Proof that Confessed WAR CRIMINAL G.W. Bush executed an innocent man... - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cykoe6

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Have you read the new book by G.W. Bush where he ADMITS TO WAR CRIMES?

It's a fact - deal with it.

Vendzilla · 11-14-2010, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

When did I insult you? When you lower yourself to the same kind of tactics the terrorists themselves use, you are really no better. this is just common sense. the US wants to be an example to the rest of the world, it should act like one.

and really, if it weren't for politics i bet a lot of the people who bicker back and forth would get along.

You called my thinking that of a terrorist
As far as getting along with people, I only call people names that's only debate is to sink to insults and name calling, ignorant shit heads like YOU. I get along just fine with liberal people, but those with some reasoning and sense of decorum

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

Have you read the new book by G.W. Bush where he ADMITS TO WAR CRIMES?

It's a fact - deal with it.

LMAO, You bought GW's book and read it?

I didn't know you could read!

BlackCrayon · 11-14-2010, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You called my thinking that of a terrorist
As far as getting along with people, I only call people names that's only debate is to sink to insults and name calling, ignorant shit heads like YOU. I get along just fine with liberal people, but those with some reasoning and sense of decorum

LMAO, You bought GW's book and read it?

I didn't know you could read!

Whatever. Keep being a baby.

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:27 PM

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:29 PM

cykoe6 · 11-14-2010, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

Have you read the new book by G.W. Bush where he ADMITS TO WAR CRIMES?

It's a fact - deal with it.

It is a FACT that he admits to approving waterboarding of captured enemy combatants.

It is your OPINION that this action constitutes "war crimes".

You see the difference?

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cykoe6

It is a FACT that he admits to approving waterboarding of captured enemy combatants.

It is your OPINION that this action constitutes "war crimes".

You see the difference?

WOW really dude??? You really want to make it this easy for me to utterly destroy your pathetic logic?

From Wiki:
Waterboarding is a form of torture that consists of immobilizing the subject on his/her back with the head inclined downwards. Water is then poured over the face into breathing passages, thus triggering the mammalian diving reflex causing the captive to experience the sensations of drowning.[1][2] In contrast to submerging the head face-forward in water, waterboarding precipitates an almost immediate gag reflex.[3] It can cause extreme pain, dry drowning, damage to lungs, brain damage from oxygen deprivation, other physical injuries including broken bones due to struggling against restraints, lasting psychological damage and, if uninterrupted, death.[4] Adverse physical consequences can manifest themselves months after the event, while psychological effects can last for years.[5] The term waterboarding was coined in 2004.[6][7]

Classification as torture

Waterboarding is considered to be torture by a wide range of authorities, including legal experts,[4][34][35] politicians, war veterans,[36][37] intelligence officials,[38] military judges,[39] and human rights organizations.[22][40] David Miliband, then United Kingdom Foreign Secretary, described it as torture on 19 July 2008, and stated "the UK unreservedly condemns the use of torture."[41] Arguments have been put forward that it might not be torture in all cases, or that it is unclear.[17][42][43][44] The U.S. State Department has recognized "submersion of the head in water" as torture in other circumstances, for example, in its 2005 Country Report on Tunisia.[45]
The United Nations' Report of the Committee Against Torture: Thirty-fifth Session of November 2006, stated that state parties should rescind any interrogation techniques, such as waterboarding, that constitutes torture or cruel, inhuman, or degrading treatment or punishment.[46]

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:37 PM

Legality

International law
All nations that are signatory to the United Nations Convention Against Torture have agreed they are subject to the explicit prohibition on torture under any condition. This was affirmed by Saadi v. Italy in which the European Court of Human Rights, on 28 February 2008, upheld the absolute nature of the torture ban by ruling that international law permits no exceptions to it.[168][169] The treaty states "No exceptional circumstances whatsoever, whether a state of war or a threat of war, internal political instability or any other public emergency, may be invoked as a justification of torture".[170] Additionally, signatories of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights are bound to Article 5, which states, "No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment".[171] Many signatories of the convention have made specific declarations and reservations regarding the interpretation of the term "torture" and restricted the jurisdiction of its enforcement.[172] However, UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Louise Arbour, stated on the subject "I would have no problems with describing this practice as falling under the prohibition of torture", and that violators of the UN Convention Against Torture should be prosecuted under the principle of universal jurisdiction.[173]

United States law
The United States Supreme Court in Sosa v. Alvarez-Machain, said that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights "does not of its own force impose obligations as a matter of international law."[181] However, the United States has a historical record of regarding water torture as a war crime, and has prosecuted as war criminals individuals for the use of such practices in the past.
In 1947, the United States prosecuted a Japanese civilian who had served in World War II as an interpreter for the Japanese military, Yukio Asano, for "Violation of the Laws and Customs of War," asserting that he "did unlawfully take and convert to his own use Red Cross packages and supplies intended for" prisoners, but, far worse, that he also "did willfully and unlawfully mistreat and torture" prisoners of war. Asano received a sentence of 15 years of hard labor.[115] The charges against Asano included "beating using hands, fists, club; kicking; water torture; burning using cigarettes; strapping on a stretcher head downward."[182] The specifications in the charges with regard to "water torture" consisted of "pouring water up [the] nostrils" of one prisoner, "forcing water into [the] mouths and noses" of two other prisoners, and "forcing water into [the] nose" of a fourth prisoner.[183]

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:42 PM

whats worse is that waterboarding is actually only ONE of MANY forms of illegal torture that Bush approved... Also MANY prisoners DIED while being tortured.

