kane

The dems have the votes. They have said so and you can see it in the looks on the republicans faces. They lost and are now going through the last throws of their resistance. So, want it or not we will now have this health care bill. The amendments still have to pass the senate, but Reid has already said they have the 51 votes needed to make that happen.

So what do you think will happen?

Will the republicans now take back the house and senate in the fall and work hard to repeal most of it?

Will this fire up the democratic base and help them hold onto the house and senate?

Will they fight over it at every chance they get while continuing to make changes to it which will cause it to never really see the full light of day?

Will the republicans win back the house and then oust Obama in 2012 so they can just shut it all down?

Or

Will it eventually be allowed to take full effect and then we will just have to wait to see how bloated and corrupt it gets.

No matter how you see it, today was a historic day for this country. The question will be whether it will be historically good or bad.

As far as political fallout goes here is how I see it playing out.

This bill will invigorate the far left. The polls have showed that the moderates are split down the middle on it. It will also fire up the right and the next several months will be very ugly as they go back and forth at each other.

In the November election the republicans will gain seats in the hose and senate, but not enough to retake either (although I think they will be very close). Obama will raise close to 1 billion in campaign funds and win re-election in 2012. However, he will lose the house and maybe the senate in 2012. This will lead to s face-off between the republicans who will do anything they can to shut this down and the white house who will do anything they can to keep it alive

In the end it will end up causing a major cluster fuck in Washington DC for the next 4-6 years and will do nothing to bring this country together.

fatfoo

I will be interested to find out what will be the end result after all changes to American health care system.

__________________
Send me an email: [email protected]

mayabong

I"m sure you are fatfoo, even though you're a Filipino Bot

__________________
Bitcoin Gambling Sites

Jensen

just start taking care of people no matter what. Just read an article about detroit and can't really believe the poverty and neglect.

SpongeBub

I'm just hopeful that, as someone who buys my own insurance, it will help lower my rates. If they really do create those exchanges where lots of plans are available with competitioin, it might happen. The way it is now, in Florida, you really only have BCBS and maybe Cigna - all other competition has been run out of the market. Not letting us buy from any state in the US is the worst thing and the bill does nothing about that crap (of course).

IllTestYourGirls

40 states will pass laws saying that ObamaCare does not apply to their state and dems lose 2010 elections big time. Obama could very well be a one term president. Once you look at the break down of the 2012 electoral college you can see how Obama is in HUGE trouble in 2012.

__________________

kane

I agree. Where I live there are several companies that sell insurance so you can still get decent rates because of the competition (and the fact that I live in an area with reasonably low crime etc), but there are tons of places where there are only 1 or 2 companies even allowed to operate. If there are pools where multiple companies can compete for the business it should help lower the rates. But I'm not holding my breath.

also I like that they can't turn you down for having pre-existing conditions, but I have heard nothing about the price differences for those people. If they have to accept you it is one thing, it is another all together if they can charge those with pre-existing conditions 10 times more than anyone else.

The Demon

In short? Nothing Kane. Not for a long while that is. The Republicans will go through all the motions to the point where everybody is tired of dealing with it. Then they'll take a hiatus and start again. Having the bill passed today is basically like 10% of the entire process.

Sure looks that way.

Considering the majority of Americans don't want this bill, no.

Absolutely.

I think it's looking that way, although I don't want one party controlling everything, Republicans or Democrats.

If this happens which I strongly doubt, it will be a LONG time before it comes into fruition.

Historically bad for economic reasons. Even when they pass it today, there's no guarantee of it going anywhere really, it's just a small step for Democrats. I'm interested to see if they'll honor the ban on federally funded abortions.

I see it playing differently. The Dems lose the senate or the house, if not both, and magically, there will be some form of cooperation between the Republicans and Obama. If the elections were held today, I don't know if Obama would win. Then again, I don't know who would run against him.

Oh it's definitely the end game for us, especially with the economic teetering on the edges of oblivion.

__________________
Greed is Good

The Demon

Yea I completely forgot about the states doing that. This is definitely a cluster fuck.

__________________
Greed is Good

IllTestYourGirls

I feel the same way. Not holding my breath. Why? Because in Mass rates are going through the roof. Without the ablity to buy over state lines prices are only going to rise.

