weak links...an AI news anchor just sits and talks...

on the other hand studios have empty rooms...it costs them 0 to put in a cam girl...

sure you can do a lot of things if you throw enough money at it...but to do it cost effectively and for a profit worth going after, this will take decades for the tech and interests to be there...

Bladewire · 02-04-2019, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crucifissio

the first problem with this deep learning stuff is that cam girls get 100 strange requests per day...just from the last couple of days I have heard about guys who get of on girls flexing their traps, girls being asked to spank their chair, pucker their asshole and make farting sounds etc...

good luck pre-filming all the strange shit customers come up with and getting deep learning to make this in to a believable and realistic motion...all this for like 100$/day from one model...the method you mention is a chain with some very strong and some very weak links...an AI news anchor just sits and talks...

on the other hand studios have empty rooms...it costs them 0 to put in a cam girl...

sure you can do a lot of things if you throw enough money at it...but to do it cost effectively and for a profit worth going after, this will take decades for the tech and interests to be there...

Crucifissio you will be obsolete soon adapter die

pimpmaster9000 · 02-04-2019, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bladewire

Crucifissio you will be obsolete soon adapter die

no I wont...nobody is going to pay to see a 3d model...I know my customers...who ever invests in this 3d model stripper stuff should be prepared to spend a fuckload of money to have to accept 10cents/minute because real models will always be more in demand than 3d ones...a chain is only as strong as its weakest link...

Paul Markham · 02-04-2019, 08:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thommy

paul paul paul - you really don´t have a clue.
and stupid statements don´t make you look wiser.
you did not even realize that there are dozens of big free livecams around since 10 years.

means: you do not know NOTHING whats happens in our biz

so you never heard about bongacash, chaturbate, cam4 and all the others where you do not have to pay a cent if you are not willing to pay ???

that´s all new for you, right ?

you are a bicycle driver explaining the rest of the world how to build a spaceship.
you are really the biggest clown here.

All the sites you name exist on Tips and/or private shows. But the real money for Cam Girls is working for themselves. So GFY with your bullshit

AdultKing · 02-04-2019, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crucifissio

the first problem with this deep learning stuff is that cam girls get 100 strange requests per day...just from the last couple of days I have heard about guys who get of on girls flexing their traps, girls being asked to spank their chair, pucker their asshole and make farting sounds etc...

GAN systems will be able to learn from those requests and replicate exactly what the cam participant wants, further more Predictive AI, such as discussed in the f-GAN paper will be able to anticipate what the participant wants to see before they even request it.

If you want to know more about this stuff (be prepared for lots of complex mathematics) then read a paper by Martín Arjovsky and two other researchers entitled "Wasserstein GAN" - I think you might have to pay to get a copy though. In summary predictive AI will be used heavily in AI use cases that require human interaction.

Quote:

good luck pre-filming all the strange shit customers come up with and getting deep learning to make this in to a believable and realistic motion...all this for like 100$/day from one model...the method you mention is a chain with some very strong and some very weak links...an AI news anchor just sits and talks...

You don't need to pre-film anything, all the data is there already. If you gave a large distributed GAN and train it with all the videos on Pornhub then I would think that there would not be a sexual act or position that could not be simulated by AI. Also read what I say about predictive AI above.

Quote:

sure you can do a lot of things if you throw enough money at it...but to do it cost effectively and for a profit worth going after, this will take decades for the tech and interests to be there...

It's less than 10 years away and the platforms on which you build GANs and AI projects already exist.

I always recommend that people who want to learn a little about AI and what is possible head over to OpenAI and get Gym, it's a good easy introduction to what AI is capable of.

https://gym.openai.com

lmfao irl · 02-04-2019, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bladewire

Crucifissio you will be obsolete soon adapter die

sure will

I just told him how I made 600+ sales last month with less than 500 uv a day (using cam models). Then he goes on a rant about blah blah blah, I stopped reading

Yall niggas enjoy your sex robots and spaceship gangbangs I'ma be here in reality.

Paul Markham · 02-04-2019, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lmfao irl

We are not 50 years away or 10 years away or 100 years away from a computer replacing a camgirl. If that is the case, why do camsites exist now? Everyone would be 100% content with interacting with pre-recorded video and not seek out camsites. Point, and case.

Don't spout out some A.I. bullshit, there will always be purist who seek human interaction.

Cam site exist now because it hasn't been perfected. But people are getting there.

Another way to do it is pre-record all the different options a guy asks a girl, then the bits asked for can be done by the model. As they are asked for. As someone who created content for decades I can tell you it doesn't change much because sex doesn't change.