We signed the Geneva Conventions into LAW - that makes it US LAW... Waterboarding is a WAR CRIME - FACT: GW BUSH is a WAR CRIMINAL

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

See , this is funny, this guy is so delusional, that he thinks I'm a woman.
For the record, since you don't seem the know the difference between a woman and man, or anything else for that matter, the guy in this pic is me. But then you think Obama should be sainted, so this is no surprise

I hope this girl is a family member or this is the creepiest picture I have ever seen.

Vendzilla · 11-14-2010, 12:48 PM

Fact you're an idiot.

Vendzilla · 11-14-2010, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

I hope this girl is a family member or this is the creepiest picture I have ever seen.

You just help being a moron can you?

cykoe6 · 11-14-2010, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

Arguments have been put forward that it might not be torture in all cases, or that it is unclear.[17][42][43][44]

Your own quote makes my point for me. Thanks.

Personally I support water boarding captured enemy combatants if necessary to save US lives just like I support the fire bombings of Tokyo and Dresden as necessary decisions made in the course of a total war. However, unlike you, I am able understand that there are legitimate arguments to be made on both sides of these issues.

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cykoe6

Your own quote makes my point for me. Thanks.

Personally I support water boarding captured enemy combatants if necessary to save US lives just like I support the fire bombings of Tokyo and Dresden as necessary decisions made in the course of a total war. However, unlike you, I am able understand that there are legitimate arguments to be made on both sides of these issues.

haha you got it wrong pal - those arguments (that it's not torture in all cases) have been thoroughly repudiated and there is now very widespread consensus that the waterboarding of detainees at the command of Bush was indeed torture by all definitions.

Vendzilla · 11-14-2010, 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

haha you got it wrong pal - those arguments (that it's not torture in all cases) have been thoroughly repudiated and there is now very widespread consensus that the waterboarding of detainees at the command of Bush was indeed torture by all definitions.

And you have what to reference for that?

cykoe6 · 11-14-2010, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

those arguments (that it's not torture in all cases) have been thoroughly repudiated and there is now very widespread consensus that the waterboarding of detainees at the command of Bush was indeed torture by all definitions.

I have no doubt that there is a widespread consensus on Huffpo and DU but that does not mean the issue is settled. There are obviously plenty of people who disagree, including plenty of international and US law experts (including the lawyers who approved the procedure in the first place).

theking · 11-14-2010, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

Vendzilla and people like her are so despicable it makes my skin crawl. This is the USA you crazy cunt - we used to hold ourselves to the RULE OF LAW - but we have lost that and we have lost all credibility of being a JUST and FAIR Nation by breaking the Geneva Conventions by torturing and murdering prisoners. Since when do we have the right to deem a HUMAN BEING unworthy of any rights what-so-ever? No charges filed. No trial. Just TORTURE.

The Cheney/Bush Crime Regime has destroyed the reputation and standing in the world community and until there is something done about it we will never get it back. But of course you FOX News Brainwash victims don't travel or even leave your redneck counties so why would you give a fuck right?

want to read a little but about how far criminal and rouge this Government went:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/propublica/a...act30May05.pdf

According to the May 30, 2005 Bradbury memo, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was waterboarded 183 times in March 2003 and Abu Zubaydah was waterboarded 83 times in August 2002.

On page 37 of the OLC memo, in a passage discussing the differences between SERE techniques and the torture used with detainees, the memo explains:

The CIA used the waterboard "at least 83 times during August 2002" in the interrogation of Zubaydah. IG Report at 90, and 183 times during March 2003 in the interrogation of KSM, see id. at 91.

Note, the information comes from the CIA IG report which, in the case of Abu Zubaydah, is based on having viewed the torture tapes as well as other materials. So this is presumably a number that was once backed up by video evidence.

The same OLC memo passage explains how the CIA might manage to waterboard these men so many times in one month each (though even with these chilling numbers, the CIA’s math doesn’t add up).

…where authorized, it may be used for two "sessions" per day of up to two hours. During a session, water may be applied up to six times for ten seconds or longer (but never more than 40 seconds). In a 24-hour period, a detainee may be subjected to up to twelve minutes of water appliaction. See id. at 42. Additionally, the waterboard may be used on as many as five days during a 30-day approval period.

So: two two-hour sessions a day, with six applications of the waterboard each = 12 applications in a day. Though to get up to the permitted 12 minutes of waterboarding in a day (with each use of the waterboard limited to 40 seconds), you’d need 18 applications in a day. Assuming you use the larger 18 applications in one 24-hour period, and do 18 applications on five days within a month, you’ve waterboarded 90 times–still just half of what they did to KSM.

The CIA wants you to believe waterboarding is effective. Yet somehow, it took them 183 applications of the waterboard in a one month period to get what they claimed was cooperation out of KSM.

That doesn’t sound very effective to me.

Thousands of military people that have been through SERE training...including myself... have been waterboarded...and it used to be SOP...and may still be.