Why has no one said anything about the cost of a pre-existing condition? Can the insurance company say "Oh you have cancer? That's ok its only $250,000 a month" Technically they did not turn anyone down.

__________________

kane

I think you number of 40 states is way too high. Sure, some like Maine, Massachusetts and Tennessee that already have a version of universal health care may, but when you look at all of the states many of them are blue states. The bill is popular among democrats so I don't think states that are democrat controlled that have no health care will be voting to shut this out.

Obama could be in trouble, but it is very hard to be an incumbent president. If this health care bill doesn't explode in his face in the next couple of years, the economy starts to turn around and the situations in Iraq and Afghanistan are looking good, he will win re-election. If those things don't happen, he will be vulnerable. The problem with the republicans is that they don't have a clear message yet (but that will change) and they don't have that one candidate that you can point to and say, "This person is a real contender and a threat to Obama."

IllTestYourGirls

Virgina and Idaho (with almost unanimous democrat vote FOR) just signed into law saying it does not apply to them.

__________________

The Demon

Except there's nowhere for our economy to go but down until we implode and start from scratch.

__________________
Greed is Good

IllTestYourGirls

This is where you are VERY wrong. Democrats at the STATE level do NOT like this. My state is controlled by dems and they just passed a bill with almost unanimous support by the dems to tell ObamaCare to go fuck themselves.

__________________

kane

I agree. I think the country seems to run best when the power is shared. Even if the republicans win both the house and senate, they won't have enough of a majority to stop filibusters or overturn vetoes. This will force them to work with each other on things and find a common ground. Hopefully, if that happens, they will decide to play nice and work together. They could, however, choose to just attack each other in hopes of weakening one another for the next election. That would be a real shame if it happened.

The Demon

I am optimistic only if the republicans can win both the senate and the house but not to the point where they can stop filibusters. Then again, it's possible the Democrats will start filibustering everything.

__________________
Greed is Good

J. Falcon

__________________
Adult Copywriters



SEO Content for Porn Sites
sales at adultcopywriters dot com

kane

I said before I really believe it. When it comes to elections what is really happening has nothing to do with what you can make people believe is happening. If we are adding jobs to the economy and the stock market is still up, it won't matter how much debt there it or how much deficit spending there is going on. A skilled politician can convince a lot of people that things are looking up if there are basic indicators he can point to.

GAMEFINEST

if this passes ,it will be great..i hope

__________________
Compound interest.

The Demon

The stock market rising is no real indication of economic health, only it crashing is. Furthermore, inflation adjusted, people have been getting negative returns for 10 years now. We won't be adding any real jobs anytime soon because we don't have a strong manufacturing sector. Furthermore, it WILL matter how much debt we have because if the Chinese, or the other emerging nations decide to start selling us back or Treasury Securities, we're fucked.

__________________
Greed is Good

kane

This guy would disagree with you. http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2010/...alth-care.html

He has taken info from a bunch of polls and found that 89% of the liberals and 55% of moderates support the bill. Sure, there is no republican support and half the moderates don't support it, but many MANY democrats do.

There will be some states that vote for it not to take effect. There will be others that will try and fail and there will be a lot who will wait and see. If a state has a lot of uninsured people in it voting to keep those people from getting health insurance is a sure fired way to help yourself not get elected again. So they will wait and see how it all plays out .

Some will vote to stop it in their state, I just think 40 states is a little high.

kane

If you republicans win both the house and senate back but don't have a filibuster proof majority, you can count on democrats filibustering everything, just like the republicans have been doing for the last 3 years and just like the democrats did for the 6 years before that. It seems like these days the country is so divided that the loser of the election adopts the stance of NO. No matter what the other party wants, they are against it and they ride that out until the party in power makes enough mistakes that they implode on themselves.

IllTestYourGirls

Your misunderstanding the bills. The bills are not saying they can't get insurance. The bills are saying they are not mandated to do so and there will be no legal repercussions if one chooses not to buy insurance.

I agree 40 is high. But at this point nothing will surprise me.

__________________

kane

Again, Job Bob the mechanic and his wife Sally, who are nice average everyday Americans don't give two shits about who owns our debt, what is happening with treasury securities, the deficit or the national debt. Obama took shit for it, but he got it right during the presidential campaign when he said that most people don't vote for a candidate based on their economic ideals because they assume they are going to get screwed no matter what so they stick to local things like guns and God and things that directly effect them.