Would it wipe out sales? No sales would still happen, but think of the ratios. What did Tubes to to pay site sales.

lmfao irl · 02-04-2019, 09:11 AM

and lol @ adapter

lmfao irl · 02-04-2019, 09:12 AM

Idk, maybe for people who are into animi and hentai and stuff? My team and I work one on one with clients every day and I'll be damnned if any of them want anything less than a real experience with a real human.

Paul Markham · 02-04-2019, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

The work won't be done by creating a 3D model and then animating it.

The work will be done by filming a real person, then using deep learning to handle the animation, speech and interaction. Relatively speaking there are simple applications of this now in mainstream, such as an AI driven virtual newsreader.

As massively multicore multiprocessor computing power becomes more affordable these things will be easier to do at scale and at lower cost.

We concur.

Paul Markham · 02-04-2019, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thommy

the efford is not that big as you think.

sure you have to preproduce every possible scene but you can replace bodies and faces with every body or face you want.

i have seen such things already around millenium with live morphing and it looked even than fucking real. with techniques of today you can do much much more. there are discussions since years about the rights of an actor´s look. they would be already able to make a movie with arnold schwarzenegger and he is not even at the set.

Once the software is available, anyone can use it for anything.

lmfao irl · 02-04-2019, 09:18 AM

Paul Markham are you WITH or AGAINST the PBBC?? (asking for a friend)

thommy · 02-04-2019, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

All the sites you name exist on Tips and/or private shows. But the real money for Cam Girls is working for themselves. So GFY with your bullshit

1. some of them also selling ads and make good money with that
2. tip is not a membership fee - how many % do you think giving tips and how many % watch for free and spend zero?
3. the camgirls work for themself. they are using a big plattform and don´t have to care the technique, the payment and the promotion.

you are simply not a business man and you can not calculate a big biz.
that´s why you sit at home and tell everybody that pornbiz is dead while we all make
much more money as in the days that you call "the good ones".

i tell you what: not even in this "good days" you made the money that was possible to make. and the only "good" in this old days was that even an idiot could make more money as he would do in a regular job.

so you had this chance and for sure made more as you would make with your skills anywhere else. so just sit back and accept that the time of amateur business man is past.

there is also no reason to explain you that you are wrong. you are not part of this biz anymore and nobody needs you or get you back into the biz.
so believe what you want - drink your water while the smart ones are drinking champaign.

celandina · 02-04-2019, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

In online porn there's no "Big thing" coming. Because when you give away what the consumer needs you kill demand to pay for it.

HD, 3D, VR have all failed to rescue porn from a steady decline, that still continues. Not to say porn is dead, it will never die. It's just paying for it that's in decline.

Paying for shit is in decline.
Paying for recycled shit is in decline.
Paying for shit even though has a fancy new tech ( 3D and VR) is in the decline.
Paying for good and original content in on the upswing

AdultKing · 02-04-2019, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

We concur.

I love how you concur when you probably don't understand a word I typed in that post. However seeing as you concur, perhaps you could tell me what a GAN is and how can it be applied to the use case we are discussing?

pimpmaster9000 · 02-04-2019, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

GAN systems will be able to learn from those requests and replicate exactly what the cam participant wants, further more Predictive AI, such as discussed in the f-GAN paper will be able to anticipate what the participant wants to see before they even request it.

If you want to know more about this stuff (be prepared for lots of complex mathematics) then read a paper by Martín Arjovsky and two other researchers entitled "Wasserstein GAN" - I think you might have to pay to get a copy though. In summary predictive AI will be used heavily in AI use cases that require human interaction.

You don't need to pre-film anything, all the data is there already. If you gave a large distributed GAN and train it with all the videos on Pornhub then I would think that there would not be a sexual act or position that could not be simulated by AI. Also read what I say about predictive AI above.

It's less than 10 years away and the platforms on which you build GANs and AI projects already exist.

I always recommend that people who want to learn a little about AI and what is possible head over to OpenAI and get Gym, it's a good easy introduction to what AI is capable of.

https://gym.openai.com

your chain has a lot of strong links no doubt...but the weakest one is $$$...you will NEVER get 3-4$/min for an animated model...no matter how good she looks...you will also NOT get the AI models cheap...it will be a major investment for a questionable ROI...

on the other hand it costs me 0$ to set up a real model, I always have a room free...

AdultKing · 02-04-2019, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crucifissio

your chain has a lot of strong links no doubt...but the weakest one is $$$...you will NEVER get 3-4$/min for an animated model...no matter how good she looks...you will also NOT get the AI models cheap...it will be a major investment for a questionable ROI...

With NVIDIA's face synthesis AI you can generate as many faces as you like, all different, once the model is trained, set up and running.

As technology develops and this becomes possible for video, speech and real time interaction the cost becomes no greater than the platform upon which it runs, because you will have infinite generational capacity from the AI.