So...if waterboarding is a crime...then every President since the end of the Korean conflict...which is when the military first began SERE training...has been guilty of committing a crime.

BTW...military academies have used various forms of waterboarding during hazing and may still do so.

SmokeyTheBear · 11-14-2010, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You assume I care about terrorist, I don't,

i never made any such assumption ? would you care to elaborate ? we were discussing people being waterboarded, none of them were convicted of terrorism, therefor using the term "terrorist" would be innacurate to say the least.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

you assume I give a damn about someone that attacked my country

i never made any such assumption and i am not sure who you are talking about ? the vast majority of people who were waterboarded did not attack your country or hurt americans in any way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You assume I think we should have been training them or giving them weapons, I don't.

ok now your fake assumptions are getting out of hand , i never have assumed any of the things you are talking about in any way whatsoever ,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Great thing about this country, I have the right to think that

to think what ? completely inaccurate false statements ? yes i suppose everyone has the right to think hogwash , just seems silly when it is so easily spotted as hogwash, i did not assume or imply in any way any of your statements.

The statement you made was to imply that we don't need to follow the rules but we expect others to follow the rules we don't. It comes across as "do as i say not as i do"

SmokeyTheBear · 11-14-2010, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

Thousands of military people that have been through SERE training...including myself... have been waterboarded...and it used to be SOP...and may still be.

So...if waterboarding is a crime...then every President since the end of the Korean conflict...which is when the military first began SERE training...has been guilty of committing a crime.

BTW...military academies have used various forms of waterboarding during hazing and may still do so.

surely you understand the difference between consent and non-consent ?

rape is the act of sexual contact without consent. otherwise all sex would be rape.

You consented to being waterboarded. surely you can see a difference in consenting to something as opposed to having it forced upon you ?

Vendzilla · 11-14-2010, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

The statement you made was to imply that we don't need to follow the rules but we expect others to follow the rules we don't. It comes across as "do as i say not as i do"

When it comes to combatants, follow the Geneva Convention
When it comes to terrorist, kill them all
But at the same time, we should have never giving any arms to the middle east, any of the countries and we should have not trained them.

You want to stop the wars, go back to where we only get 30% of our oil from foreign countries, back to when they fought with rocks

Does that answer your first post a little more clearly?

theking · 11-14-2010, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

surely you understand the difference between consent and non-consent ?

rape is the act of sexual contact without consent. otherwise all sex would be rape.

You consented to being waterboarded. surely you can see a difference in consenting to something as opposed to having it forced upon you ?

I consented to enter SERE...I did not consent to be waterboarded...but once you enter SERE you are no longer in control of events. I suspected that I would be man handled but I was not aware of the extent of it...and was not aware that I would be waterboarded. The techniques change from time to time and with different cadre...the intensity can vary. The experience was an eye opener...and one that I do not want to repeat. Some have came out with permanent injury.

Naughty-Pages · 11-14-2010, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cykoe6

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

He committed numerous war crimes.. what else should he call it?? (even by his own admission he has said he committed war crimes.) He violated numerous rules of war, he endorsed waterboarding, etc etc.. the list goes on... and we all now know we went to war under false pretenses .. yes we were fooled, but it's probably time to move on... (I mean they have a saying in Texas, fool me once, shame on you. Fool me You can't get fooled again).

will anything ever happen about it? of course not..

theking · 11-14-2010, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naughty-Pages

He committed numerous war crimes.. what else should he call it?? (even by his own admission he has said he committed war crimes.) He violated numerous rules of war, he endorsed waterboarding, etc etc.. the list goes on... and we all now know we went to war under false pretenses .. yes we were fooled, but it's probably time to move on... (I mean they have a saying in Texas, fool me once, shame on you. Fool me You can't get fooled again).

will anything ever happen about it? of course not..

As I pointed out above...if waterboarding is a crime then every President since the end of the Korean conflict is guilty of that crime.

The Demon · 11-14-2010, 03:57 PM

Gotta love the liberal morons on this forum. They always make me happy knowing I'm not them. On another note, slutboat makes me question the usefulness of the welfare system.

scottybuzz · 11-14-2010, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

he would be jailed and sent to the Hague for war crimes. This is not my opinion this is a fact. Bush and Cheney are stuck in the US for life.

well obviously its not fact if its in the future u stupid retard
.
go to a vet and get yourself put down

SmokeyTheBear · 11-14-2010, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

When it comes to combatants, follow the Geneva Convention
When it comes to terrorist, kill them all

easy statement to say, but who decides who is a terrorist ? and please explain how these people were not combatants and were terrorists ? proof is decided in a court of law. Why have laws at all if you only use them when it appeals to you ?

I think we all agree that terrorists are scumbags who should be locked away forever, the difference is i happen to think there should be some method to distinguish between a terrorist and a non-terrorist , and funnily enough , there is this thing called law and the legal system designed specifically for this purpose, many people including international laws agree we should use it. If you don't use the law to convict someone , how do you know they are really a terrorist ? Should we just trust the government ? If this is a better way to deal with criminals , why do we have a legal system at all , shouldn't we just trust the government 100% and lockup everyone for whatever they say and for however long they say ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

You want to stop the wars, go back to where we only get 30% of our oil from foreign countries, back to when they fought with rocks

is that a question or a comment ? i'm not sure i follow.. if we want to stop wars we should go back to some previous point where there was wars ? not sure how that helps , there has always been wars, not sure what either have to do with the topic ..

