crazytrini85

That Jain is no relation to the Jain that is now running Incredible Dollars, is it?

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AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

What I was referring to is how you appear to dissemble whenever you are faced with a straightforward question.

Someone else (not me) inferred that you/Virage owned Envisionext at one time, and you indignantly responded that you did not. I did not dispute this, as I have no proof either way. What I noted (and documented) is that you had more than a friendship relationship with the CEO of Envisonext - nothing illegal about that, I just thought that it was odd that you didn't mention this corporate connection in the interest of full disclosure.

To re-phrase it, what I called into question is that your answer seemed to imply no relationship between you and Envisionext besides a long-term fraternal association with the Envisonext CEO Stan, when in fact, he was apparently a COO (Chief Operating Officer) of Virage, which you neglected to mention.

I'm not sure what names you think I called you, since I rarely do that without absolute proof (23,000+ posts with no bans here - I do try to keep my ducks in a row).

I'm just simply trying to understand who is behind your apparently new company on the scene, Manwin.

I thought it was a partnership. After all, you describe yourself as a "Managing Partner".

The Business Dictionary defines a "Managing Partner" thusly:

A Partnership is defined as:

So are you a Managing Partner (as defined) or not?

If you are, who are your partners?

The reason I, and possibly others, are skeptical about Manwin is that you have suddenly appeared on the scene posing as a new company and self-proclaimed savior of the adult industry, but you do not wish to discuss your past businesses and practices (i.e., Virage), and you expect people to take a leap of faith that a company as flawed as Mansef (see government forfeiture and lawsuit articles previously addressed, but which you did not respond to), has suddenly turned over a new leaf by changing three letters in their company name, and your appearance as the new Managing Partner, or Messiah, or whatever you see yourself as.

I've violated no GFY rule which I am aware of. This is a forum for expressing opinions, exchanging ideas, or as this forum is listed - "Fucking Around and Program Discussion".

I'm pretty sure that I am well within those parameters.

I am merely sharing some thoughts, and trying to get some answers, since you are asking people/companies to trust you, yet from what I can see, you have proved less than trustworthy so far.

Since you are now seemingly claiming to be (by definition) a Corporation with shareholders, instead of a Partnership (even though your title is Managing Partner), who then is on your Corporate Board of Directors?

I want to trust you, but imho you keep being evasive instead of forthright. That raises warning flags to me.



ADG

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LickMyBalls

I have had not heard that.

crazytrini85

From: TakeDownPiracy.com


"I decided to go look at some of the oldest comments on this profile and there is one from a user named "Dice". That caught my eye because in all the "Sponsored Videos from JulesJordan.com" clips on PornHub, the affilliate code includes the phrase "diceman". According to Pornhub's Alexa page, [email protected] is the contact email for the site.

Also the way their user profile system works is that as you sign up you are given a number in the order that you signed up. Dice is user #30, Pornhub Parties is 490,000 something. So just outta curiousity, I decided to see who was #1, #2, etc.

#1 is a user named "dwarakanath" So I decided to go look at some of the 1200+ videos that this guy has uploaded. I decided to check out his earliest uploads. All of them have affiliate code links on them...for....wait for it.....Brazzers. Even though the clips are not even Brazzers movies! Apparently dwarakanath helps run the site as well, as he left this comment on another profile:

The reason why we had to delete the account was due to copyright infringement. In that case, we have to take immediate action to remove the content that infringes the owner's rights.

User #4 is someone named "trogdor" who just happens to be from the beautiful city of Montreal, Quebec, Canada amazingly enough. He hasn't uploaded as many videos, in fact he's just uploaded the 1...and of course...it has a Brazzers affiliate code. Apparently trogdor helps run the site as comments left for him refer to him asking users how to make Pornhub better, etc. Oh and the first "Friend" added by Trogdor..."Dice", figures. Oh and I found a comment from trogdor on another user's account. Our good buddy "Bosco"...in fact...it's the very first comment, what are the chances? trogdor also makes a comment about deleting videos if they have any doubt as to the age of the girls...but I thought that these sites claimed that they can't monitor the all the "user uploaded" content?