Once this stuff becomes real and not simply in the realm of research then you won't need to get $3 - $4 per minute. The companies that successfully bring these things to market will only need to get cents per minute (I don't even think per minute charging would apply - it would be another billing model).

pimpmaster9000 · 02-04-2019, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

With NVIDIA's face synthesis AI you can generate as many faces as you like, all different, once the model is trained, set up and running.

As technology develops and this becomes possible for video, speech and real time interaction the cost becomes no greater than the platform upon which it runs, because you will have infinite generational capacity from the AI.

Once this stuff becomes real and not simply in the realm of research then you won't need to get $3 - $4 per minute. The companies that successfully bring these things to market will only need to get cents per minute (I don't even think per minute charging would apply - it would be another billing model).

maybe a new generation of people will be in to non-real models who knows...it may be a flop like 3d was...maybe not...I know this dude made money by streaming a pre-recorded video of a model and people tipped nevertheless...a sucker is born every day....

astronaut x · 02-04-2019, 04:00 PM

I tell the old people in my life to stop paying for cable TV all the time.

Sadly some of the old people on GFY don't seem to get it.

Resident GFY old person....I found your....

Paul Markham · 02-05-2019, 04:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thommy

1. some of them also selling ads and make good money with that

Paysites and other sites have always carried ads.

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2. tip is not a membership fee - how many % do you think giving tips and how many % watch for free and spend zero?

Did I say membership fees?

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3. the camgirls work for themself. they are using a big plattform and don´t have to care the technique, the payment and the promotion.

Understood. "Studio" girls have the publisher, affiliate, studios taking a cut. Girls working on their own can keep all the money. Some girls work via MFC style sites.

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you are simply not a business man and you can not calculate a big biz.
that´s why you sit at home and tell everybody that pornbiz is dead while we all make
much more money as in the days that you call "the good ones".

I've run businesses which employed people. How many people work for you?

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i tell you what: not even in this "good days" you made the money that was possible to make. and the only "good" in this old days was that even an idiot could make more money as he would do in a regular job.

Why make it personal on what I made? We're talking about an industry.

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so you had this chance and for sure made more as you would make with your skills anywhere else. so just sit back and accept that the time of amateur business man is past.

An amateur who employed people, ran a million pound business.

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there is also no reason to explain you that you are wrong. you are not part of this biz anymore and nobody needs you or get you back into the biz.
so believe what you want - drink your water while the smart ones are drinking champaign.

The rules of business don't change. If you give the product away, sales plummet.

Paul Markham · 02-05-2019, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celandina

Paying for shit is in decline.
Paying for recycled shit is in decline.
Paying for shit even though has a fancy new tech ( 3D and VR) is in the decline.
Paying for good and original content in on the upswing

So point out who in your opinion makes good and original content.

When good original content is given away for free, sales plummet.

Books, Music, Movies, gaming all suffer from piracy. Porn is the only one giving it's product away. That effects sales.

Paul Markham · 02-05-2019, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

I love how you concur when you probably don't understand a word I typed in that post. However seeing as you concur, perhaps you could tell me what a GAN is and how can it be applied to the use case we are discussing?

No idea what GAN is, so let me Google it. https://www.google.com/search?source...edat%20Googlem

Does that help you?

thommy · 02-05-2019, 04:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Paysites and other sites have always carried ads.

when was that? inside a memberea i hve never seen ads in the old days.

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Did I say membership fees?

no matter if paying a one time fee or a membership. 99% of the people watching it don´t pay a penny. and the others pay it because they want and not because the must.

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Understood. "Studio" girls have the publisher, affiliate, studios taking a cut. Girls working on their own can keep all the money. Some girls work via MFC style sites.

no they do not have that and they will never be able to get such numbers as a big site can. so what do you want to tell me here ?

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I've run businesses which employed people. How many people work for you?

not many - as my biz concept is very focused.

actually we are 15 and 13 of them have nothing to do with the daily stuff - they are also doing very focused things. an no matter if i have 10 times more traffic tomorrow i will still do it with 15.

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Why make it personal on what I made? We're talking about an industry.

the point is that you do not understand this industry. income streams have changed in the
past 15 years a lot. business models have changed because people found out how to live from the mass as there is no big market with a few highrollers.

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An amateur who employed people, ran a million pound business.

is a million pound business big for you ?

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The rules of business don't change. If you give the product away, sales plummet.

and THIS is exactly not the case. it was never and it will be never.
a restaurant need chairs but does not sell them.
the chair is just a free give away to sell drinks and food.

hollywood is not making big money with cinemas and pay tv anymore.
they make money with plenty thousands of free TV channels - so hollywood finally is paid from advertisement.

if you think that porn is something else than every other kind of entertainment you are completely wrong. porn is part of the entertainment industry and 90% of the income of this industry comes from advertising and sponsoring.

look at all the news channels. before they where newspapers and have been sold. now you get all that for free and all this newspapers make MORE money with their free online version as with the sold paper version.

and yes there are still a few trying to sell the content instead. show me ONE that is profitable.

you can not swim against a stream you have to find out how to make money with it. but you missed this part and want to tell the ones that adapted the reality that THEY are wrong.