If Joe Bob has a job, the stock market is doing pretty well and he sees that the unemployment rate is dropping, that is really all he cares about when it comes to the economy. Sure, there are a lot of people who do care and understand more about the economy, but most people don't.

Just listen to people who are interviewed on the street. Howard Stern did a great bit during the election where he sent one of his guys to Harlem to interview voters. As you can imagine, they were a very pro-Obama crowd. He asked them if they agreed with Obama on these issues. He then proceeded to read the people McCain's stance on those issues. It was amazing! Almost all of them agreed with everything the guy said, not knowing it was McCain they were agreeing with. Do you really think people like that need a whole lot of encouragement to vote one way or the other?

PornMD

For some reason, this reminds me of the South Park World of Warcraft episode. The boys keep getting killed by a complete loser with no life who has built up a godly character, and are on the verge of quitting the game because it's no longer fun. So they in turn become complete losers, build up their experience for weeks doing nothing but sit at home playing, etc. They ultimately finally beat him, and they're like "What do we do now?" Cartman says "Now we can actually play the game" and all of them completely fat, pimply losers end up sitting there like complete drones continuing to play it.

I feel like this health care bill has had the same effect on Obama/his presidency as WoW had on the South Park kids. He focused on the wrong thing IMO.

__________________

kane

I guess you are correct. I don't fully understand the bills. I live in an uber-liberal state so there has been no word of anything like that around here.

So basically these bills would be saying that people could take advantage of the Obamacare plan, but if they chose not too, they couldn't be fined?

kane

That is a good analogy.

Will we all get free Hot Pockets now?

The Demon

Which unfortunately will be one of this country's downfalls.

Unfortunately there are many factors that contribute to economic collapse, and Joe Bob's life isn't one of them. Spending is decreasing, people are slowly starting to pay off their debts, regardless of the bullshit stimulus programs. Furthermore, Joe Bob doesn't have any say in what the foreign countries who own us, will do.

Not sure if you're saying most of the country is pro Obama, because every single poll you find will say the exact opposite. I would prefer McCain for war, and Obama for peace, although it looks like Obama is making a hell out of peace.

__________________
Greed is Good

marketsmart

i just hope that people will start to wake up and start voting congress out of office..

i would rather have a house and senate filled with new blood that has no idea how anything works then the corrupt old fucks we have in there now..

both sides just sit back and argue just for the sake of arguing...

meanwhile both sides of the aisle just keep lining their pockets...





...

kane

Not too long ago I said to a friend of mine, "The people of this country will be its downfall." Sadly I think I am correct.


Which further leads to Joe Bob being easily convinced to vote fora candidate. If Joe Bob got fucked over during the recession or knew friends that did (IE lost their jobs etc) due to no fault of their own, he might be more likely to vote for a candidate that says, "I will protect the working man from the greed of Wall Street." You don't need to give Joe Bob a speech in economics, debt management, deficit spending or anything like that. You just have to convince him he will not get fucked over.



No, I am not saying the country is pro-Obama. I am saying that people vote for a candidate for a lot of reasons and many people support a candidate and don't know anything about them or what they really believe in or support. Most people are easily manipulated. This is part of the reason I think Obama will win re-election. The guy is a hell of a speaker and he is very convincing. Many people don't need hard facts, they just need to be told what is happening and they buy it.

theking

I think that the first thing to happen will be law suits filed by states...businesses...and individuals...tying up some of the major parts of the bill in the courts along with injunctions preventing implementation...for the next several years.

__________________
When you're running down my country hoss...you're walking on the fighting side of me!

FOR THE LYING LOWLIFE POSTING AS PATHFINDER...https://gfy.com/fucking-around-and-pr...athfinder.html

Rangermoore

Winner Winner Chicken Dinner....

kane

This never really crossed my mind, but you are correct. This fight will be fought on multiple fronts and should drag out for a while. Hell, if Obama wins a second term they might be able to hold much of it off until after his second term to see if they can win the white house back and shut it all down.

Joshua G

the next 2 election cycles will be decided by the direction of the job market.