User #7 has just uploaded one video, but oddly enough it is the exact same video as one of the videos uploaded by Bosco, but I'm sure that's just a coincidence."

Interesting read.

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crazytrini85

Yes, there is a "Jain" who is running that sorry program now.

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LickMyBalls

http://www.ftc.gov/os/caselist/07231...ejudgement.pdf

http://www.loseraffiliate.com/affili.../Sam-Jain.html

Nathan

ADG,

I use "Managing Partner" because of the fact that I am a shareholder (ie Partner) and I manage parts of the business actively. This compared to a CEO who I am not, or any other job title...

This title thus implies, or is supposed to at least, that I am a shareholder but I am involved in day to day operations too without being an actual CEO for example since I have someone in for example Canada who is much better at that than me...

The term possibly is a bad choice from me as I am German originally and possibly have it Lost in Translation...

I think I am being more than fair in reply to accusations, some of which are just ridiculous. I have learned a long time ago that a lot of things are useless to discuss on a message board, especially as soon as strange accusations start appearing which are useless to discuss since the people they are coming from are never going to believe anything anyway, AND even more importantly, I have no obligation to satisfy anyone's lust for information...

I have explained what I wanted to explain, said what I wanted to say, now as some have already said, you will have to judge for yourself if I deliver on what I have said or not...

__________________
"Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
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Zyber

Who are the partners? Who is the CEO of Manwin?

LickMyBalls

and that right there seals it. Fuck you.

erooup

You sure have a way of ignoring or dodging the questions about the staff uploading stolen content to the tubes. Since you are "involved in day to day operations" as you put it yourself, this can hardly be news to you.

Nathan

crazytrini85,

Incredible dollars has nothing to do with us... so if you and lickmyballs could please take the unrelated crap out of this thread, thank you...

regarding your other comments.. its a great story you posted, but, again, its unrelated to us, we bought the assets 1st of march, this post you linked to is from january.

__________________
"Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie Munger

Nathan

I did not see any question, sorry.. I only saw accusations... if you are asking... no, the staff is not uploading stolen content, only content we have licensed is uploaded by us.

__________________
"Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie Munger

Nathan

Again, as I said above, I am the main shareholder except for a few other small stakeholders of 1 or 2%, basically managers of the group on an incentive plan.

The CEO of Manwin CANADA, our office and service company in Montreal, is Feraz, a few people here will know him. If you do not, come to Miami, I'll introduce you.

__________________
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Frasier

March 1st, huh! Wow that was fast moving after the Feb 24th filing.

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ICQ 452 one six 7 five 41

Luscious Media

>Mansef>Manwin>Montreal>Mansef>Manwin>Montreal>

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Nathan

Yes, that almost killed the deal actually... no need to believe me obviously... let's just wait and see how all this pans out, and everyone who did not believe me can then apologize.. if they want to obviously.. no pressure..

__________________
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DWB

I just went to xtube.com, within 1 click I found several scenes of mine that are there illegally. Nothing shocking as I'm always sending DMCAs to your tubes.

Here is the problem Nathan, you know people are uploading 100% illegal content. Maybe your staff does it, maybe they don't, that is not for me to decide. The only thing that matters to me is, you allow it knowing they do not own the copyright to such content. This is what puts you (and the others) into dirt bag / scum / thief / not to be trusted category. This is why you are meeting resistance.

By allowing uploads of full scenes from anyone, you know from balls to bones you are violating copyright law and profiting from stolen content.

Then you come in here and wiggle your way around tough questions and act as if everything has changed, when in fact, I'm still looking at multiple scenes of mine on your site, uploaded by someone who should have never been allowed to upload content there in the first place. Nothing has changed. I'll send a DMCA and the scenes will go away for a week, maybe even two, and then like magic they will reappear.

You want to make changes and work with everyone, limit the video length to just a few minutes. Any video attempted to be uploaded longer than that is truncated. Make a variational process for site owners who wish to load samples videos to your tubes. A real domain email would be a good start instead of a free one. Create valid accounts instead of bullshit ones.