AdultKing · 02-05-2019, 05:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

No idea what GAN is, so let me Google it. https://www.google.com/search?source...edat%20Googlem

Does that help you?

No, I already knew you didn't know, so basically you said you agreed with a post I made that you didn't comprehend.

You're not good at this Paul. You don't understand much of what people discuss here and it shows.

AdultKing · 02-05-2019, 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Books, Music, Movies, gaming all suffer from piracy. Porn is the only one giving it's product away. That effects sales.

Free books available, ad supported.

Free music available, ad supported

Free movies available, ad supported.

Free Porn available, ad supported.

Nothing is free, not even porn on Pornhub, there are ads. A proportion of the viewers of that content buy the products or services advertised which subsidises the availability of the content.

It's the same model as free to air TV and free to air radio, advertising supported content.

I don't want to resort to insults but for fucks sake, read what you write and think about how stupid you look because of what you write.

Paul Markham · 02-05-2019, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

Free books available, ad supported.

Free music available, ad supported

Free movies available, ad supported.

Free Porn available, ad supported.

Nothing is free, not even porn on Pornhub, there are ads. A proportion of the viewers of that content buy the products or services advertised which subsidises the availability of the content.

It's the same model as free to air TV and free to air radio, advertising supported content.

I don't want to resort to insults but for fucks sake, read what you write and think about how stupid you look because of what you write.

I said it "effects sales" don't you understand simple English? Or are you saying giving it away has absolutely no effect on sales. Not that some aren't still sold.

I don't want to resort to insults but for fucks sake, read what you write and think about how stupid you look because of what you write.

pimpmaster9000 · 02-05-2019, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I said it "effects sales" don't you understand simple English? Or are you saying giving it away has absolutely no effect on sales. Not that some aren't still sold.

I don't want to resort to insults but for fucks sake, read what you write and think about how stupid you look because of what you write.

paul, you did not finish high school...you are looking for the word affect and not effect...

basic english for dumb ass paul:

-tubes severely affected low skilled webmasters like paul, and thus paul felt the effects of not finishing high school

Paul Markham · 02-05-2019, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thommy

when was that? inside a memberea i hve never seen ads in the old days.

Well I have and know people who did. So do we only base it on personal experiences?

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no matter if paying a one time fee or a membership. 99% of the people watching it don´t pay a penny. and the others pay it because they want and not because the must.

99% are stats from the 90s. Try 1-1,000s

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no they do not have that and they will never be able to get such numbers as a big site can. so what do you want to tell me here ?

Please learn about marketing. One gilr promoting herself can and does get better trafficand doesn't need the numbers a big studio site has and she isn't competing with lots of other girls. More chance of catching a Whale.

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not many - as my biz concept is very focused.

actually we are 15 and 13 of them have nothing to do with the daily stuff - they are also doing very focused things. an no matter if i have 10 times more traffic tomorrow i will still do it with 15.

So show us a picture of your giant offices. Or I will just reply with I had 200 people working for me.

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the point is that you do not understand this industry. income streams have changed in the
past 15 years a lot. business models have changed because people found out how to live from the mass as there is no big market with a few highrollers.

What don't I understand? Programming, Designing, webmastering. I understand how to sell, market, shoot porn, sell porn.

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is a million pound business big for you ?

In the 80s it was. But don't tell me you run a billion pound industry. Unless you can back it up.

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and THIS is exactly not the case. it was never and it will be never.
a restaurant need chairs but does not sell them.
the chair is just a free give away to sell drinks and food.

hollywood is not making big money with cinemas and pay tv anymore.
they make money with plenty thousands of free TV channels - so hollywood finally is paid from advertisement.

Now you're talking cobblers. The big payers for movies on TV are paid services.

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if you think that porn is something else than every other kind of entertainment you are completely wrong. porn is part of the entertainment industry and 90% of the income of this industry comes from advertising and sponsoring.

Today the industry is very much about advertising, not sure what money is raised from sponsoring, but don't tell us it's more than used to be raised by selling memberships. Because even the Stats prove you wrong. Ads sell traffic to traffic brokers for a few dollars on a 1,000
Back when memberships were the #1 sales. It was $30 to $50 for 300 clicks. More traffic doesn't come into it. People watching free porn are interested in porn. $1 a day isn't a fortune, even better value when a member can pay $30 and download the whole site.