The way to stop wars is to stop killing people.

BlackCrayon · 11-14-2010, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

easy statement to say, but who decides who is a terrorist ? and please explain how these people were not combatants and were terrorists ? proof is decided in a court of law. Why have laws at all if you only use them when it appeals to you ?

I think we all agree that terrorists are scumbags who should be locked away forever, the difference is i happen to think there should be some method to distinguish between a terrorist and a non-terrorist , and funnily enough , there is this thing called law and the legal system designed specifically for this purpose, many people including international laws agree we should use it. If you don't use the law to convict someone , how do you know they are really a terrorist ? Should we just trust the government ? If this is a better way to deal with criminals , why do we have a legal system at all , shouldn't we just trust the government 100% and lockup everyone for whatever they say and for however long they say ?

is that a question or a comment ? i'm not sure i follow.. if we want to stop wars we should go back to some previous point where there was wars ? not sure how that helps , there has always been wars, not sure what either have to do with the topic ..

The way to stop wars is to stop killing people.

vendzilla does not want to be questioned. he lives in a world of black and white where his truth is gods truth. like you said, many in gitmo are only suspected of terrorist connections, never actually did anything or charged with anything. there is a reason why they keep it off US land..they don't comply with the laws. i guess vendzilla not only supports the locking up of people for years without being charged for a single crime, being beaten or worse. in vendzilla's mind, everyone in gitmo is a terrorist who should be killed. it shows how little he knows.

SmokeyTheBear · 11-14-2010, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

I consented to enter SERE...I did not consent to be waterboarded...but once you enter SERE you are no longer in control of events.

so in a nutshell you consented to be part of a program that may include waterboarding or other forms of torture, the difference is these people did not consent to be part of any programs that included torture.

Either way it is an insane analogy to say waterboarding prisoners is the same as waterboarding trainees, and i would highly doubt the veracity of any claims that if you did not consent to waterboarding you would have been subject to it anyways. Were you aware of what was going to take place at any time before being strapped in ? Were you given the oportunity to stop the procedure at any point ? I would very highly doubt you answer no to either of those questions.

Vendzilla · 11-14-2010, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

easy statement to say, but who decides who is a terrorist ? and please explain how these people were not combatants and were terrorists ? proof is decided in a court of law. Why have laws at all if you only use them when it appeals to you ?

Military court,
We have hate crime laws, I say that if you kill someone, you probably hate them, why adding the title of hate crime is a difference, but it makes some people feel better.

Quote:

I think we all agree that terrorists are scumbags who should be locked away forever, the difference is i happen to think there should be some method to distinguish between a terrorist and a non-terrorist , and funnily enough , there is this thing called law and the legal system designed specifically for this purpose, many people including international laws agree we should use it. If you don't use the law to convict someone , how do you know they are really a terrorist ? Should we just trust the government ? If this is a better way to deal with criminals , why do we have a legal system at all , shouldn't we just trust the government 100% and lockup everyone for whatever they say and for however long they say ?

Locking them up forever and treat them better than they have ever been treated before, nah kill them and send them to to their god

Quote:

is that a question or a comment ? i'm not sure i follow.. if we want to stop wars we should go back to some previous point where there was wars ? not sure how that helps , there has always been wars, not sure what either have to do with the topic ..

The way to stop wars is to stop killing people.

Whats not to understand? We rely too much on foriegn oil, we can change that, it was 30% during Carter's time and that was high enough.

theking · 11-14-2010, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

so in a nutshell you consented to be part of a program that may include waterboarding or other forms of torture, the difference is these people did not consent to be part of any programs that included torture.

Either way it is an insane analogy to say waterboarding prisoners is the same as waterboarding trainees, and i would highly doubt the veracity of any claims that if you did not consent to waterboarding you would have been subject to it anyways. Were you aware of what was going to take place at any time before being strapped in ? Were you given the oportunity to stop the procedure at any point ? I would very highly doubt you answer no to either of those questions.

Yes...I became aware of what could happen...as I was not the first one in my class to be waterboarded...and learned from others what could happen. Not every person was treated to the same identical techniques as they wanted you unprepared as possible.

In my case when I became aware that I indeed was going to be waterboarded...the opt out to avoid it was to sign a piece of propaganda they presented to me. Which in the case of capture by a real enemy would be a violation of the Soldiers Code of Conduct...which is a Court Martial offense...and in this case failing the class.

Since I did not sign...I was physically forced to be waterboarded...as I physically resisted their efforts to waterboard me. The procedure went on for some period of time...until I agreed to sign.

BTW...the waterboarding causes panic...not pain. The most painful thing I experienced was when they beat my stomach open handed until it was not blue but black...and I with stood this procedure without signing. Being repeatedly bitch slapped with an open hand was not pleasant either and my faced swelled up as if I had been stung by a swarm of bees...but I also withstood that as well as the sleep depravation and being strung up for hours...where only the tips of my toes touched the floor.