Instead, you allow full length videos to be uploaded by strangers. Not only are you NOT 2257 complaint and may house child porn in this manner, but for 100% sure you are allowing stolen content to be loaded as well.

You talk the talk but do not walk the walk. I can only assume you will be met with mostly resistance from everyone other than bro blowers and other dirt bags.

LickMyBalls

Let us not forget the stolen tube site they were running in their members area.

munki

If I saw a plan put into action by new/old/future ownership, that led to an effective identification, approval, or deletion of content, based upon known copyright/unlicensed status by the company, not only would I probably drop dead of shock on sight, but would probably actually stop my bitching about piracy. A no bullshit, no loopholes approach.

We know you license content, and have found an effective delivery method.

We also know a lot of content is available only because of assumed DMCA protection until a notice is received.

Put a system into place that actively monitors copyright status... If you have received a valid DMCA on a piece of content, do not allow it back through the system again. Content identification is not rocket science these days. Proactively monitor "user submitters" for patterns in unlicensed content. Be proactive spider content networks, and establish relationships to prevent further abuses.

If a valid, and immediate effort were made, it'd be a lot quieter around here. Sometimes it's just about what's right, not what we can get away, which this industry is too quick to accept.

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crazytrini85

User submitted I'm sure.

But I doubt the new owner will offer this tube of stolen content within his members area. He sounds like a stand up, top notch bro. I may buy him some drinks at the show.

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Zyber

I'm curious, how is Nathan / Manwin and their tubes connected to NATS / TMM ?

How close ties does NATS have with these people?

ladida

Yea, no. My information is quite correct. You, Stan and Richard own quite a bit of things (including envisionext), you just operate different parts of the company.

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agentGFY *at* gmail.com

Agent 488

spill it.

Nathan

Very sorry, but you are misinformed...

__________________
"Think about it a little more and you'll agree with me, because you're smart and I'm right."
- Charlie Munger

LickMyBalls

coming to an Internext near you....

pradaboy

This thread is so much fun.

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will76

are you kidding, when he throws out "buying companies worth 5 million +" the people looking to sell are tripping over each other to get to him. The people with programs who are not looking to sell are tripping over each other to get to him to try to get traffic from his sites. The content producers are tripping over each other to try to sell to him.

Tube sites really don't need to steal any more. They stole to get market share, now they have program out there begging them to put their content up on their sites as long as they link back to them. It turned out just like the TGP sites, who ever was mentioning that 2-3 years ago was right. Sites steal, everyone hates them, sites get tons of traffic and control market, everyone blows them. The site has no more reason to steal when people are tripping over themselves to give them their content.

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ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

LickMyBalls

We have another winner! The folks that know their shit are gonna laugh until high noon quite soon.

timoxxl2

do you want to aquire http://www.cupidocam.com and some connected websites? ... mainly escort related websites?

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will76

You wouldn't happen to be selling content to them by any chance and wanting to sell more ?

If you don't keep one eye in the past (and one in the future), then you will repeat the same mistakes in the future if you don't remember and learn what happened previously.

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ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

TMM_John

Nathan (Fabian) has not been associated with TMM for almost 4 years now.

Mansef (apparently now known as Manwin) has been a client of TMM using NATS for a long time.

TMM has no association beyond that with either party, their tube sites, etc.

__________________

Skype: JohnA1078
Too Much Media - Makers of the Industry's Leading Payite Management Platform, NATS!

will76

Wow, so everyone being upset at Brazzers for their involvement with stolen content all over their tube sites over the last couple years and the way it has affected EVERYONE, is just " a bunch of disgruntled webmasters looking for someone to blame for their own inadequacies".

You have fought "dogs" before, but how many of those dogs were companies that you had nothing to gain from? Like Acacia. You had zero to gain from them. Tube sites are "dogs" when they are stealing your content but they are "bros" when they link back to you and you make some sales. Everyone knows the tube sites control a lot of traffic now and sales are harder and harder to come by. Are you really going to take a stand against a company that you can actually profit from? Question asked and answered.