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look at all the news channels. before they where newspapers and have been sold. now you get all that for free and all this newspapers make MORE money with their free online version as with the sold paper version.

That's a lie. Newspaper taking are plummeting. https://www.google.com/search?source...03.GG4ko9qD5ao

As usual it's you who are clueless.

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you can not swim against a stream you have to find out how to make money with it. but you missed this part and want to tell the ones that adapted the reality that THEY are wrong.

Agreed and I've never said any different. The reality is I know how markets have changed. Doesn't mean we didn't make more money before free porn devastated the industry. It's only the blind who say online porn revenues are up. It's you that can't see reality, Newspapers make more money online than they did offline.

thommy · 02-05-2019, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I said it "effects sales" don't you understand simple English? Or are you saying giving it away has absolutely no effect on sales. Not that some aren't still sold.

I don't want to resort to insults but for fucks sake, read what you write and think about how stupid you look because of what you write.

paul, what you don't understand is that for centuries things have been given away to sell other things.

the first pubs were probably the ones that sold the drinks across the street.

then someone came to put chairs there, lay down the daily newspaper, heat the booth, put up a tv. make music and much more.

so the one who went to the pub has:

1. no newspaper subscription of his own used
2. he didn't have to heat and didn't buy wood or coal for it
3. he didn't need a tv or a radio

according to your conviction, all the guests should be millionaires because they have saved a lot of money and all newspaper publishers, coal sellers as well as radio and television shops should be broke.

giving something for free means that there are things that normally cost money that would have to be bought by those who don't give it for free.
If people are willing to pay the mere presence of a lot of people to give them an advertising message, then in the end they will get out of the money that would not buy the product if it is not free.

why is it so hard to understand? the biggest companies in the world have been built with this concept.

you can surely still remember when searching the net was still indirectly liable to pay costs because there were no search engines but only directories that demanded money for the listing.

the first search engines ruined the business for all of them and changed it for a million times bigger business.

for me (and certainly for everyone else here) you sound like one of those pages that could live a little bit in the 90s from sold listings. imagine those people would come here now and telling us that google destroyed the biz.

Paul Markham · 02-05-2019, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

No, I already knew you didn't know, so basically you said you agreed with a post I made that you didn't comprehend.

You're not good at this Paul. You don't understand much of what people discuss here and it shows.

I don't know what GAN means, maybe I know what it does, maybe it's a programming thing, etc. I concurred with the point of your post.

If you're going to wind me up. Try a bit harder.

AdultKing · 02-05-2019, 07:56 AM

Oh fuck it, Paul is just another clueless GFY peasant, living in his little peasant village, with his narrow minded peasant views.

Not wasting my time with an irrelevant peasant who can't comprehend basic English, let alone the technical concepts explored in this thread.

thommy · 02-05-2019, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Well I have and know people who did. So do we only base it on personal experiences?

99% are stats from the 90s. Try 1-1,000s

whatever but possibly enough to make multimillion revenue

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Please learn about marketing. One gilr promoting herself can and does get better trafficand doesn't need the numbers a big studio site has and she isn't competing with lots of other girls. More chance of catching a Whale.

i told you already a few time that you do not have to teach me marketing. it is my profession what i´ve studied and make much more money with it as you can imagine.

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So show us a picture of your giant offices. Or I will just reply with I had 200 people working for me.

200 people and still be a poor old fart proves that you are not a business man.

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What don't I understand? Programming, Designing, webmastering. I understand how to sell, market, shoot porn, sell porn.

nope - NOTHING from that - really NOTHING

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In the 80s it was. But don't tell me you run a billion pound industry. Unless you can back it up.

i don´t need a billion pound. i am ok with 6-digit every month for me and my life.

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Now you're talking cobblers. The big payers for movies on TV are paid services.

loooooool

as i actually just have newer numbers from germany, austria and switzerland I can share them with you.

revenue from paid content in 2018 was 3,8 billion euro (that includes pay-TV and video on demand)

revenue advertising free tv 15,33 billion
revenue advertising radio 1,95 billion
revenue online advertising 3,66 billion

makes a total of 20,94 billion in the free media versus 3,8 billion in the paid sector.

remember this is 20.94 billion only in germany, austria and switzerland with a population
of approximately 90 million people

SKY´s WORLWIDE revenue (with a population of 7,8 billion was in 2018
12,2 billion pound (and funny is that nearly 1 billion of that is advertising revenue)

so what are you knowing ????

NOTHING !!!!