I actually could have resisted the waterboarding for a longer period of time but I knew that I would eventually sign...so I did not hold out as long as I could have.

The whole experience at SERE is a bad experience...but the thing that I remember the most is not all of the torture techniques but the experience of eating raw turtle meat...during the survival phase of training.

This subject has been covered in a previous thread and there are a few others here that experienced SERE training. Every class is not identical...but similar.

theking · 11-14-2010, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

easy statement to say, but who decides who is a terrorist ? and please explain how these people were not combatants and were terrorists ? proof is decided in a court of law. Why have laws at all if you only use them when it appeals to you ?

I think we all agree that terrorists are scumbags who should be locked away forever, the difference is i happen to think there should be some method to distinguish between a terrorist and a non-terrorist , and funnily enough , there is this thing called law and the legal system designed specifically for this purpose, many people including international laws agree we should use it. If you don't use the law to convict someone , how do you know they are really a terrorist ? Should we just trust the government ? If this is a better way to deal with criminals , why do we have a legal system at all , shouldn't we just trust the government 100% and lockup everyone for whatever they say and for however long they say ?

is that a question or a comment ? i'm not sure i follow.. if we want to stop wars we should go back to some previous point where there was wars ? not sure how that helps , there has always been wars, not sure what either have to do with the topic ..

The way to stop wars is to stop killing people.

There was and still is an easy out to hold them without trial and that was and is to declare them to be POW's. POW's can be held for the duration of a conflict so in the case of "terrorism" this would be virtually until hell freezes over. I do not really understand why they chose to classify them as "enemy combatants" instead of POW's...but I suppose it is because they wanted to try them by Military Tribunal and put them to death...which cannot be done with POW's. POW's can only be held in confinement during the length of the conflict.

Flynn · 11-14-2010, 07:19 PM

Lean forward bruddy

Slutboat · 11-14-2010, 07:40 PM

To those who endured SERE training my hat goes off to you and I thank you for your service to this nation.

However I do wonder if there is much similarity between military training and the actual torture of being waterboarded 183 times in a single month as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was subjected to.

I'm sure the durations and severity were far worse than anything SERE would ever impose on our troops.

Argos88 · 11-15-2010, 12:06 AM

Completely agree that BUSH had a NAZI profile and the world is better without him.

That's for sure.

Bush has been the biggest Dictator and MASS MURDERER of the western hemisphere in the last 50 years.

.

Sabby · 11-15-2010, 12:25 AM

i think when you are US pres... its your duty...... to flush...

alot..

of...

SHIT...

down the toilet..

my posts are always funny (when not edited).

Sabby

cykoe6 · 11-15-2010, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Argos88

Bush has been the biggest Dictator and MASS MURDERER of the western hemisphere in the last 50 years.

Uhhhhhhh what about LBJ in Vietnam????

Quote:

The war exacted a huge human cost in terms of fatalities, including 3 to 4 million Vietnamese from both sides, between 1.5 to 2 million Laotians and Cambodians, and 58,159 U.S. soldiers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_war

The Demon · 11-15-2010, 08:57 AM

I'm glad these retarded posts of extremism and exaggeration are confined to a porn forum and nothing else lol.

SmokeyTheBear · 11-15-2010, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Military court,
We have hate crime laws, I say that if you kill someone, you probably hate them, why adding the title of hate crime is a difference, but it makes some people feel better.

you completely missed the entire point but at least you agree they should b tried before a court system. The huge problem is the people waterboarded were not found guilty in civilian court OR military court. You seem to miss a few steps in procedure these details are important. You find someone guilty THEN you punish them not the other way around.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Locking them up forever and treat them better than they have ever been treated before, nah kill them and send them to to their god

again you completely miss the point, the punishment has nothing to do with the problem. Killing someone is hardly punishment. What you fail to realise is most people aren't opposed to torture or killing terrorists, fill up their rectums with goat testicles , i could care less, chop off their hands and feet whatever .. the point is FOLLOW THE DAMN LAWS

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla

Whats not to understand? We rely too much on foriegn oil, we can change that, it was 30% during Carter's time and that was high enough.

the part thats hard to understand is how you equate 30% reliance on outside oil to no wars, there was plenty of wars during the carter administration. so your statement of if we don't want wars we should go to a time when we relied on 30% oil and there was lots of wars makes no sense.

_Richard_ · 11-15-2010, 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minicivan

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101111/..._execution_dna

"In the nearly 35 years since capital punishment was reinstated in the U.S., there has never been a case in which someone was definitively proven innocent after being executed."

haha that's such a joke

BlackCrayon · 11-16-2010, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Richard_

haha that's such a joke

it could be true. after all once the guy is executed, there is no more investigating done so no new evidence would be found to realize he may be innocent.

BlackCrayon · 11-16-2010, 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Demon

I'm glad these retarded posts of extremism and exaggeration are confined to a porn forum and nothing else lol.

political boards are "segregated" so you never have to worry about running into an opossing opinion. its pretty funny. a bunch of people with sore necks from agreeing with each other so much.