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ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

Zyber

Thanks for clearing it up

Semi-Retired-Dave

Co-Founder of Nats and now a buyer of Brazzers.
Two very different business models, one that helped the industry, then one to hurt the industry

Think about all the money Nats missed out on if tubes didn't exists.

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colin farrell

when you fuck with people's livelihoods, you have to be prepared to take some shots to the nuts. imho nathan looks just as guilty as alec does in his .xxx threads.

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just passing by

Semi-Retired-Dave

Can't they get in trouble for buying stolen property?
So I can go on a burglar spree, put it all in a warehouse, then sell my warehouse with all the assets I now claim I own.
Sounds like possession of stolen property if you ask me.

But as Fucked up as all this is, The only credit I give Nathan is that he had the Balls to come here and start this thread.
First, spending all that money on the transaction, then taking all the shit from us.

But at the end of the day if things stay the way they are, he will recoup from his investment in about 2 years.

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crazytrini85

Interesting. To think Nathan will now be part of the problem that will in turn cause TMM to lose more money.

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Robbie

That's probably what he's paid to do. It's a thankless task trying to defend pornhub for sure. Heck, I'm not even sure why they care. The only people they need to be worrying about are the govt., the authorities, and pinkvisual suing them.

I'm not even sure why they sent their boy in here to do damage control. It isn't like any of us affiliates can send them sales anymore anyway.

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-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.Com

crazytrini85

Could probably close the thread after Robbies post. I agree, he is wasting his time here. They are getting sued and in the middle of a money laundering charge by the US Government, and they will be sued again I'm sure. No reason to feed us broke ass trolls who wish you the very worst luck a person can have.

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Robbie

Heh-heh, while I was in this thread running my dick skinners...pornhub got a sale on claudia-marie.com last night! So I must recant my "traffic is worthless" statement.

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-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.Com

Varius

This thread is both hilarious and sad from both sides of the coin (that includes you, GFY Sleuths lol). It's providing excellent entertainment for some of us though.

__________________
Skype variuscr - Email varius AT gmail

fris

no reply to my question ?

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Since 1999: 69 Adult Industry awards for Best Hosting Company and professional excellence.


WP Stuff

Robbie

Keith, I'm sure it's amusing for folks with no "skin in the game" But for a lot of people who had their content used to make pornhub what it is now...I'm sure they aren't laughing.

I don't suspect that the Mansef guys are ever gonna really sell their company. Hell, just naming it "Manwin" had to give them a pretty good laugh.

And there's nothing wrong with that. It's their company, and I'm sure they are making moves based on legal and accounting advice. It really doesn't matter to me one way or another.

I just found it kinda funny to watch this Nathan person suddenly come into this as a multi-millionaire with plenty of money to buy into a big company...but unable to straight talk to some of the folks here who had their very livelihoods smashed with pornhub, while the Mansef/Manwin crew got richer off of the stolen content.

If you were in the paysite actual porn side of the biz you might not be quite as amused.

I'm of the thought that it would be real nice if they stopped allowing stolen content. That would be great. It would also be great if they stopped putting up full scenes.

But we both know that the minute they did that...their traffic would dry up immediately. So it's hard to discern what this Nathan guy is saying or doing. I'm not sure why he even came on GFY if he has nothing to really say.

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-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.Com

Varius

My comments actually had nothing to do with tubes at all, just the misinformation circling in this thread by people who think they have all the behind the scenes information regarding ownership etc...

As far as tubes go, though, you're right they don't affect me at all as the only adult project I'm involved with relies on social interaction and not content. I agree content theft is wrong and should be illegal, that they are exploiting a loophole right now in the legal system...

Then again, as you have said millions of times, you took steps to protect your content and haven't suffered like others have. Other smart owners worked on providing members with more than just photos and videos; interactivity and an addictive member experience, and haven't suffered. Finally, there are many others, who instead of protecting their content better, or enhancing their offering, preferred to spend 99% of their day whining on a forum - I'm not sure how bad I'm supposed to feel for them.

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alexxx

Not only their traffic would dry up but the competition might get a chance to survive, wich is not an option when you aim at world domination... Even if they get 100% legit and kind to content producers, someone else will take advantage of the situation and bank on tube traffic... going back is not an option... it's just impossible... they will just continue until this whole thing explodes... cash out button / run...