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Today the industry is very much about advertising, not sure what money is raised from sponsoring, but don't tell us it's more than used to be raised by selling memberships. Because even the Stats prove you wrong. Ads sell traffic to traffic brokers for a few dollars on a 1,000
Back when memberships were the #1 sales. It was $30 to $50 for 300 clicks. More traffic doesn't come into it. People watching free porn are interested in porn. $1 a day isn't a fortune, even better value when a member can pay $30 and download the whole site.

and again you compare appels with pears.

first of all educate yourself about pricing in this industry.
traffic today is mostly sold by CPM - what means ad impressions and not ad clicks.

there are still (or again) a few networks that are selling clicks and it is really not possible (and it was never) to tell you how much a click costs and how it converts.

because this depends on so many factors like country, device, ad and many many more.

but god thanks we do have today the instruments for messuring that and if you would want to buy 300 clicks today from germany desktop from me you would not get them for 30 or 50 dollars.
the highbids for germany in our network are are 0,20 € per click and higher.
if we talk about switzerland or austria they will be even MUCH more expensive.

as you do not even know how the advertising market works I will stop to explain here because you will anyway not get it.

Quote:

That's a lie. Newspaper taking are plummeting. https://www.google.com/search?source...03.GG4ko9qD5ao

As usual it's you who are clueless.

i did not find anything else in your google search as what i told you.

here find another example how you can make more with free as with paid

Quote:

Agreed and I've never said any different. The reality is I know how markets have changed. Doesn't mean we didn't make more money before free porn devastated the industry. It's only the blind who say online porn revenues are up. It's you that can't see reality, Newspapers make more money online than they did offline.

what you did never understand and will never understand is that dealing with masses of people (today we have 4,2 BILLION people online in 1997 there have been 70 million)
even when each one of those users 1997 would spend 100 dollars per year in the internet
you will not see more than 7 billion revenue over ALL kind of entertainment.
if each one of the 4,2 billion spends only a tenth you already have a 600% bigger market.

but you are still only focused on porn and I am not.
what we are selling today is much more valueable because more and more advertisers see the complete consumer and a chance to sell this consumer everything (no matter if now or at a later point)

that makes lifetime value from a potential buyer 100 times bigger as it is with just porn.

take only the dating market that was even in the old days the number 2 income for webmasters and exploded later to something what is still now 1000 times bigger than porn ever was.

but we do not only sell dating. we sell so many other things more what have nothing to do with a porn video and we make much more revenue from a video when we give it for free.

the lifetime revenue on a tube site from a single user is NOT lower as the lifetime value from a paying user. just the number of this users is much much bigger.

the AVERAGE value from a visitor to a tube site is between 0,002 and 0,005 $ no matter if you show this user 10 CPM ads on a page and he clicks none of them or every 10th user makes a click on a banner.

now multiply that with just an average tube site that have 1 million visitors per day you are already on 2000-5000 dollars revenue PER DAY !!!
but the really big tubes have 100 million per day.

show me how someone can find 100 million customers per day with a product that costs only 1 cent.

and show me how you can make more money with a product that cost 5 dollars.

what you will never understand is the fact that you can ALWAYS only find a few % that will buy a product. to make a big number out of this few % to need a huge basic number.

without free sites porn business would never exist. not before and not now.
the only difference to now is that we are now selling a much broader variation to MUCH MUCH more potential customers. and we do not fucking care if they buy porn or a cat toilette as long as we GET THEM WITH porn.

celandina · 02-05-2019, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

So point out who in your opinion makes good and original content.

When good original content is given away for free, sales plummet.

Books, Music, Movies, gaming all suffer from piracy. Porn is the only one giving it's product away. That effects sales.

I can list many but here are a few:

Lesbea
iFeelmyself
Boundheat
Paingate
Kink
MetArt

pimpmaster9000 · 02-05-2019, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Please learn about marketing. One gilr promoting herself can and does get better trafficand doesn't need the numbers a big studio site has and she isn't competing with lots of other girls. More chance of catching a Whale.

yes yes the famous dildo up her ass stuffing female webmaster type of girl...she knows about traffic and is a one man marketing agency - dildo stuffer...cretin paul could not generate traffic to save his own life so it is no surprise that old faggot does not know what he is talking about and that 99% of all girls do not care about internet marketing or anything related to generating traffic or even work in general...this is because paul has had limited contact to females in his 50 year career...he would pay her 8 euros and she would flash her pussy and go home in an hour...old cretin does not understand ho's are not the best webmasters...

dumb ass paul googling shit like an idiot...too dumb for google

AdultKing · 02-05-2019, 10:08 AM

Paul's idea of content was this

Completely unsellable in 2019 because nobody wants to see average 'teens' in a fake made up girls room in the house of a refugee from the UK living in Czech.

I hope he burned that house down and nobody currently uses that as a bedroom, fucking creepy.

Paul's marketing and business skills are so great he'll sell you his entire content library for $500, precisely $400 more than it's worth.

Yet considering all this he has the gall to come on here and lecture real business people about how to do their thing. He's basically nothing more than a grubby sex tourist from the UK who ended up in Czech, made a few bucks in the early easy days of Internet porn and has done nothing else since.