BlackCrayon · 11-16-2010, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SmokeyTheBear

you completely missed the entire point but at least you agree they should b tried before a court system. The huge problem is the people waterboarded were not found guilty in civilian court OR military court. You seem to miss a few steps in procedure these details are important. You find someone guilty THEN you punish them not the other way around.

again you completely miss the point, the punishment has nothing to do with the problem. Killing someone is hardly punishment. What you fail to realise is most people aren't opposed to torture or killing terrorists, fill up their rectums with goat testicles , i could care less, chop off their hands and feet whatever .. the point is FOLLOW THE DAMN LAWS

the part thats hard to understand is how you equate 30% reliance on outside oil to no wars, there was plenty of wars during the carter administration. so your statement of if we don't want wars we should go to a time when we relied on 30% oil and there was lots of wars makes no sense.

vendzilla will never realize this. he tries to act too hard to see the common sense right before his eyes. sure, it would be nice to shoot first and ask questions later but that is not what a civilized society does. he gets all defensive saying i said his thinking is that of a terrorist, well when you think you have the right to strike back by any means when you have been struck, yeah that is how a terrorist thinks. sorry. he just gets all butthurt instead of seeing how hypocritical he is. the sad thing is that he doesn't seem to care if they are innocent or guilty, as long as they represent that symbol that he hates so much and wants to destroy.

Slutboat · 11-16-2010, 06:13 AM

its really just gullibility, these people need someone to hate and fear - FOX News tells them to hate all Muslims and they believe it. Small minds need to hate and they are giving their marching orders from the higher ups...who are they to question their orders?

baddog · 11-16-2010, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

Here some info for you pathetic Fox Robots

http://www.motherearth.org/bushwanted/laws.php

Even wiki makes it clear that he is guilty:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes

moron x5

jezebelz · 11-16-2010, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

.....However I do wonder if there is much similarity between military training and the actual torture of being waterboarded 183 times in a single month as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was subjected to.

You failed to mention that the water boarding of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was effective, not to mention the positive outcome of it. By his own admission, the fact that we water boarded him allowed him to give us information without betraying his religious faith. That information in turn saved lives..millions of them. Information we would have never gained if it hadn't been for techniques such as water boarding. To say this guy was "innocent" well, is just flat out wrong. If you remember a few years back there was a viral video on the net of an American being beheaded. Al Qaeda had it all over their site. That person was Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl. Well, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed admitted he did it.

Quote:

I'm sure the durations and severity were far worse than anything SERE would ever impose on our troops.

I hate to be the one to break it to ya, but radical Islamists torture our troops and our prisoners of war...regularly. Their hatred of us is so deeply rooted alot of times it's for the pure sport of it This has been well documented by the way. Waterboarding is tickling them compared to what they do when one of ours is captured.
All the theories and feel good philosophies about "reasoning" with terrorists are just nice, warm and fuzzy in a theoretical world. In the real world, they aren't practical. It's humorous watching how enamored liberals get at the mere mention of the name G.W. Bush. Historians will eventually document his time in office with far more positives than negatives. This will surely piss off the 20% of the populous that has this never ending hard-on for him.

directfiesta · 11-16-2010, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jezebelz

I hate to be the one to break it to ya, but radical Islamists torture our troops and our prisoners of war...regularly. Their hatred of us is so deeply rooted alot of times it's for the pure sport of it This has been well documented by the way. Waterboarding is tickling them compared to what they do when one of ours is captured.

How about documenting your claims of torture of troops .. regularly ....
And with your thinking, why should they not do it to " extract " information that can give them info that would "... saved lives..millions of them " ....

Slutboat · 11-16-2010, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jezebelz

You failed to mention that the water boarding of Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was effective, not to mention the positive outcome of it. By his own admission, the fact that we water boarded him allowed him to give us information without betraying his religious faith. That information in turn saved lives..millions of them. Information we would have never gained if it hadn't been for techniques such as water boarding. To say this guy was "innocent" well, is just flat out wrong. If you remember a few years back there was a viral video on the net of an American being beheaded. Al Qaeda had it all over their site. That person was Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl. Well, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed admitted he did it.
I hate to be the one to break it to ya, but radical Islamists torture our troops and our prisoners of war...regularly. Their hatred of us is so deeply rooted alot of times it's for the pure sport of it This has been well documented by the way. Waterboarding is tickling them compared to what they do when one of ours is captured.
All the theories and feel good philosophies about "reasoning" with terrorists are just nice, warm and fuzzy in a theoretical world. In the real world, they aren't practical. It's humorous watching how enamored liberals get at the mere mention of the name G.W. Bush. Historians will eventually document his time in office with far more positives than negatives. This will surely piss off the 20% of the populous that has this never ending hard-on for him.

Welcome back fake nick motherfucker - I got your ass banned last time...Now you want to tangle some more you clown? Glad you don't care about ever getting your old nick back (according to the new rules). Have fun starting over with 31 posts.

NOW about your opinion that the torture of prisoners "was effective" and "had a positive outcome" - It's well documented that the torture of prisoners does NOT produced any useful intel - NOT NOW, NOT EVER. The prisoner will say ANYTHING to get the torture to stop.