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35zero 384 zero93

Robbie

I know. But the majority of those guys either don't know HOW to do anything about it, or are too set in their ways and thought they would somehow make their existing members angry.

They are scared basically. And you can't blame them. They are busting ass, taking all the risks and all the costs...and then watching it go down the drain. Meanwhile the review sites tell them that if they tried to protect their content then they will get bad reviews and lose even further potential sales.

So yeah, I do feel bad for them. They didn't do anything wrong, and yet because others worked unscrupulously they are supposed to somehow change gears and now it's their fault for not being smart enough to "adapt"

Hell man, I should NEVER have had to put in all the time and effort I have to keeping my shit from being everywhere. I'm a busy guy and my work time would be better spent dreaming up new creative ideas and working on the actual website instead of testing my shit against every download software known to man.

So in a way, it has taken money from me. Time is money. I wonder how many scenes I didn't shoot, or how many really cool set ups for a vid I didn't think of because my mind was on fighting piracy?

So yeah, I do feel for guys who came at this and gave it their all and just don't have the ability to stop their stuff from getting stolen. I don't know what's gonna become of all of them, pretty sure they are hurting real bad.

I do agree about the GFY "detectives". But there is one guy in this thread who icq'ed me some info that was downright amazing. He IS in the know. Far more than you or I for sure.

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-Robbie
ClaudiaMarie.Com

Far-L

Dig a little deeper. I can't comment on our situation with CE other than to say that we were at one time involved in an arbitration with them. Sorry, but you are free to play detective and solve that mystery for everyone, because I can't help there. I can say that we definitely are willing to take a stand against a company we did, would, and could profit from. So take your inane and unfounded conclusions elsewhere.

We have gone after numerous mark infringements over the years. Always, we try to amicably and professionally try to find a resolution that protects our marks and creates a mutually profitable resolution first. We found the previous owners willing to work with us and the new ownership apparently also values a relationship with us.

That doesn't make us liars. That doesn't make us enemies of the industry. If our decision is unpopular then so be it. I know that others that took our same approach have had positive results as well. Even now, in spite of all the accusations and insults, I am trying to help those here that are raising cain and grousing when they could be effecting a positive change. I don't expect anyone to listen since complaining is more fun and a hell of a lot easier to do. Which is fine by me, one of my favorite guilty pleasures is hearing my competition saying they are leaving the business, going bankrupt, selling their assets, or whatever.

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Varius

I think you are talking about a small minority of honest people. Many more, have and would screw their peers or customers if it makes them a buck.

This applies to any industry though, not just adult.

The situation is similar to small town shops when a Wal-Mart rolled into town. Many were forced to close shop as they couldn't compete with the pricing of the retail giant. Which ones survived? The ones who offered a higher quality product and better service. I know I would rather buy a hand-crafted, high quality product from someone with knowledge and passion for the item (that costs 5x more) than a "made in taiwan" piece of shit that's dirt cheap and sold by clueless robotic minions

Information is out there; help is out there. If one of your honest, hard-working people who did nothing wrong really wanted to find ways to survive; they could. Most I see, though, don't see that they should have to as they did nothing wrong (as you said) - which while correct, is the wrong attitude to take. It says "woe is me; I give up".

With regards to the review site comment, that's a cheap excuse. Do you think that if a majority of the sites they review changed the same aspect of their site and communicate with them the reasons why, they won't modify their review structure? They want to make money too, they don't want to have their site full of bad reviews...

Many people in adult were "in the right place at the right time" and have made a lot of money because of that. They believe this entitles them to always hold that position; it doesn't. What if next time, it isn't a "tube" but a new government regulation? Should we feel bad for those who simply whine and whine and do nothing but feel sorry for themselves ?

__________________
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Paul Markham

Will you be releasing the IP address of serial uploaders of copyright material they don't own?

Or will you protect their privacy?

As for the wolf turning into the sheep dog, this business was and still is littered with people who started out pirating content. Now some of them are in the Bro club.

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frank7799

Indeed.