Can you believe he was only in his 40's when that photo was taken?

jscott · 02-05-2019, 10:13 AM

Next big thing...

how about Netflixxx but for porn!!!! Incomingggggg

Oh, and bitcoin of course, but thats for the far ahead future i think

thommy · 02-05-2019, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jscott

Next big thing...

how about Netflixxx but for porn!!!! Incomingggggg

Oh, and bitcoin of course, but thats for the far ahead future i think

i think you missmatched that a bit.

netflixes for porn exist since around 2000 und bitcoin is something for the past.

jscott · 02-05-2019, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thommy

i think you missmatched that a bit.
netflixes for porn exist since around 2000 und bitcoin is something for the past.

your opinion means nothing since you cannot even back up your claim
lets make our different opinions more interesting, and wager it

also, there is no platform built as well as netflix, for porn, that is legal... that i know of

Bladewire · 02-05-2019, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crucifissio

yes yes the famous dildo up her ass stuffing female webmaster type of girl...she knows about traffic and is a one man marketing agency - dildo stuffer...cretin paul could not generate traffic to save his own life so it is no surprise that old faggot does not know what he is talking about and that 99% of all girls do not care about internet marketing or anything related to generating traffic or even work in general...this is because paul has had limited contact to females in his 50 year career...he would pay her 8 euros and she would flash her pussy and go home in an hour...old cretin does not understand ho's are not the best webmasters...

dumb ass paul googling shit like an idiot...too dumb for google

You are going to be obsolete soon Crucifissio adapt or die bro!

AdultKing · 02-05-2019, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jscott

also, there is no platform built as well as netflix, for porn, that is legal... that i know of

The pirates beat Mindgeek to it, just as the origins of Mindgeek beat us on the path to a world full of tubes.

Porn Time - The Popcorn Time for porn movies!

Peer to peer services are the only way to effective delivery massive content to a massive audience at low cost and it will have to be low cost to support a Netflix type service for porn. More importantly the technology needs to be content agnostic, it's the only way it will get into app stores.

pimpmaster9000 · 02-05-2019, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bladewire

You are going to be obsolete soon Crucifissio adapt or die bro!

It will never replace real women...AI experts can develop something that works for pennies, but the return will bd pennies as well...lonely guys want to see real women and they give 2 shits about cheap AI...AI girls are a niche at best...

It may make you obsolete tho...

NatalieK · 02-05-2019, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thommy

i think you missmatched that a bit.

netflixes for porn exist since around 2000 und bitcoin is something for the past.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jscott

your opinion means nothing since you cannot even back up your claim
lets make our different opinions more interesting, and wager it

also, there is no platform built as well as netflix, for porn, that is legal... that i know of

https://www.dailydot.com/upstream/porn-on-netflix/

https://www.dailydot.com/upstream/ho...rn-on-netflix/

Paul Markham · 02-06-2019, 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by celandina

I can list many but here are a few:

Lesbea
iFeelmyself
Boundheat
Paingate
Kink

I see nothing on these sites that set them apart from the 100,000s of scenes given away for free on Pornhub.

IFeelMyself - IFM

https://www.lesbea.com/

https://metart.com/ is good. And given away free https://www.pornhub.com/video/search?search=metart

And here's the problem. If it's not Metart similar scenes are available for free. https://www.pornhub.com/video/search?search=marc+dorcel And saying it's exclusive to one site no longer cuts it for most consumers. Because fucking is fucking and that's what we produce. It's like saying one shop bought shirt is exclusive when 1,000s of other similar shirts on sale in the same mall.

AdultKing · 02-06-2019, 02:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I see nothing on these sites that set them apart from the 100,000s of scenes given away for free on Pornhub.

You're not qualified to talk about content quality so shut the fuck up.

AmeliaG · 02-06-2019, 03:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

No, it's not. Cable is quickly dying. At least it is here in the US. Everyone is streaming TV now. We use Hulu and Sling, and combined with Netflix and Amazon Prime.... You can pretty much watch anything you want at any time you want.

It's called "cord cutting".

In my case... I get my Internet for free through our HOA (very dependable, 100 up / 100 down), and I have Hulu and Netflix. I pay $60 a month total.

That's really interesting. How many units are in your HOA? Did they have to do anything special to cut that deal for the homeowners? How do they handle data overages or faster speeds or other individual add-ons?

Paul Markham · 02-06-2019, 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

You're not qualified to talk about content quality so shut the fuck up.

Neither are you as you never produced content. So shut the fuck up.

Consumers only know about the end result. You don't buy a pen to have a pen, you buy a pen to write. Porn is consumed to jerk off. So will one scene do that job better than the next?