"Millions" of lives were saved? You have got to be kidding me? You are regurgitating a LIE - it was spread by FOX News... No lives were saved with the intel from KSM. ZERO

Fox News runs with dubious claim that KSM's interrogation thwarted L.A. plot

Fox News hosts and contributors have advanced the assertion that the use of harsh interrogation techniques on Khalid Shaikh Mohammed "stopped an attack on the Library Tower in Los Angeles." But the Bush administration said that the attack was thwarted in February 2002 -- more than a year before Mohammed was captured.
In recent days, several Fox News hosts and contributors have advanced the claim by former Bush speechwriter Marc A. Thiessen that the use of harsh interrogation techniques -- including waterboarding -- on Khalid Shaikh Mohammed "stopped an attack on the Library Tower in Los Angeles." But the claim conflicts with the chronology of events put forth on multiple occasions by the Bush administration, as Slate.com's Timothy Noah has noted. Indeed, the Bush administration said that the Library Tower attack was thwarted in February 2002 -- more than a year before Mohammed was captured in March 2003.
During an interview with Thiessen on the April 17 edition of Fox News' The Live Desk, co-host Rick Folbaum stated, "We haven't had a terror attack since 9-11 here in the United States. Might these techniques have been the reason that we haven't been attacked since then?" Thiessen responded, "It absolutely is. This attack -- this program stopped an attack on the Library Towers in Los Angeles." Neither Folbaum nor co-host Martha MacCallum challenged Thiessen's claim. Later, former federal prosecutor John Flannery said, "[T]he truth is people will say anything when they're tortured, including that the program worked." Thiessen replied, "That's absolutely false. ... The interrogation of Khalid Shaikh Mohammed -- the interrogation of Salid [sic] Shaikh Mohammed led to the capture of a cell of Jemaah Islamiyah terrorists who were planning to hijack a plane and fly it into the Library Tower in Los Angeles. And if it had not been for this program, there would be a hole in the ground in Los Angeles to match the one in New York City."

http://mediamatters.org/research/200904220032

Your are merely restating the LIES that FOX has told you - it's well documented from the ACTUAL INTERROGATORS that torture does not work. AND even if it did - this is the United States of America - are you forgetting that? We signed the Geneva Convention REMEMBER?

This is the USA, WE DO NOT TORTURE - WE are different than the terrorists, we are NOT THE SAME, we believe in the RULE OF LAW, we believe in HUMAN RIGHTS (or we used to). We hold ourselves to a HIGHER STANDARD Even if there are some idiots getting on planes with bombs WE DO NOT TOTURE.

theking · 11-16-2010, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

NOW about your opinion that the torture of prisoners "was effective" and "had a positive outcome" - It's well documented that the torture of prisoners does NOT produced any useful intel - NOT NOW, NOT EVER. The prisoner will say ANYTHING to get the torture to stop.

Your statement of "NOT NOW, NOT EVER" is pigshit.

While it is true that a prisoner may say anything...that is one of the purposes...to get the prisoner to talking. What he says can be interpreted and often verified. The reason that a person would be waterboarded time and time again is because the truth is being separated from lies.

Torture works...as every single American POW...including Senator McCain...that was tortured by the Vietnamese knows. Every single one of them...other than a few that held out until death...submitted to the will of their captors...and signed or did whatever their captors wanted them to say or do.

BestXXXPorn · 11-16-2010, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slutboat

You people are prime examples of what is wrong with this country.

Actually, YOU are a prime example of what's wrong with this country and I think about the entire population of GFY will back me up on this...

All your posts sound like you're an angry mad man. You associate things the way you want, you only see what you want to see, and you constantly berate people on this forum for their opinions and points of view. And by berate I mean just rip on people using whatever language you feel will get your point across but in reality you come off sounding like a complete asshole.

In fact, there is no way, ever... at any point... would I EVER consider doing business with you JUST from your attitude towards others on GFY. Your actions are self defeating and display a complete lack of self control as well as zero ability to process information logically and reasonably.

Slutboat · 11-16-2010, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theking

Your statement of "NOT NOW, NOT EVER" is pigshit.

While it is true that a prisoner may say anything...that is one of the purposes...to get the prisoner to talking. What he says can be interpreted and often verified. The reason that a person would be waterboarded time and time again is because the truth is being separated from lies.

Torture works...as every single American POW...including Senator McCain...that was tortured by the Vietnamese knows. Every single one of them...other than a few that held out until death...submitted to the will of their captors...and signed or did whatever their captors wanted them to say or do.

So lets assume that torture works (it's well documented that it does not produce useful intel - only fabricated stories of what the captor THINKS the interrogators want to hear) But for the sake of conversation, lets say it works... You seem like a patriotic American male - you're "TheKing" (which is odd) from the "Good ol USA"... Do you have any idea the DAMAGE to this nation (the fact that we now disregard international law and torture our prisoners) has done to this country. Do you realize that we have LOST all credibility as being a free and fair and just society in the eyes of the world?

Also let me ask you this - Do you travel internationally? I do - I'm a surfer (actual waves) and every year I travel to Muslim countries to find the best waves - MY LIFE is at risk due to the policies of War Criminal GW Bush. I have been in situations where my life was threatened just for being an American... This is a direct result of the War Crimes being committed at Gitmo.

You right wing cunts have no idea what its like to leave the US and be UNIVERSALLY hated (not feared) by other countries... Most of you guys don't leave your counties let alone country.