On one hand we have a scene that must be paid for. On the other we have a similar scene that's free. Does one scene get the consumer off and the other not? Does one scene do it better than the other? Now consider whole site. Take any genre and look for paysites in that genre. Now compare it with Pornhub's offering of the same genre, one is paid for with no return policy the other free and if Pornhub isn't right you have Youporn, Xhamster, etc. Which one will overwhelmingly win?

This applies to any product, from chewing gum to luxury yachts. It's an absolute fundamental rule of marketing. Unless what a product offers is so great, the free option will win if it's good enough.

Paul Markham · 02-06-2019, 05:10 AM

Quote:

good luck pre-filming all the strange shit customers come up with and getting deep learning to make this in to a believable and realistic motion...all this for like 100$/day from one model...the method you mention is a chain with some very strong and some very weak links...an AI news anchor just sits and talks...

Could be true. But the vast number of consumers can be predicted. The few who want something so individual it has to be done by a real person can still be done. She/He will have to wait a long time for those sales and the people to back it up.

Then there's another consideration. A BMW is 30% cheaper than a Mercedes, will the consumer take the cheaper version and make do or will he go for better version. Even worse it the BMW is free.

We know the quality of video on Pornhub isn't as good as Paysites. Which one wins?

Quote:

sure you can do a lot of things if you throw enough money at it...but to do it cost effectively and for a profit worth going after, this will take decades for the tech and interests to be there...

Today those costs would make it unprofitable. We're talking about tomorrow.

Paul Markham · 02-06-2019, 05:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

Oh fuck it, Paul is just another clueless GFY peasant, living in his little peasant village, with his narrow minded peasant views.

Not wasting my time with an irrelevant peasant who can't comprehend basic English, let alone the technical concepts explored in this thread.

You're wasting your time replying to me a lot these days.

Paul Markham · 02-06-2019, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lmfao irl

Idk, maybe for people who are into animi and hentai and stuff? My team and I work one on one with clients every day and I'll be damnned if any of them want anything less than a real experience with a real human.

Ask them if they would pay for a Mercedes when BMW is giving away cars for free. Or even Free Skodas. Ask them if they will pay 100% for a Mercedes and 30% for a BMW.

Pornhub could never sell memberships in the same ratios Paysites did. Because the quality isn't good enough, but the free option wins hands down. This doesn't apply to only porn, it applies to all products.

Only a few avenues give away the product for free because it's effect on sales. TV Channels were free, now Netflix, HBO, etc are on the rise and more are coming in. Because their product isn't given away. The best example is Sports, how many big sporting events are free vs those on PPV?

CurrentlySober · 02-06-2019, 05:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

We're talking about tomorrow.

02-04-2019, 04:00 PM	#69
astronaut x Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: May 2011 Location: From this www and beyond! Posts: 4,844	I tell the old people in my life to stop paying for cable TV all the time. Sadly some of the old people on GFY don't seem to get it. Resident GFY old person....I found your.... __________________ Hello

02-04-2019, 09:11 AM	#58
lmfao irl Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 602	and lol @ adapter

02-04-2019, 09:12 AM	#59
lmfao irl Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 602	Idk, maybe for people who are into animi and hentai and stuff? My team and I work one on one with clients every day and I'll be damnned if any of them want anything less than a real experience with a real human.

02-04-2019, 09:18 AM	#62
lmfao irl Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2018 Posts: 602	Paul Markham are you WITH or AGAINST the PBBC?? (asking for a friend)

02-05-2019, 07:56 AM	#81
AdultKing Raise Your Weapon Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Outback Australia Posts: 15,601	Oh fuck it, Paul is just another clueless GFY peasant, living in his little peasant village, with his narrow minded peasant views. Not wasting my time with an irrelevant peasant who can't comprehend basic English, let alone the technical concepts explored in this thread.

02-05-2019, 10:08 AM	#85
AdultKing Raise Your Weapon Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Outback Australia Posts: 15,601	Paul's idea of content was this Completely unsellable in 2019 because nobody wants to see average 'teens' in a fake made up girls room in the house of a refugee from the UK living in Czech. I hope he burned that house down and nobody currently uses that as a bedroom, fucking creepy. Paul's marketing and business skills are so great he'll sell you his entire content library for $500, precisely $400 more than it's worth. Yet considering all this he has the gall to come on here and lecture real business people about how to do their thing. He's basically nothing more than a grubby sex tourist from the UK who ended up in Czech, made a few bucks in the early easy days of Internet porn and has done nothing else since. Can you believe he was only in his 40's when that photo was taken?

02-05-2019, 10:13 AM	#86
jscott So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Taipei Posts: 25,198	Next big thing... how about Netflixxx but for porn!!!! Incomingggggg Oh, and bitcoin of course, but thats for the far ahead future i think