11-14-2010, 12:27 PM	#54
Slutboat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,388	__________________ The Slut Boat soon will be making another run The Slut Boat promises something for everyone

11-14-2010, 12:29 PM	#55
Slutboat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,388	__________________ The Slut Boat soon will be making another run The Slut Boat promises something for everyone

11-14-2010, 12:37 PM	#58
Slutboat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,388	Legality International law All nations that are signatory to the United Nations Convention Against Torture have agreed they are subject to the explicit prohibition on torture under any condition. This was affirmed by Saadi v. Italy in which the European Court of Human Rights, on 28 February 2008, upheld the absolute nature of the torture ban by ruling that international law permits no exceptions to it.[168][169] The treaty states "No exceptional circumstances whatsoever, whether a state of war or a threat of war, internal political instability or any other public emergency, may be invoked as a justification of torture".[170] Additionally, signatories of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights are bound to Article 5, which states, "No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment".[171] Many signatories of the convention have made specific declarations and reservations regarding the interpretation of the term "torture" and restricted the jurisdiction of its enforcement.[172] However, UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Louise Arbour, stated on the subject "I would have no problems with describing this practice as falling under the prohibition of torture", and that violators of the UN Convention Against Torture should be prosecuted under the principle of universal jurisdiction.[173] United States law The United States Supreme Court in Sosa v. Alvarez-Machain, said that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights "does not of its own force impose obligations as a matter of international law."[181] However, the United States has a historical record of regarding water torture as a war crime, and has prosecuted as war criminals individuals for the use of such practices in the past. In 1947, the United States prosecuted a Japanese civilian who had served in World War II as an interpreter for the Japanese military, Yukio Asano, for "Violation of the Laws and Customs of War," asserting that he "did unlawfully take and convert to his own use Red Cross packages and supplies intended for" prisoners, but, far worse, that he also "did willfully and unlawfully mistreat and torture" prisoners of war. Asano received a sentence of 15 years of hard labor.[115] The charges against Asano included "beating using hands, fists, club; kicking; water torture; burning using cigarettes; strapping on a stretcher head downward."[182] The specifications in the charges with regard to "water torture" consisted of "pouring water up [the] nostrils" of one prisoner, "forcing water into [the] mouths and noses" of two other prisoners, and "forcing water into [the] nose" of a fourth prisoner.[183] __________________ The Slut Boat soon will be making another run The Slut Boat promises something for everyone Last edited by Slutboat; 11-14-2010 at 12:40 PM..

11-14-2010, 12:42 PM	#59
Slutboat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,388	whats worse is that waterboarding is actually only ONE of MANY forms of illegal torture that Bush approved... Also MANY prisoners DIED while being tortured. We signed the Geneva Conventions into LAW - that makes it US LAW... Waterboarding is a WAR CRIME - FACT: GW BUSH is a WAR CRIMINAL __________________ The Slut Boat soon will be making another run The Slut Boat promises something for everyone

11-14-2010, 12:48 PM	#61
Vendzilla Biker Gnome Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: cell#324 Posts: 23,200	Fact you're an idiot. __________________ Webair died? Carbon is not the problem, it makes up 0.041% of our atmosphere , 95% of that is from Volcanos and decomposing plants and stuff. So people in the US are responsible for 13% of the carbon in the atmosphere which 95% is not from Humans, like cars and trucks and stuff and they want to spend trillions to fix it while Solar Panel plants are powered by coal plants think about that

11-14-2010, 03:57 PM	#74
The Demon Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 7,336	Gotta love the liberal morons on this forum. They always make me happy knowing I'm not them. On another note, slutboat makes me question the usefulness of the welfare system. __________________ Greed is Good

11-14-2010, 07:19 PM	#82
Flynn pr0's goat screwed me Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Seattle Posts: 2,083	Lean forward bruddy __________________ blah blah blah

11-14-2010, 07:40 PM	#83
Slutboat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,388	To those who endured SERE training my hat goes off to you and I thank you for your service to this nation. However I do wonder if there is much similarity between military training and the actual torture of being waterboarded 183 times in a single month as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed was subjected to. I'm sure the durations and severity were far worse than anything SERE would ever impose on our troops. __________________ The Slut Boat soon will be making another run The Slut Boat promises something for everyone

11-15-2010, 12:06 AM	#84
Argos88 So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 1,732	Completely agree that BUSH had a NAZI profile and the world is better without him. That's for sure. Bush has been the biggest Dictator and MASS MURDERER of the western hemisphere in the last 50 years. .

11-15-2010, 12:25 AM	#85
Sabby Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 2,888	i think when you are US pres... its your duty...... to flush... alot.. of... SHIT... down the toilet.. my posts are always funny (when not edited). Sabby __________________ Fuck off

11-15-2010, 08:57 AM	#87
The Demon Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 7,336	I'm glad these retarded posts of extremism and exaggeration are confined to a porn forum and nothing else lol. __________________ Greed is Good

11-16-2010, 06:13 AM	#93
Slutboat Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,388	its really just gullibility, these people need someone to hate and fear - FOX News tells them to hate all Muslims and they believe it. Small minds need to hate and they are giving their marching orders from the higher ups...who are they to question their orders? __________________ The Slut Boat soon will be making another run The Slut Boat promises something for everyone